Batribike problem - cut out.

[GeneralDogsbody]

First, this is my second post, apart from a very brief introduction, and it's about a problem. I hope it's OK and appropriate to post here.

I bought a Batribike Trike 20 for my dad, who has not received it yet, but knows it's coming and is over the moon. Just now I thought I'd better familiarise myself with it, in case of support questions...

This machine was second-hand. I was assured that all was OK, and that it had "a new battery and tyres". The tyres are good. The battery I don't know about. It showed fully charged on the handlebar unit, this dropping as power was applied.

So, I took it down the road, on the flat, then up a side road, slightly uphill (say 1:30), back again (say 300 yards all told), then down a slightly steeper hill (say 1:20, 100 yards), and started back up to return home.

The setting was "high assistance", and I did some pedaling on the way. It was good. I was beginning to smile!

Unfortunately, coming back up the incline, the machine cut out. No power, no lights on the display. I pushed it home, and put the battery on charge. It's been on for about 25 minutes, and is still charging.

I notice from the front a sort of "tock tock ting!" noise as it's turned by hand with the weight off it. Whether it's coming from the hub, I can't quite tell.

So, I've got an electric trike for a present, and it's packed up. Any ideas of what's up?

Again, apologies for the early "problem" post. My dad will be very disappointed if it's packed up, hence my asking.

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

Refitted the battery before the caring light went out, but with some charge. Display lights up, lifted front wheel spins. Battery back on charge.

Do these cut out completely and abruptly wlen charge is low?

 

[JamesW]

Firstly congratulations and secondly commiserations that your intrroduction to ebikes has been liee than ideal already. Charge time for an ebike battery is measured in hours not minutes, you're looking at about 5 hours charge time dependent on battery age and capacity. From the initial description it sounds very similar to the occasions when I've run my battery right out and I would be suspecting the quality/"newness" of the battery. I hope I'm wrong as that's generally the most expensive part of the bike.

James

 

[JamesW]

Refitted the battery before the caring light went out, but with some charge. Display lights up, lifted front wheel spins. Battery back on charge.

Do these cut out completely and abruptly wlen charge is low?

Yes.
Make sure you know how much charge is in there, that the battery has been fully charged and the Battery Management System (BMS) I working on both the battery and the controller. Usually both the controller and the battery have separate BMSs to ensure that neither gets damaged by a wrong connection and to try to protect the battery.

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

Thank you very much for your replies. I only re-fitted the battery to see whether there was life in the machine, and it seems there is at least something, so the battery's back on charge.

I looked up the price of a new battery. Ye Giods, a good think I was sitting down. Perhaps there's scope for purchasing components; perhaps the battery was just flat. Fingers crossed!

I notice that when the charging plug is pushed in, it needs withdrawing slightly &/or wiggling to get the red charging ligjht to come on. Perhaps that has something to do with the matter (i.e. previous owner had not charged it when he thought he had).

Edit: The charger is really quite warm to the touch now. Not too hot to cold to the inside of my forerarm, but noticably hot - hot-water-bottle hot.

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

Firstly congratulations and secondly commiserations that your intrroduction to ebikes has been liee than ideal already.

James

Still. They seem pretty good (when actually mobile). I was impressed.

 

[JamesW]

Edit: The charger is really quite warm to the touch now. Not too hot to cold to the inside of my forerarm, but noticably hot - hot-water-bottle hot.

Just remember that batteries are chemical and not electrical - I.e. if you get a battery fire, disconnect the mains then drown it in water better still drop it into a bucket of water until the reaction has stopped.
After that small worthwhile warning, the charger will probably get warm. It should be the correct way up and you should always charge on a fireproof/flame resistant surface like concrete if you want to be safe.
Batteries are better charged from room temperature than winter outdoor temperatures.

Sounds like you have it under control. Check the wiring of the charger and the battery internally if you think there might be an ongoing connection issue.

 

[Nealh]

When charging the charger gets quite warm then will cool down when the battery has charged, plug the charger in the wall first and switch it on then connect it to the battery. Once charged you can check how much charge the battery has accepted a 24v one will be at 29- 29.4 fully charged and 36v at 41.6 - 42v. If once charged you get the same cutting out on the hills then you may have a battery out of balance or the worst case a few duff cells.
The tock tock ting sounds to me like pads rubbing on the disc rotor does it have disc's? If so a small caliper realignment is a 10 second job.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

It sounds like your battery isn't new. You had all the lights on the display, which means that it wasn't far off fully charged. I would have expected at least 5 miles at full power, assuming that it was not fully charged. With a new fully charged battey, you should get about 15 miles.

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

Well, it's still charging, and I am going to switch it off and let it start again tomorrow, early, since I don't want it to explode into flames in the middle of the night (although, as I have been drinking tins of Lidlbeer I should be able to deal with any blaze...).

So, if it's had two hours' charge out of five or six and still going, after doing (say) 400 yards, it wasn't very well charged....

Question: Do new batteries get fitted inside old cases, or are replacement units supplied complete? Is there a way to date batteries, e.g. by barcode? FWIW the bar code on the label on the socket end of this ones case says:

JD0360???? 20120410003

which to my untutored eye looks rather suspicious.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Almost certainly April 2012. How old is the bike?

 

[JamesW]

Well, it's still charging, and I am going to switch it off and let it start again tomorrow, early, since I don't want it to explode into flames in the middle of the night (although, as I have been drinking tins of Lidlbeer I should be able to deal with any blaze...).

So, if it's had two hours' charge out of five or six and still going, after doing (say) 400 yards, it wasn't very well charged....

Question: Do new batteries get fitted inside old cases, or are replacement units supplied complete? Is there a way to date batteries, e.g. by barcode? FWIW the bar code on the label on the socket end of this ones case says:

JD0360???? 20120410003

which to my untutored eye looks rather suspicious.

Barcodeing/ serial number format of any product is generally up to the manufacturer. In this case it looks like they've included a date of manufacture in it and it looks to be the third battery produced on 10th April 2012.
Batteries can be recelled, but three years is about when a battery could be expected to start having issues deperndfing on the quality of cells inside, level of use and care taken off it by the owner.

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

Not sure how old the bike is, but it's a Batribike T20 from Town & Country Mobility, Boston.

I might try to measure the voltage at the 3pin connector. I'll look up how to do it.

I was browsing these forums and frightened myself by finding a battery pack opened, with wires everywhere! Not sure about replacing cells, but money is certainly a factor.

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

"I might try to measure the voltage at the 3pin connector. I'll look up how to do it.

Well, I got the lid off the case, and inside is a rectangular lump encased in thin buff coloured GRP I assume sheets taped together, and handwritten in Biro on a piece of masking tape stuck to it is "140410003". I don't know what that means, but it looks similar to what's on the bar code.

Connecting a voltmeter across pins 1(+) and 2 of the charging socket shows 42V.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Don't panic just yet. Try it again after fully charging to see how far it goes. That will tell you more about the battery than anything.

If it was sold as a spare part, it might have been sitting on a shelf for a couple of years. In my experience, batteries don't lose capacity during storage, but they can get other problems. If yours measures 42v when charged, it doesn't have those other problems.

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

Don't panic just yet. Try it again after fully charging to see how far it goes. That will tell you more about the battery than anything.

Thank you. I will have to take it to my dad, who's a way away from me, and tell him to go up and down the road 1/2 a mile either way, so that at least if it phuts out, he won't have to walk too far. He's not very good on his pins these days!

It seemed to take about three hours to charge (SHC-8100L charger). The 3-pin plug needs a wiggle to get contact, it seems. Maybe the socket needs a clean; the pins on the plug look OK. However, I don't know what I'm talking about (but I'll learn I'm sure!).

 

[Deleted member 4366]

3 hours is not enough. A healthy battery will take about 5 hours from flat (cutting out).

 

[Algarrobo]

I have a Batribike Quartz LCD and had a similar issue this week. The bicycle is three years old and have worked fine until now.

There is a relatively long steep slope in my commute and, close to the end, the LCD panel got blank. I could not do anything to turn the bicycle on again. Later, I checked that the voltage of the battery had dropped below 10 Volts and did not recover. When I charged the battery, everything was back to normal again. The next day I had the exact same issue at the same point of the slope. Today I checked that I can avoid the problem by looking at the voltage indicator on the LCD panel and stopping when it shows only two bars of charge. The voltage of the battery goes up again and I can continue with the slope after stopping for a few seconds. Apparently, if the voltage drops below a certain level it does not go up again. I think this could be related to the ageing of the battery but I am not completely sure.

If the problem is the same in both cases, do you recommend us buying a new battery or is there something we can do? Is there any affordable alternative to buy a brand new battery (about £400)?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You can use any 36v battery you want. You should be able to find one for under £200. You'll probably have to chuck that rack and get a new one.

Is this the same as yours?

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Newest-rear-rack-36v-13Ah-electric-bike-battery-with-USB5V/2031548523.html

Otherwise one like this:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/36V10Ah-rear-rack-Style-Li-NCM-O2-battery-for-electric-bike-and-scooter/1383299771.html

Have a trawl through aliexpress. There's loads to choose from.

 

[flash]

This video shows the type of battery

My father had one of these. I was not very impressed with it. If you want to replace the battery with an original, Batribike told us they could not supply direct we would have to go through one of their dealers, The new Batribike has a different setup for the battery.

http://www.batribike.com/electric-trikes/trikes/trike-20-16