Help!!!!!!!

[Old Timer]

I`m dismatling my wheels on the powertrek in readiness for my ordered Marathon puncture resistant tyres. As mentioned in a previous thread I intend to put a connector in the cable from hub to controller for future ease.

I cut the cable and to my surprise there are 8 (yes 8) wires in that cable OK I think, no problem because I took the precation of ordering 2 connectors (2x4) it will be a squeeze to get both connectors tidily on the chain tube but judging by the thickness of the cable ( 3 main cables similar to the cables that ran back from the hub on my alien kit) and 5 fairly small cables. I thought I might well use bullet connectors (I have various sizes) and that will keep the joint within reasonable sizes.) I can easily weather proof the whole joint with self amalgamating tape. Then I realise that 2 of the small wires are the same colour (a sort of greeny blue) putting the wrong one the wrong way around might turn the E bike into a push bike

Any help available?

I`m surprised after working on the Alien kit and have I thought that there were multiple wires in there then I would have opened the outer and cut them one by one and labeled them. Hind sight is a wonderful thing.

To all intense and purpose the hub looks a dead ringer for the Barfang hub in the alien kit but with no ID on it other than a label in Chinese.

So! the rubbing block are those two identical wires.

I wouldn`t think there is any chance of getting a wiring diagram.

 

[flecc]

Three thick phase current wires and five thin Hall sensor signal wires is the norm for this type of motor.

Are the two the same colour different thicknesses? If so reconnect them that way.
.

 

[Lloyd]

Check the thckness (gauge) of the wires. Should be 3 thick ones and 5 thin ones, the thin ones are sensor wires and should be individualy coloured, the thick ones are the power leads and should also be individually coloured. I would imagine you have 2 of the same colour but different gauges. Hopefully........ This is just brushless motors in general mind, I haven't worked on a powertrek, but would assume they wouldn't colour two of the sensor wires the same......

........but we all know what assumption is.

 

[Lloyd]

Doh. Beaten by Flecc again........the fastest poster in all the land.

 

[jerrysimon]

Yep its a halls motor.

No problem just use one of these but eight way if you can find them.

Or one of these but you will need to waterproof it.

I guess you could use two connectors one for the sensor connectors and one for the brushless connectors.

YES whatever you do, do not spin the wheel with the wires shorting each other as you will damage it!

Edit wow everyone replied first lol

Regards

Jerry

 

[Herb]

Dave

I feel sure if you look at the cut end of the cable you will be able to see the radial lay of the cables, ie they will be in an order.

Then by using one of the known cables as a 12 oclock or reference position you will be able to record and mark the remainder – don’t forget the other cut end will be the mirror image.

Herb

 

[flecc]

Doh. Beaten by Flecc again........the fastest poster in all the land.

Sorry Lloyd, I'll slow down a bit.
.

 

[Old Timer]

What rapid response

I`m looking for my magnifying glass at the moment (remember I`m an OAP now

I`ll take a real close look at the wires, there might even be a small stripe on one or in some cases you sometimes get a sq and a round.

So! just another question.

The alien kit has just three substantial wires and this hub has eight ( you call it a hall motor.)

Why then when riding the bikes are there no big differences in the way things work (or could it be that problem I was talking about with Alien the pedelec working the opposite to this one)

I`ll be back, I feel a bit better with the support, Thanks.

 

[Andy_82]

yes 3 of them are for the power and 5 of them is for hall sensor, be careful connecting them all. i wish you luck

 

[Lloyd]

What rapid response

I`m looking for my magnifying glass at the moment (remember I`m an OAP now

I`ll take a real close look at the wires, there might even be a small stripe on one or in some cases you sometimes get a sq and a round.

So! just another question.

The alien kit has just three substantial wires and this hub has eight ( you call it a hall motor.)

Why then when riding the bikes are there no big differences in the way things work (or could it be that problem I was talking about with Alien the pedelec working the opposite to this one)

I`ll be back, I feel a bit better with the support, Thanks.

I don't know much about Aliens (the bikes nor the Extra Terrestrials) but there are 3 types of motor commonly available;

Brushed motors have 2 power leads. Nothing else.

Brushless sensored. 3 power/phase leads, and 5 sensor leads.

Brushless sensorless. Just 3 power/phase leads.

Difference between brushless sensored and sensorless is the low speed pickup. Sensored motors feel soother. This isnt very noticable in ebikes tbh, would be far more noticable in smaller motors like the 540 size motors found in model cars for instance.

 

[flecc]

No, there's no connection with other factors like the way the pedelec works, the Alien has just a normal brushless motor with the 3 power wires and 5 sensor wires. I doubt they are all the same thickness though as you seem to be saying.
.

 

[Old Timer]

Thanks all the info.

Right mag glass in hand and (her who must be obeyeds) 15 year younger eyes + white light from LED torch and it has now become apparent that the two small bluish/greenish wires are in fact a bluey green and a greeny blue So ID no problem.

What is going to be a problem (and I`m not sure I would have gone down this road if I`d known) is the size of the 5 small wires, they are quite tiny and delicate. Certainly not the kind of wire I would want to put into the connectors I`ve ordered. Even thinking about the bullet connectors and looking at my smallest they are still too big for these tiny wires. Keeping in mind that the object was to have a removal plug for puncture repairs then you would really have to be careful unplugging these. Computer mother board connectors come to mind.

I can get on with preparing my wheels for the new tyres but will need to think about this joint.(now I know why the cable didn`t have a connector)

I`ve of the mind at present to actually solder connect from the hub cut wires to a new length of wire thus taking the excess to a new spot on the frame(maybe behind the battery assembly) cable tie it in position and if and when the wheel needs to come out in the future just snip the ties and work with a decent length of slack rather than a removable plug.

Does that make sense?

 

[Old Timer]

No, there's no connection with other factors like the way the pedelec works, the Alien has just a normal brushless motor with the 3 power wires and 5 sensor wires. I doubt they are all the same thickness though as you seem to be saying.
.

Flecc

I`m pretty sure that the Alien front wheel cable had only 3 decent sized wires and no small ones.

 

[Old Timer]

Yep its a halls motor.

No problem just use one of these but eight way if you can find them.

Or one of these but you will need to waterproof it.

I guess you could use two connectors one for the sensor connectors and one for the brushless connectors.

YES whatever you do, do not spin the wheel with the wires shorting each other as you will damage it!

Edit wow everyone replied first lol

Regards

Jerry

Those first linked ones are what I`ve ordered and will be to large(well at least for the tiny wires)

 

[Lloyd]

Yes that is an option, but whilst you have it apart you might as well plug it. The best option would be to run the 5 sensor wires through a 5 block connector. with these you simply crimp the individual pins onto the end of each wire, and push into the block. A bit of glue from a glue gun around the edges or some expandable sealer will make it strong and support the wires going into the block. Then just plug and play. (or unplug and fix puncture ) Maplins or CEF do a range of small 5 block connectors, for a couple of quid. If you run the wire long and soldered you may get problems folding it back on itself as the wire will be more prone to breaking. Whilst rewiring majority of the Ezee controllers back in the day, I noticed that if the flex was too long and folded up it inevitably caused problems later on in time. Using connectors was far more reliable.

 

[Old Timer]

Under kits, click on the fourth download and scroll to the wire diagram - Downloads

 

[NRG]

No, there's no connection with other factors like the way the pedelec works, the Alien has just a normal brushless motor with the 3 power wires and 5 sensor wires. I doubt they are all the same thickness though as you seem to be saying.
.

Not on the latest ones Flecc they are sensor-less. No Hall wires.

 

[john]

What rapid response

I`m looking for my magnifying glass at the moment (remember I`m an OAP now

I`ll take a real close look at the wires, there might even be a small stripe on one or in some cases you sometimes get a sq and a round.

So! just another question.

The alien kit has just three substantial wires and this hub has eight ( you call it a hall motor.)

Why then when riding the bikes are there no big differences in the way things work (or could it be that problem I was talking about with Alien the pedelec working the opposite to this one)

I`ll be back, I feel a bit better with the support, Thanks.

With a throttle operated bike, a hall motor will tend to be smoother from a standing start, probably not so much an issue on a pedalec.

 

[flecc]

Flecc

I`m pretty sure that the Alien front wheel cable had only 3 decent sized wires and no small ones.

That was the different sensorless type that Lloyd also showed. Alien have not been consistent with their supplies, sometimes sending out all three types, Hall motors with and without sensors and brush motors. Yours must have been the Hall sensorless type. Obviously the Powertrek has the Hall sensor type (best in my view).

Edit, just seen NRG's response. Hopefully Alien will stick with one type now and stop the confusion.
.

 

[Old Timer]

Yes that is an option, but whilst you have it apart you might as well plug it. The best option would be to run the 5 sensor wires through a 5 block connector. with these you simply crimp the individual pins onto the end of each wire, and push into the block. A bit of glue from a glue gun around the edges or some expandable sealer will make it strong and support the wires going into the block. Then just plug and play. (or unplug and fix puncture ) Maplins or CEF do a range of small 5 block connectors, for a couple of quid. If you run the wire long and soldered you may get problems folding it back on itself as the wire will be more prone to breaking. Whilst rewiring majority of the Ezee controllers back in the day, I noticed that if the flex was too long and folded up it inevitably caused problems later on in time. Using connectors was far more reliable.

Lloyd

Can`t find those connectors on Maplin(mind you it can be a PITA to find things on their.