I think this is a cracking bike but what am I missing?

[mjwobble]

High Powered 750w Bespoke Built Electric Mountain Bike 20p mph + | eBay

the listing has ended but could someone kindly advise whether that would have been a good deal or not for future reference

I've looked up all the components that are specified (the motor/motor type, controller, computer, battery AH are not - lol!)

the Saracen frame is a good thing I've never ridden a bad Saracen, the hydraulic disc brakes are expensive and the seller is reliable - but doesn't know the weight, oh dear

I wasn't happy with a Sirroco CD from Woosh - they said it could go up any hill good grief that was a joke @ 800 quid.

all about torque I know but no one gives torque in the spec! (not genuine figures that tranlate to the real world) I'm only 9.7 stone too so no excuses on rider weight

thoughts?

I'd actually be happy for someone to build a bike to my spec and pay them well for it but I can't find a local company that know their electric bikes

 

[Artstu]

I wasn't happy with a Sirroco CD from Woosh - they said it could go up any hill good grief that was a joke @ 800 quid.

Was that with you pedalling or expecting it to go up the hill without pedalling? I ask because a friend is just about to buy one.

 

[mjwobble]

always pedaling I wouldn't expect any electric bike to go up hills on it's own that would be terrible for the battery anyway

the key here is that the motor on the Sirocco CD was next to no help going up hills - it felt like riding a non electric bike and that's not the impression you get from the blurb...

it's good if you're just riding flat roads but if you're just doing flat then you really shouldn't be going electric

the steepest gradient on my commute was 25% hope this helps

 

[DavePat]

I have the old Sirocco CD and changed the rear gears to an 11-34T cassette. It will climb any hill I have tried so far, some pretty steep but maybe not that long. It does not fly up hills though if thats what you were expecting but it is better than the typical hub bikes I have tried. I took off the throttle when I changed the grips and the biggest problem on hills for me is starting off halfway up a hill. The power does not kick in until a couple of crank revolutions and even in the 34T cog I cannot get started on steep hills.
From your comments I don't think any of the standard electric bikes will give you what you want, maybe a Xipi would fit the bill if inside your budget.
The Sirocco CD will do 25 on the flat if you derestrict it and put in a bit of effort too, mine is set back to standard now but I did fiddle with the settings out of interest.

 

[103Alex1]

always pedaling I wouldn't expect any electric bike to go up hills on it's own that would be terrible for the battery anyway

the key here is that the motor on the Sirocco CD was next to no help going up hills - it felt like riding a non electric bike and that's not the impression you get from the blurb...

it's good if you're just riding flat roads but if you're just doing flat then you really shouldn't be going electric

the steepest gradient on my commute was 25% hope this helps

If you want fast hill climbing, consider one of these :

Bafang CST 36V 500W REAR Driving E-Bike Conversion Kit. - BMSBATTERY

They're very torquey up hills and are geared so you don't have the drag / regen braking hammering your average on the downhills. On full power they do 22mph on the flat and gentle hills easily with 'mock pedalling'. I believe you need a 20Ah 36V battery to run the amps this will draw ... but you do get a very good useable range in return.

I live in a very hilly area - with decent spinning up steep hills you should be able to sustain >15mph up to about 20% gradient. Speed will come down a bit on long stretches between 20 & 25% but the effort factor will be massively reduced. Can manage a decent 11-12mph from a standing start even on early stretches of a 20% slope with pedal effort. You'll go faster with a run up to the hill.

They are hungry if you use max power assist with lots of hills and ride assisted at top speed. Range used like this with a 20Ah battery about 25-30 miles. Took mine out for a 32 mile ride today on/off road and decided to get some exercise by limiting power input on the hills to 350-500W except on a 1 mile long >17% hill (drew 1100W) and 150-200W on gentle hills. Cycle Analyst showed consumption of 9.93Ah and 12Wh/mile. Average speed 18.2mph (including time on trails) and Max speed 43.6mph. If I run a 20.5mph average speed consumption is more like 20Wh/mile. That's all with knobbly MTB tyres.

I built this specifically because of the hills for the grunt. The top assisted speed on the flat is great if I can't be bothered to pedal much or in a hurry but the big bonus is being geared so the downhills are all unassisted and generally 28-44mph depending on the gradient. It's not a stupidly fast bike but I've flown past every roadie in these parts all Summer - usually gain 2/3 of a mile on them up a long hill.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

There's lots of those type (post#1) of bikes that turn up on Ebay. Most of them are poorly thought out and assembled, and you can see from the description that the seller doesn't really understand ebike technology very well. He mentions seeing 1000w output, but his meter can only measure power input.The motor is a direct drive, which will have low efficiency when maximum current is being drawn, so peak output power would be about half of that figure. So performance wouldn't be that spectacular, and hill-climbing probably worse than a 250w geared motor. There's no mention of the battery size. You'd need to check that, but 1000w means at least 25 amps, so the battery would need to be 20aH or Headway cells or other high discharge type if smaller. Many of these bikes have normal 10aH batteries hooked up to 25 amp controllers so beware. I might be being unfair on the seller;however, the bike looks like a lash-up with untidy wiring, so I'd expect the worse.

I'm nearly twice the weight of the OP, and I found that the Woosh could get me up pretty steep hills with pedalling. Without pedalling, about 8% was the maximum. I can imagine it taking a light rider like OP up about 15% without pedalling. There must be something wrong with how the bike was used, like wrong gear or something. Most people would be happy with the Woosh's hill-climbing compared with other bikes, but it doesn't have the sheer grunt of a Kudos Tornado, Ezee Forza or BH Emotion Neo, or any of the other new generation of powerful hub motors.

 

[trex]

Alex, as a matter of personal interest (for my next project), can you give me the total weight of your kit and bike? I am trying to compare 48V 8-Fun BBS01 with N360 against CST500W

 

[Mike63]

I have a Woosh Sirocco CD and despite my 73 years and weighing in at 100 kilos, I find that the Woosh will carry me up a reasonably steep hill without too much effort provided I get in the rght gear.

 

[denwyn]

High Powered 750w Bespoke Built Electric Mountain Bike 20p mph + | eBay

the listing has ended but could someone kindly advise whether that would have been a good deal or not for future reference

I've looked up all the components that are specified (the motor/motor type, controller, computer, battery AH are not - lol!)

the Saracen frame is a good thing I've never ridden a bad Saracen, the hydraulic disc brakes are expensive and the seller is reliable - but doesn't know the weight, oh dear

I wasn't happy with a Sirroco CD from Woosh - they said it could go up any hill good grief that was a joke @ 800 quid.

all about torque I know but no one gives torque in the spec! (not genuine figures that tranlate to the real world) I'm only 9.7 stone too so no excuses on rider weight

thoughts?

I'd actually be happy for someone to build a bike to my spec and pay them well for it but I can't find a local company that know their electric bikes

So glad i read this, i was about to place an order for a Sirocco CD tomorrow, this is making me think again on buying it, especially as your only 9.7 stone and i'm 16.4 stone, i don't intend doing many big hills, few short steep climbs to work and home,and some say 25 mile round trip rides when i'm more up to it. Maybe i will have to rethink and look at other bikes now. Its good to look at all these comments but sometimes its very confusing to us menials. ; )

 

[trex]

denwyn, mjwobble wants a 1500W bike, is that what you want?
Crank drive bikes get you up the hills but won't fly you up the hills like these 1500W bikes do.
only alien Ocean and Banbury Frank make these powerful bikes.

 

[denwyn]

denwyn, mjwobble wants a 1500W bike, is that what you want?
Crank drive bikes get you up the hills but won't fly you up the hills like these 1500W bikes do.
only alien Ocean and Banbury Frank make these powerful bikes.

No I dont want those speeds,just he didn't seem to rate the bike. I chose the sirocco CD on price really, I tried out a Gepida with a crank drive,and liked it,but its out of my price range. The Sirocco seemed a reasonable alternative at the time,there didn't seem to be an alternative in that price range. I haven't really tried a hub motor,as most recommended a crank drive. 75 % of my riding will be fairly flat,a couple of steep short climbs, mainly 4 trips a day for work,about 12 miles a day,plus some trips into town,etc. Only dealers in near me in Taunton sell very upmarket bikes,one sells Giant but didn't keep them in stock,and there's Halfords which is not worth a visit. So mail order is only way,have no time to travel to other dealers a long way from here just for test ride,plus these dealers don't stock lower end of market bikes.

 

[Artstu]

It's mjwobble that has thrown a spanner in the works. Given that others rate the CD I personally wouldn't take much notice of mjwobble without them giving more information about their cycling experience and ability.

 

[john h]

i have a sirocco cd and find it good on hills, my weight is 11st

 

[103Alex1]

Crank drives you can but retail here don't climb hills anywhere near as fast or effortlessly as a powerful hub motor. Whatever the torque or whatever figures say, they just don't. The pulse, breathing rate and volume of sweat exuded at the top of a long very steep climb at a decent speed are the measures which mean most to me !

 

[103Alex1]

Alex, as a matter of personal interest (for my next project), can you give me the total weight of your kit and bike? I am trying to compare 48V 8-Fun BBS01 with N360 against CST500W

I don't have scales down here trex - but looking back when I weighed it after fitting soft-start switch, brake cutoff switch, pretty heavy PD-647 DX pedals, dual throttle, rack, MTB tyres, protek max tubes and a 1.1kg bag (bit heavier than my box & fixings) it was 25.4kg with the triple front chainring and motor / 20Ah battery.

Since then I've added mudguards, chainguard, horn, phone charger, extra lights, 3 voltage converters, 12V charger socket, cycle analyst and a lot of extra wiring so it'll be a bit more now.

 

[Cyclezee]

Hi mjwobble,

I have no idea of your location, but if you are within traveling distance of Milton Keynes, come and try an eZee bike or conversion

 

[trex]

thank you Alex. Your bike is a suberb model for self builds.
John: denwyn is based in Taunton, his exchequer has set the budget at £800 to £1,000.

 

[Cyclezee]

thank you Alex. Your bike is a suberb model for self builds.
John: denwyn is based in Taunton, his exchequer has set the budget at £800 to £1,000.

Hi Trex,

My post was addressed to mjwobble?

 

[trex]

sorry John, my mistake. denwyn needs to buy a bike today and your Forza would suit him very well.

 

[Oldie]

"the key here is that the motor on the Sirocco CD was next to no help going up hills - it felt like riding a non electric bike and that's not the impression you get from the blurb..."

I'm baffled.

My Sirocco CD is a superb hill climber. Maybe you didn't read the instructions fully, or forgot the battery or something. Maybe the bike had a fault (although I presume that the first thing you did was contact Woosh about the problem).

As I say, I'm baffled.