Battery. Broken Plastic.

[Tinker]

I've just rescued a Phyllion XH 370-10 battery. It's apparently from a bike that was on a rear rack on a Motor home which reversed into a tree.
The bike motor etc have long gone but the batt was heading for a skip 'till I saw it.
Question. Where can I read up or find info about the wiring & BMS ?
I recall a thread on the broken plastic lid/handle some time ago but cannot find it now.
It seems the damage was mainly to the bike as the wheel + motor was undamaged and someone has applies tape to the exposed wire where the fuse(s) were but I'd like to see if it could be saved as apparently it's fairly new.
Any ideas or guidance most welcome.

 

[Mussels]

You can get plastic weld from modelling shops, it's a solvent that melts the two edges and then you press them together. It won't stop parts bending but should hold a plate made from another piece of plastic over the hole to make a strong fix.
I have no idea about the wiring, can you not see how it was wired before?

 

[banbury frank]

Hi If you post some photos I am sure you will get some useful advice

Frank

 

[flecc]

The Phylion XH 370-10 battery has gone through various changes over time. so without knowing what series it is, it's impossible to be specific.

I have a webpage on my Torq site giving plenty of detail about an early form of that battery used at one time by eZee:

Phylion XH 370-10 Li-ion battery internals

 

[Tinker]

Here's a couple of pic's out of the aluminum case

I've re-soldered the wire that had come off the key-switch, the other breakage is between the small fuse & charging plug but unfortunately my workshop pencil fairy has borrowed my voltmeter so I cannot take any readings.
However there are lights on the circuit board which came on ( 2 out of 3) when I pressed the switch BUT after stripping off the wreaked broken plastic they won't come on again,
I have a 1.8A Li=ion charger so tried that and the red light comes on to show it's charging & if I press the switch the lights come on but I've go a feeling that the 'board' may have an invisible crack in it as a tiny bit of flex seems to have an effect.
Is that PCB the BMS?. if so can I replace it?

 

[banbury frank]

Hi The PCB you are looking at is the Battery gauge the Bms is Buried inside the battery you cant miss it it will have about 10 to 12 wires if you follow the cable from the charging plug that will connect to the BMS

Frank

 

[Cyclezee]

Hi Tinker,
If it is an empty eZee battery case you want, I can supply a used one for the cost of postage and packing, certainly less than £5.

 

[Tinker]

Thanks for the case offer & the advice.
Whilst I was using the charger the 3 lights on the battery came on when I pressed the button however when I turned charger off only 2 light up.
I jury rigged it to my bike which is set on a bike trainer and it worked OK until I applied a load which I think indicates a BMS problem.
As it's a freebie I (gingerly) sliced through the blue plastic cover and the copious amounts of normal clear sellotape & exposed the BMS.
The battery voltage shows 40v so I'm guessing a cell may be caput. I'll try and get a reading for each one later on

 

[Tinker]

Well probably I've done this the wrong way but each cell reads just over 4v, all were equal so I connected it to my 250watt folder still on the stand firstly with the BMS still attached and it cut out under load then disconnected the BMS where it runs OK. I monitored the voltage and no significant drop over any cells so
I think this means the BMS has a fault cutting power.
Is there anything else I can try? I would like to get some use out of this if possible. I think I can protect against overcharge by using a cycle analyst (which I intend to fit) but how to charge it?

 

[Synthman]

I find it interesting if the battery can operate without the BMS.

My XH370-10J is coming close to 5 years old and needs replacing. It still gives good range but has a nasty habit of cutting out under load, particularly on hills and during cold weather. The BMS shuts the battery down, and I have to stop the bike and unplug the battery briefly to get it to work. If I unplugged the BMS after charging it, it might stop the cutouts. The controller on the bike would prevent the voltage from dropping too far anyway. Then I could reattach the BMS when I charge it.



It sounds like a lot of work but there's a panel on the battery that easily slides off to allow some access. I have no idea which wires to disconnect though?

Also what is the correct way of measuring each cell individually?

 

[Mussels]

I find it interesting if the battery can operate without the BMS.

My XH370-10J is coming close to 5 years old and needs replacing. It still gives good range but has a nasty habit of cutting out under load, particularly on hills and during cold weather. The BMS shuts the battery down, and I have to stop the bike and unplug the battery briefly to get it to work. If I unplugged the BMS after charging it, it might stop the cutouts. The controller on the bike would prevent the voltage from dropping too far anyway. Then I could reattach the BMS when I charge it.

View attachment 3785

It sounds like a lot of work but there's a panel on the battery that easily slides off to allow some access. I have no idea which wires to disconnect though?

Also what is the correct way of measuring each cell individually?

The bms is there to prolong the life of the battery, without it the battery will deteriorate much faster.
It cuts out the power because running it down further runs the risk of pushing current the wrong way through weaker cells, this will ruin those cells.

 

[Tinker]

As Mussels says the BMS is there for a reason but reading up on other forums it seems a lot of people don't use them they use other means like a Cycle Analyst etc.
looking at your picture you have the same battery as this one & it's simple to unplug the white plug where all the small colored ribbon wires attach to the BMS, (it pulls off).
Whilst I'm pretty confident that I can sort out a safeguard to avoid excess drainage I'm lost when it comes to charging. I still don't understand why if a BMS is built into the battery some people advise have to use the battery suppliers charger (but more often than not can upgrade to a higher amperage one @ extra cost) Whilst others sell chargers by voltage output.

 

[Mussels]

Not all bms are the same, some monitor individual cell charging and others don't. So chargers are probably mated with the correct bms, I might be wrong though

 

[oigoi]

I have also had this problem of the bms cutting the power off when it need not. I have the bms connected all the time but the power to the controller is connected directly to the battery. The low voltage cut out on my controller will not allow me to discharge the cells below around 2.5V so protecting them.

The bms is still all hooked up with it's balancing wires etc so it balances the cells when charging