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[flecc]

Or en-cycle-opedia maybe? I think not though, for every one thing I know, there's an almost infinite number of things I don't.

[Jonathan1]

Hi,
this is a belated post to the itro thread. Have got Urban Mover 36 bike from Honeyfield Trailers (dealer) in Bristol Very please with it generally. See soon to be written review for more details.

Am riding daily to work, return journey of 7 miles, and getting 3 days between charges.

Jonathan Lord

[halfmedley]

Hi to everyone and here's to an electrically assisted 2007! I've been mulling over the idea of buying an electric bike for a while now, and am ready to take the plunge. Have tried a Lafree and Suede, but wasn't overly impressed by Giant's lack of backup and the dealers seemed vague too. The Ezee Torq seems a good machine in terms of technology, price and backup though I've not ridden one. I'm slightly concerned about hints on this site about it's hill-climbing ability as this is my main reason for purchasing an e-bike. Will the Torq do the job? I want to use one for my every day commute to work in surprisingly hilly Birmingham. Also, what's the score on using electric bikes in wet weather? Thanks in advance to anyone who cares to reply!

[halfmedley]

Hi to everyone and here's to an electrically assisted 2007! I've been mulling over the idea of buying an electric bike for a while now, and am ready to take the plunge. Have tried a Lafree and Suede, but wasn't overly impressed by Giant's lack of backup and the dealers seemed vague too. The Ezee Torq seems a good machine in terms of technology, price and backup though I've not ridden one. I'm slightly concerned about hints on this site about it's hill-climbing ability as this is my main reason for purchasing an e-bike. Will the Torq do the job? Any other brands worth considering? I want to use one for my every day commute to work in surprisingly hilly Birmingham. Also, what's the score on using electric bikes in wet weather? Thanks in advance to anyone who cares to reply!

[flecc]

Welcome to the forum halfmedley.

I'm a Torq and Twist owner and the fact is that the Torq is not geared for climbing real hills. Basically it's a powerful bike, but stuck in top gear. On slopes up to about 1 in 15 (7%) it's fine and a fast climber. Beyond that steepness is where the problems start.

The motor is geared 50% higher than most hub motor bikes, and the derailleur is the same. You may have seen my mentions of these elsewhere, but both of these facts mean it's not the right choice if you are going to tackle hills from 1 in 10 or steeper. I'm able to ride the short bit of 1 in 8 up to my home by standing on the pedals and keeping it at 12 mph or more to keep the motor in it's power band, but wouldn't want to ride a longer 1 in 8 stretch.

To give some technicalities which could help if you have bike experience already. The twist with a 3 speed hub is geared like most ordinary bikes:

bottom gear: 43", middle: 58", top: 79"

The Torq's lowest gear is 58", in other words it's got nothing below a middle gear for hill climbing. In electric terms, the motor is geared even higher.

If you get a bike with external cable joins like the eZee models and intend to ride in the wet, it's essential to pre-waterproof it. You'll find details on my Torq Website.

[Jaytee]

Hi halfmedley,

I am a Torq owner and have been for the last two months. I live in North Somerset, quite a hilly area and in my 70's and clearly not as fit as you! Fleccs response is very factual and worth a lot as he has several e-bikes for comparison. I can only say that my Torq has no problems with any of the hills around here, PROVIDED you are prepared to give pedal assistance. Yes, you can rely on E-power alone and it is still amazing for relatively short range. Give it some pedal assist and I have not found a hill yet in the Bath area that the Torq will not climb. There are modifications that will make it even better, (see Fleccs other website for details), but I believe the Torq offers now a pretty good compromise for all the various parameters that have to be considered.

[halfmedley]

Hi Jaytee & Flecc,

Thanks for responding, now I'm really confused! Hmm...Not sure if I follow all the detail of Flecc's message but if my understanding of it is correct then it seems the Torq gives less assistance if you start to drop below 12mph? This seems counter-productive, surely the point of an e-bike is to give assistance when slogging up hills, ie precisely the point at which the speed drops! But then again Jaytee, you reckon it's not so much of an issue after all, glad you're enjoying the bike! I was hoping that a Torq would make pedalling up a hill seem like pedalling on the flat. Is this possible without modification/further expense like changing the gearing (incidentally could you fit a hub gear?). Perhaps the Ezee Sprint (not currently available) or the Urban Mover 44 might be a better bet for my poor knees?

[Miles Hellon]

halfmedley,

To give a perspective to the kind of power values required:

To travel at 12 mph on the flat (no headwind) only requires about 60 Watts

To travel at 12 mph up a 7% slope you need about 400 Watts....

[flecc]

THe Urban mover doesn't have a very high power motor, the Sprint does and is a good choice of hub motor compromise for your purpose. If you literally mean that your knees already suffer, then really be careful in your choice, since high gearing can cause damage to knees that are vulnerable.

I don't know if you have car driving experience, but if you have, you'll know what happens if your car is left in top gear. It will fly up a main road slope that it's capable of at a very good speed, but when a hill is just a bit too steep, the speed suddenly collapses if you don't change down. The point at which the speed slumps is below the maximum torque revs on the rev counter, around 3000 to 4000 revs on most modern cars. The Torq's equivalent of that point is at 12 mph, below that the power slumps rapidly. The further the speed drops, the more the power drops 'til you come to a juddering halt.

The only way to make up for that is with your fitness and cycling ability, and that we can't judge, hence our always saying a trial is best on the sort of hills you're likely to climb. Clearly Jaytee is a very fit rider, those hills around Bath are no mean climbs and I envy his ability, but he's also very clearly in a minority in the older population. Where you are between Jaytee and Homer Simpson I've no idea of course. Trying to get a trial on the Torq and make your own mind up is always the best option. Have a word with 50cycles and see if they can recommend a trial for you where there's some hills. If you're able to get to the South Croydon area, try mine with both NiMh and Li-ion batteries. I've plenty of hills for you to try. I've also got the Quando which uses the Torq motor geared for maximum pulling power at 8.6 mph and that will enable you to see the difference that makes.

[halfmedley]

Thanks for the offer of a go on your bikes Flecc, and thanks for all the advice from everyone, plenty of food for thought there. What a good forum this is! This e-bike business is more complicated than I thought! Back to the drawing board.