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Interesting response to a request to head office of Go Outdoors about converting a Calibre Bossnut!

Discussion in 'Electric Bike Conversion Kits' started by Frobisher, Dec 7, 2017 at 12:32 PM.

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    Frobisher

    Frobisher Just Joined

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    If you don't know, the Bossnut is a full suspension £1000-ish mountain bike that has been winning awards over the last couple of years. Uses lots of well known parts and is famous for being well built and robust.

    I enquired about the suitability of electrifying it - here's the response they made back to customer services, who forwarded it on to me!

    I can kind of see why they want to do it, but there’s so much think about in the way of technical and regulations to be road safe.

    Cheap conversion kits are available, they’re on Ebay for anywhere around £800 but would definitely not recommend attempting to convert a Bossnut with any sort of motor or engine as none of the bike would have been designed, spec’ed or tested to take any part of an E-system. Bearings, pivots, suspension, tyres, brakes and frame tubing all has to be changed and specifically adapted to create to take the extra torque, speed and power put through it.

    Then there’s the warranty side, once this new system is bolted on the customer would no longer be covered by any warranty as the Bossnut has not been designed for E-system usage.

    To get an idea what sort of thing they could be looking at for the end product have a look in this link for Haibike, then once you’re sat down have a look at the prices. The reason the prices are so high is to do with the Bosch system motor alone is over £1,000, then add the battery at £540, then the controller, torque and speed sensors, cables, specific design of the frame, then on top of all that is all the regular gears, forks, wheels type of bike stuff.

    I urge you to have a look through the full range!

    https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/haibike-electric-bikes

    If the customer is looking for an E-bike, ours came out on Friday. It’s called the Kinetic, hardtail with front suspension, Deore 10sp drivetrain and only available in 6 of the stores (Stockport, Stockton, Milton Keynes, Cardiff, Swindon and Basingstoke), not on the web. There’s only 50 in this model.
     
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    flecc

    flecc Member

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    I think they need educating!
    .
     
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    d8veh

    d8veh Pedelecer

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    What did you expect them to say? They have to cover themselves. If they said, "Yes, it's a great bike to convert" and you did something wrong and had an accident, they'd be liable. They can't say anything would be OK without testing it.

    Their prices of the stuff on the Haibike are way off, but the point is still sort of valid.

    The Bossnut might be a good off-road bicycle, but if you wanted to add an electric kit, where would you put the battery? What sort of battery would you use? It wouldn't be easy. It would be much easier to find a more suitable donor.
     
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    Frobisher

    Frobisher Just Joined

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    Yeah I see your point about them protecting themselves. I do think the stuff they've mentioned about torque & bearings, etc. is a red herring but battery position is something that's an issue on the bossnut anyway due to the placement of the rear suspension module (and is probably why their new e-bike is a front-sus only!)
     
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    NJS

    NJS Finding my (electric) wheels

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    Seems to me you could put 24 x 18650 cells either side of the crossbar without interference for a 12s4P 44V pack?
    Bossnut.jpg
     
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    Nealh

    Nealh Pedelecer

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    As said quite simply covering their backsides, as soon as you put major mods on the bike you void the warranty and any come back on the seller in the case you do serious harm.
    Bikes are built to cater for a wide range of rider weights so adding a 6/7kg kit isn't an issue, it's the competence of the fitter that is in question.
     
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    Frobisher

    Frobisher Just Joined

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    Hmm. Would seem to be better having it the underside of the down tube rather than the traditional topside! I don't know what to do now. I can't believe that such a robust bike would struggle with torque from a small-ish motor and if the bearings need upgrading to cope with 15mph then there's an issue as I'm pretty sure I've been quite a bit faster than that already!
     
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    flecc

    flecc Member

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    Of course it would be ok, though a crank drive motor will increase the transmission wear with both your power and the motor's going though it.

    Otherwise it should be fine.
    .
     
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    Nealh

    Nealh Pedelecer

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    Battery on the underside of the down tube is a bad idea.

    1. Relying on the full battery weight to be kept in place by usually a flimsy lock unless extra strapping is provided.
    2. Chances are battery will suffer a severe hit in any off the bike moments.
    3. Clearance from front wheel turning circle.
    4. Collateral damage from ground strike by being lower slung off road..
    5. As for #2 but stones/debris being flung up to hit said battery.
    6. Continual soaking in wet condition's via front wheel pickup.
     
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    d8veh

    d8veh Pedelecer

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    It's no different to any bike as a donor. Any bike supplier would say the say thing.

    You can't fit a front motor because it has a through axle. A small/medium rear would work for the road, but the mass would spoil the response from the rear suspension. A middle motor would be OK as long as it has a conventional BB. You'd most likely need to relocate the cable that runs under the BB by running it all the way from the shifter to the rear derailleur in an continuous outer.

    That bike is £1000. A decent mid-drive kit is about £1000 too. That brings it to about £2000. You can get this with full guarantee for £2200:
    http://www.50cycles.com/electric-bi...NcETD7MLk5z1p9IHveNCOGfDrgvAKs4xoCfvsQAvD_BwE
     
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    Frobisher

    Frobisher Just Joined

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    Yeah. I already own the Bossnut, had it for a year. Second hand resale value, lucky to get £650 probably. Mid-drive kits seem gettable for £700 with sensible battery. The Haibike looks nice but I'm 6'5" tall and need frame sizes that they rarely do. That one is way too small for me, but your point is taken - if I do get £650 for my old bike and was planning on spending £700-800 on a kit, then spending another £700 or so could get me a decent ready-made bike.
     
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    DynatechFan

    DynatechFan Finding my (electric) wheels

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    Sounds like you kind of answered your own question, if you have a particular need (ie in your case a large frame) or already own a decent donor bike (ie you again) then the kit route is an obvious, and potentially excellent way to go.

    How you solve the battery conundrum is an interesting one though - I wondered about it hanging down from the back of the seat post, a little high up but centred - does it have any bottle mounts anywhere?

    Sometimes this ebike malarkey feels a bit like the old Irish saying, "well if you want to get to there, you probably don't want to start from here . . ."
     
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    Benjahmin

    Benjahmin Pedelecer

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    Might be worth giving these guys a shout, they say they can make triangle bags to allow for rear suspension
    alpkit.com/products/stingray
     
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    NJS

    NJS Finding my (electric) wheels

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    Its easy to run up a hangover barbag from some suitable rip-stop nylon. With internal padding and stiffening, easy to make, fit and remove.

    To go the underslung to the downtube route, you'd need a aluminium/abs carrier made to fit; at least two more bottle carrier type inserts near the top of the tube; and work around the cable(s).

    It would be a more satisfactory solution long term if you've got the skills or money to employ them; but it is a serious piece of engineering.
     
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    d8veh

    d8veh Pedelecer

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    It's all down to your fabrication skills. No standard battery is going to be a good solution, so you can forget about complete kits in that price range. If you have a large frame, one of these bags might fit, but I'm not sure if you'd want to leave that in the shopping centre. There's other suppliers that make similar bags. BGA Reworking can make a battery to fit for about £300:

    https://www.e-bikerig.com/products/leed-exclusive-weatherproof-battery-frame-bag-black.html

    Complete guide to battery bags here:

    https://blog.e-bikerig.com/2015/11/21/guide-to-electric-bike-battery-bags-and-frame-bags/
     
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    DavidSWP

    DavidSWP Finding my (electric) wheels

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    I've got my battery slung underneath the bottom tube on a full suspension mountain bike. I just used 3 thickish releasable cable ties. I don't see it falling off! It not the most aesthetically pleasing though and would be pretty easy to pinch if I left it anywhere. Having the weight low down is obviously an advantage. Since the back of the battery is pressed up against the front of the motor It also stops my mid drive TSDZ2 from rotating forwards because I wasn't able to fit the anti rotation bracket due to the rear suspension
     

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