Latest from Boris

[flecc]

Our new Mayor of London now wants to allow motorcycles in bus lanes as well as bicycles. Already 3000 cyclists have signed a petition against this and it will be presented next week, saying it's a dangerous mix due to motorcycle speeds.

That's my view as well, but what do you think?

[john]

This isn't really answering your question, but....

I was wondering what it is like cycling in bus lanes. I haven't needed to do this very often but when I do come across a bus I try to keep well away from it as I do with lorries.

[flecc]

Originally Posted by john

This isn't really answering your question, but....

I was wondering what it is like cycling in bus lanes. I haven't needed to do this very often but when I do come across a bus I try to keep well away from it as I do with lorries.

I'm happy with it John, and the bus drivers seem happy also. That's probably partly due to the bus stops being very closely spaced in much of the area where I cycle, so they don't get up much speed between them anyway.

I've also got cases where there's a cycle lane between the bus lane on the left and other traffic lanes on the right. I know these scare the hell out of many cyclists, but I think as long as one stays cool they aren't a problem. Where those are they have to be used instead of the bus lane and bus drivers sometimes hang back rather than pass on the inside, but I always give them a left hand wave-through so as not to hold them up, being a firm believer in public transport priority over private road users.

The problem I see with motorcycles in the bus lane is the speeds some use in town, and I think there's plenty of possibilities of cyclist/motorcyclist collisions, especially since few cyclists have mirrors. Having been a lifelong motorcyclist myself, I know how suddenly 50/60 mph or more is available in quick throttle squirts between points, a dodgy mix with bikes doing 15 mph and less in a restricted lane width.
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[HarryB]

Originally Posted by flecc

Our new Mayor of London now wants to allow motorcycles in bus lanes as well as bicycles. Already 3000 cyclists have signed a petition against this and it will be presented next week, saying it's a dangerous mix due to motorcycle speeds.

That's my view as well, but what do you think?

This issue has been around a while and Ken Livingstone dismissed the idea. The selfish side of me says no but I have to accept that all the trials say it has proved a safe mix, even safer overall than them not using them. You cannot argue with that except Ken Livingstone said the trials in London were flawed (but they seem to work elsewhere in Bristol etc). I suppose we should consider the safety of motorcyclists as well.

In general I find motorcyclist very selfish in London with more than 90% deliberately moving into the advanced stop lanes and thus making it less safe for us. The other negative side is it does remove the advantage we have (as I heard a few motorcyclists at work discuss) and thus encouraging more onto the road.

[flecc]

Yes, the trials have indicated it's safe Hal. I'm just nervous that with an open season with all motorcyclists aware of the free access, that could change.

We're all agreed about the unsafe nature of the huge speed differential of cars and bicycles on trunk roads, and I don't want that same risk in bus lanes. At least when they're mixed in with other traffic the bikers are constrained to some extent, being regularly slowed.
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[HarryB]

Personally I would like to see Taxis banned from bus lanes as well. For the life of me I cannot see why one person using personal transport should be given an advantage over other drivers. They are often the worst at trying to run you out of a bus lane as well. But then again I would replace bus lanes with high occupancy lanes as we are wasting hundreds of miles of roads in this country at the moment (except for the very centre of London as that is gridlocked with buses anyway). Sorry being Londoncentric again.

[flecc]

I certainly agree about banning the taxis from bus lanes, as you say that's just another private use, often with just as inefficient a use of space as a private car and much less safe for cyclists.

Having suffered ferrying others into work at times in the past, I'm not too enamoured of the multi-occupancy idea. With some passengers I'd rather be in a separate taxi style driving compartment, and the usual private car can be like a prison cell when stuck with some people.
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[Chris_Bike]

Originally Posted by flecc

I certainly agree about banning the taxis from bus lanes, as you say that's just another private use, often with just as inefficient a use of space as a private car and much less safe for cyclists.
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I disagree. taxis are a form (allbeit expensive) of public transport. It is far preferable that several thousand rich businessmen (and others) use a pool of taxis rather than have their chaufeurs/cars clogging up the city.

On the subject of Boris, in my view he's a buffoon, which can be amusing, but is not conducive to running what is arguably the most important capital city in Europe.

[keithhazel]

Originally Posted by Chris_Bike

On the subject of Boris, in my view he's a buffoon,.

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careful what you say or you will have buffoons sueing you slander and defamation of character

[frank9755]

Originally Posted by flecc

I'm happy with it John, and the bus drivers seem happy also. That's probably partly due to the bus stops being very closely spaced in much of the area where I cycle, so they don't get up much speed between them anyway.

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My experience is that most bus drivers are pretty considerate and will normally wait to let you finish overtaking before they pull out from a stop.
You do get the odd cyclist-hater who will accelerate to overtake then cut in to their stop in front of you, forcing you to carry out an unnecessary overtake from a standing start.

The worst things though are the bendy-buses. They are the most frightening vehicle on the road because they are so long. When one overtakes it feels like it is never coming to an end. I have been forced off the road a couple of times by bendy buses pulling in to a stop. I don't think it is the that the driver means to be hostile, just their vehicle is so unwieldy.

Back to the main topic, I signed the petition against motorcycles in bus lanes because I read the view on the CTC site which says that motorbikes are...

"Dangerous to themselves and to others. Motorcyclists place not only themselves at risk, but they are also disproportionately hazardous to pedestrians' and cyclists' safety as well. Per mile travelled, PTWs are about 1.5 as likely as cars to be involved in collisions which cause serious injury to cyclists, twice as likely to be involved in causing them serious injuries and about three times as likely to be involved in killing them"

Frank