Building a 20" wheel tadpole e-trike from scratch

[twinkle]

5 of us trikers went camping last weekend , With Ken and I on the electric trikes and we were joined by 3 push trikes , Despite the thunder storm on Friday evening , torrential rain and a Heat wave between times we had a great time , I am only waiting for a freewheel and I can fit the new motor in the Trike
regards emma

Here is one of the weekend photos

 

[twinkle]

Just received an email from a German company I ordered the 11-30 freewheel from :- Said they were sorry but they don't have them in stock until next week , Funny 2 weeks ago when I ordered them they were in stock , Yet another holdup ,Still the trike runs with this motor but I would like to fit discs o the rear which is not possible using the existing motor, Still Plenty of other projects to keep me busy . We are just building another pair of 15mm centre bearing hubs with disc brake flanges for the front wheels of the next trike .

regards emma

 

[twinkle]

After Dinner last night we got out for an hour and a half and did the Newhaven to Seaford Head run . The trike is performing well on that Currie motor once it goes over 10 mph , below that it is over geared .
Back to Newhaven just in time as the sunset quicker than we had bargained for.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Thanks so much for this thread, which for me has been one of the best ever, giving the whole story of the bikes and making me jealous.

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

The trike now has done a few hundred miles and is getting ready for its first ( probably of many " upgrades " the q100 328 rpm motor is sitting in the corner waiting impatiently for the other bits to arrive so we can upgrade the motor and get a few more gears ,
The main thing that I am still waiting for is the 7 speed 11-30 screw-on freewheel from ebike-solutions.de , They happily took my order without informing me that they were out of stock and the stock isn't due in until the end of this week .
Rather than sit around and do nothing ( well it has been hot enough for that ) I have started to prepare for the upgrade , 20" wheel mini mountain bikes don't come with disc brakes or 135mm wide hub spacings so I have started to build another rear triangle with a disc brake mount and the open the rear end to 135 mm ready for the e-hub , so the trike remains usable until the bits arrive .
The e-wheel has its street-pac 20x 1.75 tyre fitted and I have installed slime in the inner tube just to be on the safe side .I have another couple of Street-pacs for the fronts after I build a pair of 20" wheels with matching rims ( going silver rims all round ) , We are modifying a pair of ultimate hardware front disc hubs with ball races and a 15mm spindle . more photos to follow as the upgrade gets under way .

I plan to fit a pedelec sensor once I have found a suitable bottom bracket spindle that is long enough to fit the sensor between the cup and the crank..

I have ordered a 52 ,40 ,30 chainset as well as the 11-30 freewheel and if my calculations are right the rear mechanism should cope with the 41 teeth chain wrap difference of teeth ( just its rated at 42 t )
giving gear ratios between 18" and 95" enough .

The top gear of 95 inches should if I am fit enough allow a pedalable top speed of 34mph at 140 rpm cadence ( for a shot period ) and the bottom gear will give 4.7 mph at 80 rpm , enough to get me up the steepest hills around here . even without e-assist .

regards for now

emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

3 weeks later and the seven speed block still has not been dispatched so I am stuck with plan B fit a 13-32 mega range and limit the top gear to a 48-13 until it arrives - we will see next week ,
The 20" triangle is welded up ( the lhs chainstay I cut and thinned the inside and welded on the disc brake mount so its ready for the test fitting ...
Whilst I was in a lets get something done mood I fitted the pedelec sensor
a 5 minute job --- ho ho .............. 2 hours later with half a dozen spindles I managed to find one that will do with enough space to fit the sensor and wide enough to allow the adjustable cup some thread for the lock ring .but I could not fit the 52-30 triple chainset as the spindles were wrong .

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks.

I am still treading water ( now over a month ) waiting for this German e-bike spares company to dispatch the 11-30 freewheel and I have ordered another one from China, that, from the tracking all 3 now in the UK ( Hooray ) so last week instead of twiddling my fingers I turned my attention to my unfinished project of my Push Trike ,this is still a tadpole but it is much lighter ( 43 lbs approx )
a 20 " front 26" rear with disc brakes all round 9x3 gearing from 16" to 100" and USS but no suspension ( it uses a rear MTB triangle ) I have finally stripped and painted it in this break ( WAIT ) for the parts to arrive .
The e-trike is still being used with the currie motor and above 10 mph the wheel works well but with little torque below that.

here is the mkll push trike that I have just finished .

regards emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi folks

The 11-30 freewheel finally turned up on Tuesday morning with a parcel force guy who looked rather confused with the address on the label , but they know me ( thank goodness )

The new rear triangle has been painted and the old e-assist unit stripped from the trike with the triangle in one piece all the old electrics has been stripped out which is a pain in the rear , the " new " rear end has been assembled and fitted to the trike and the new system 80% installed , its past midnight now and having burnt the candle at both ends again today its time to call it a day .

now with 21 gears instead of the original 12 and a chain wrap of 39t the new rear mechanism seems to be coping with the teeth difference ,

another couple of hours tomorrow should see it completed and the cables tidied up ready for the test ride . report and photos will follow ,

regards emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

Its finished ( well for now ) and I have been out for a ride .
So far the initial test report etc .

the motor is quiet and smooth and the controllers five assist levels have a definite "step " between them , the pedelec sensor kicks the system into life after a complete revolution and the brake kill switches work well .

A BIG THANK YOU to D8veh for all his help in producing a rather nice upgrade to the trike and the technical support provided during the process .

Fitting the 11-30 freewheel and the 48-38-28 front chainrings have produced a rather nice gear range from 17 " up to almost 90 " plenty of range and a gear for all occasions the "geared freewheel hub " helps when in pedal power mode and everything is OKay

But There are a few criticisms that do not reflect on Dave's part only the differences in fitting a bike kit to a trike and sourcing parts

The cables are ALL either too long or too short and some cannot be shortened so have to been hidden this does take extra time to tidy up the installation as the whole of the installation bar the LCD display and the pedelec sensor are within a couple of feet of everything

And be careful where you buy from GBH took over a month to deliver the freewheel after purchasing an in stock item that turned out to be out of stock
....

now what shall I do with a spare e-wheel and a couple of front wheels ..........
you have probably guessed right

Seriously , Thanks Dave you have done me proud .........

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

I have been a bit quiet this week but still very productive , number two 20/20 is under way ( photos later ) This is basically the original wheels with a set of SLA batteries from the other upgrade of my bigger red trike and the new front wheel conversion has been fitted to the red one , these wheels have 20mm hubs with a machined " top hat" 20 - 14mm adapter and are running on 14mm 8.8 HT steel bolts for axles , these allow the front wheels to be removed without the need of removing the caliper first . I am still using 160mm discs as these give good stopping power , the rear 160mm disc like any tadpole trike is too powerful and due to the weight transfer under braking cause the rear to lock up
The front tyres are 2.1" burnouts and have a fine herringbone tread .
50 psi front and 60psi rear give a good ride with little rolling resistance.

here are the photos.
Top the 32 hole 20mm font wheels with white spokes
middle and lower a couple more photos of the complete trike from different angles .( just before setting out for another ride )
The addition of the pelelec sensor on the upgrade has transformed the characteristics of the trike and the level 2 /5 seems a good setting for normal everyday riding without the need for throttle in normal conditions .,


regards emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

Did some one say they would like it in black ..........

I found the manual to the original controller and squeezed a few more watts out of the Currie and rebuilt the spare bits and a set of SLA batteries in this

 

[twinkle]

Comparisons

Hi Folks

With 2 virtually identical trikes to compare side by side , the differences of the q100 and the currie can be identified and compared , Both trikes ride well , The red original trike has undergone a few upgrade and is now a pleasure to ride with the added advantage that it fits in the boot of the estate car and at a weight ( 34kgs ) that I can get it in and out without too much of a struggle , On the other hand at 48kg approx the black trike is just too heavy to lift , The 12ah SLA batteries of the black trike seem to hold up quite well and the power has been increase by removing the limit link on the outside of the controller , This has given the trike a bit more power but is not as powerful as the q100 motor .
Both trikes are now equipped with pedelec sensors and throttles and the assist is noticeable, the 5 levels of assist on the red trike makes riding more interesting .

All in all the red trike with its upgrades is a nicer trike to use than the black one which is more than adequate as an electric assist trike , both work well and are usable work horses , I haven't managed to find the range out on either yet so this will be an interesting factor to know , We hope to take both trikes on holiday in a couple of weeks and we will have a better idea of the range . I will probable fit the second water bottle battery to the black trike as this will make it easier to put the trike on the roof of the car as we know that the range will be less with the SLA batteries ( 12ah at the 1 hour rate is about 7.5 AH ) compared to the 9ah of the lithium battery .

More to follow

 

[twinkle]

So with a little spare time today we converted the black " stealth " trike to Lithium batteries ( the spare set for the red trike ) immediately the weight dropped from 103.75 lb to 75.5 lbs a massive 28 lbs difference in the SLA to lithium upgrade , this in turn means that the trike is now manageable to get onto the roof rack ,at over 100lbs we could not lift it onto the roof of the Mondeo estate .
After the conversion we rode out along the A259 to the cafe at Ovingdean for a cup of tea before riding back , The hills ( what hills ) seem to disappear as the assist kicked in .
All in all a pleasant day and many of the other jobs were done ready for our long weekend .
regards emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

Went to get the trike out the boot of the car on Wednesday for my lunchtime ride up to the base of the downs near the tye and found one of the front tyres was flat , after removing the tyre ( On the trike ) I found that there was a split in the tube , this correlated to a section in the "pierced " rims where the extra strong rim tape design for these so called lightweight rims has bulged and the tube had "blown by it " 5 layers of black PVC tape over both the offending rim tapes on the front wheels has stopped this bulging at 40psi on the " eastern burn out " tyres, the section and tread is designed for minimal rolling resistance and are almost a slick 20x 2.1 " tyre , So far the tape together with the original tape is holding happily at 40 psi , they seemed to get upset at the 50 psi that I usually run the tyres on the front at .

Hope everything is going to settle down as we are off soon for a long weekend caravanning and the two trikes are coming along as our daily transport .

regards emma

 

[twinkle]

The deflating problem seems to have gone away with the 5 layers of tape and the original rim tape , Personally I cannot recommend these rims for any project that requires tyre pressures over 30psi , but they seem to be ok at 40 psi and the trike still rolls wells , one suggestion has been to cut a tape rule to fit around the rim between the rim tape and the PVC tape , another is use a slat from a Venician blind ,

print screen windows xp

regards emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

We have just come back from our "summer break " being a carer you don't get much time away ,
So with 2 trikes , the estate car and the caravan we set off down to Bunn Leisure , in Selsey as Martha and the Vandellas were listed at the top of the bill
Sadly we were disappointed with the cabaret , She has lost the sparkle of youth and at her age the voice seems to be going as well , a lot of the other "guest" at the camp were also disappointed and left early after an hour we left the 10 people making up the band and the two backing singers were very good and were trying to carry Martha through the Gig .
The weather was excellent and we were using the trikes as everyday transport and they both performed without problem .
The local Fish monger on the beach sold us some mullet which we baked with herbs and seasoning and with fresh veg make a good mean after a day out on the trikes , we made use of the onsite Sauna and steam rooms as well as the large swimming pool .
So rather than bore you with lots of photos , Here are the trikes on up top and one in the boot of the estate on the caravan site , one of the lovely sunsets , The view across the English channel , and the trikes by the remains of one of the WWII fighter base airfields ( RAF Selsey ) in Sussex that sprung up through necessity to defend the country only to be returned to farming at the end of the war . Marked now by a plaque to those who fought to save our Country . The shape of the field is a give away to its former use bounded by two roads the main road into Selsey and the local road up to Church Norton .













upload image free

 

[twinkle]

So whats next you are probably thinking , well the stealth is going to be re fitted with the SLA batteries and may go on to pastures new , coming along at the moment is a new transportable trike which is being made in 3 main pieces with the main boom nose boom and cross boom being able to be dismantled for storage , Later it might become motorised
here is the work in progress
At present it is a 21 speed pedal tadpole trike with disc brakes all round .

regards emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks
Just refitted the SLA batteries to the black trike and have done a little cosmetic work to it as it had started to get a few knocks on holiday .
Just to cheer it up a bit the front has been resprayed in blue , i think it looks better than all black . We are running out of space and it might have to go .

regards emma

 

[twinkle]

Hi Folks

The next trike conversion will be the new transportable , this lightweight trike will be a good candidate for an electric conversion, Still in bare metal , I can still weld on the fittings without damaging the paintwork .

This will add a little complexity to the build but it should make for an interesting trike , after all this can be dismantled and be carried inside the caravan .


This will be fitted with Lifepo4 batteries and a rear hub motor , 21 speed will be the standard with a range again of below 20" to over 90" enough for the variety of hills in this area .

The e-conversion will only add about 15lbs or so to the weight and it should come out around 60 lbs with a 37v 10ah battery less than the original 20/20 e-trike .

The battery fitment leaves a little to the imagination at the moment as does the fixing for the rear rack as the disc brake mount is using the Left hand Mudguard eyes so a little ingenuity is called for here . I don't want to mount the battery on the rack as it increases the height of the centre of gravity causing instability on cornering fast so it might get a side mounted battery along side the seat. .

regards emma

 

[Geebee]

If you fit a set of pannier bags you could keep the weight well down and have the batteries easily removable for transport still.
Handling wise further forward would be better, Greenspeed always recommended 1/3 weight over each wheel and their trikes handle very well.