Battery problems Bosch 400wh

[Arne Hafskjer]

Hello everyone ?
I am from Norway (using google transl.)
Has a Cube Hybrid 29. Buy in May 2014. Fantastic bike and engine, but in September I did not have contact with the battery. Used about 20 charges. I got a new from dealer , but after about 10 charges have I got the same error , what happens?
Speedometer digit does not show.
It was a little rainy both times this happened so I wonder if there is a short circuit some place that destroys electronics in battery. Both times I am also quite sure that the battery was almost fully charged .
My dealer has waited five months to compensation for first broke , but I believe that Bosch has great problems with this battery as they will not admit.
I also tried to buy a new battery through Cannondale dealer but there I was informed that I had to sign me directly at Bosch to buy a new one.
It is soon spring in Norway now so if there is anyone who has knowledge of this I would be very grateful for information.
Best regards Arne

 

[Croxden]

I had an intermittent fault on th Intuvia display, it appeared to be off but later I found the backlight was on.

The controls worked but nothing visible. It failed completely the day before an appointment with the dealer, lucky me. A replacement was fitted immediately. I can only hazard a guess why it failed, but I think moisture may have penetrated the unit. On occasions there would be a condensation misting on the screen, this could upset the electronics.

Best of luck getting your problem sorted.

 

[Arne Hafskjer]

Hello and thanks for the reply , Dealer had a new bike in the shop and we tried to change both display and battery on both , without doing any difference. It is possible that there is an error on my bike that makes it "eats " battery but I have warranty on it yet, but the problem is also that the importer is unable to provide more batteries .
Best regards Arne

 

[1boris]

Hello everyone ?
I am from Norway (using google transl.)
Has a Cube Hybrid 29. Buy in May 2014. Fantastic bike and engine, but in September I did not have contact with the battery. Used about 20 charges. I got a new from dealer , but after about 10 charges have I got the same error , what happens?
Speedometer digit does not show.
It was a little rainy both times this happened so I wonder if there is a short circuit some place that destroys electronics in battery. Both times I am also quite sure that the battery was almost fully charged .
My dealer has waited five months to compensation for first broke , but I believe that Bosch has great problems with this battery as they will not admit.
I also tried to buy a new battery through Cannondale dealer but there I was informed that I had to sign me directly at Bosch to buy a new one.
It is soon spring in Norway now so if there is anyone who has knowledge of this I would be very grateful for information.
Best regards Arne

Hei,
Eg hadde samme problem ei uke etter sykkelen min va kjøpt.fikk nytt batteri men også det fikk samme problem etter få dager.men det gikk over.Det som skjedde hos meg var at batteri indikatoren bare blinka eller viste tomt batteri.speedometeret viste heller ikkje..Dermed fungerte ikkje sykkelen.Batteristatus indikatoren lyste konstant og ville ikkje slå seg av.Problemet oppsto når eg tok batteriet inn i varmen for å lade.Det tålte ikkje temperaturforandringen og slo seg.såg tydelig fuktighet inne i lyset på batteriet.Det kom og ein knitre lyd derfra.Det nye batteriet mitt har eg passa på å ikkje utsette for store temeraturforandringer.Det ser ut til å fungere.Dette er nok ein svakhet dei ikkje vil inrømme.Men dette skjer faktisk ikkje eingang med billigeste type kinabatterier.Og dette er snakk om batterier rundt 6000kr,tvile på om eg får et til på garantien om det nye batteriet svikte.Siden Bosch syklene kun fungere med orginalt Bosch batteri så er jo dette et kjempeproblem og meir enn nok til å fraråde alle til å ikkje kjøpe bosch elsykkel etter min meining.desverre.Du kan evt åpne det og tørke det,og satse på at bms en ikkje har tatt skade.men det går ikkje uten å knekke plast dekselet rundt,så da ryke ihvertfall alle muligheter til å få nytt på garantien.

 

[Croxden]

Hei,
Eg hadde samme problem ei uke etter sykkelen min va kjøpt.fikk nytt batteri men også det fikk samme problem etter få dager.men det gikk over.Det som skjedde hos meg var at batteri indikatoren bare blinka eller viste tomt batteri.speedometeret viste heller ikkje..Dermed fungerte ikkje sykkelen.Batteristatus indikatoren lyste konstant og ville ikkje slå seg av.Problemet oppsto når eg tok batteriet inn i varmen for å lade.Det tålte ikkje temperaturforandringen og slo seg.såg tydelig fuktighet inne i lyset på batteriet.Det kom og ein knitre lyd derfra.Det nye batteriet mitt har eg passa på å ikkje utsette for store temeraturforandringer.Det ser ut til å fungere.Dette er nok ein svakhet dei ikkje vil inrømme.Men dette skjer faktisk ikkje eingang med billigeste type kinabatterier.Og dette er snakk om batterier rundt 6000kr,tvile på om eg får et til på garantien om det nye batteriet svikte.Siden Bosch syklene kun fungere med orginalt Bosch batteri så er jo dette et kjempeproblem og meir enn nok til å fraråde alle til å ikkje kjøpe bosch elsykkel etter min meining.desverre.Du kan evt åpne det og tørke det,og satse på at bms en ikkje har tatt skade.men det går ikkje uten å knekke plast dekselet rundt,så da ryke ihvertfall alle muligheter til å få nytt på garantien.

That's easy for you to say.

 

[1boris]

That's easy for you to say.

I had the same problem with two bosch batterys.It was caused by condense.The bms is very sensitive to condense.The first battery never worked again.The second started working again by itself.Now I am very careful to not expose it to big temperature changes.Especially when charging.

 

[Arne Hafskjer]

I had the same problem with two bosch batterys.It was caused by condense.The bms is very sensitive to condense.The first battery never worked again.The second started working again by itself.Now I am very careful to not expose it to big temperature changes.Especially when charging.

Hello and thanks for the reply . I support your theory completely . It will be interesting to see if there are many who have the same experience. Hope everyone who has experienced the same problems will respond .
Best regards Arne

 

[jonathan75]

Hello and thanks for the reply . I support your theory completely . It will be interesting to see if there are many who have the same experience. Hope everyone who has experienced the same problems will respond .
Best regards Arne

Hi Arne, your battery should be the problem of the retailer (under your contract) or manufacturer (under your guarantee), not your financial problem, after only 10 months having paid good money for your bike. I don't know whether Norway matches the EU level of consumer protection, but if it does, then you would have two years *minimum* during which the goods must "conform to contract", ie be of reasonable quality for the price. It would be the retailer, not you, who is financially responsible to you, for your having a working bike and battery. If you bought the goods from the EU then this definitely applies. If you bought them from a Norwegian retailer then I would be still very surprised if there is not equivalent legal protection for you.

 

[Arne Hafskjer]

Hi Arne, your battery should be the problem of the retailer (under your contract) or manufacturer (under your guarantee), not your financial problem, after only 10 months having paid good money for your bike. I don't know whether Norway matches the EU level of consumer protection, but if it does, then you would have two years *minimum* during which the goods must "conform to contract", ie be of reasonable quality for the price. It would be the retailer, not you, who is financially responsible to you, for your having a working bike and battery. If you bought the goods from the EU then this definitely applies. If you bought them from a Norwegian retailer then I would be still very surprised if there is not equivalent legal protection for you.

Hi jonathan , and thanks for the reply.
We have equally good consumer rights in Norway as in the EU
I have no problem with my dealer. He gives me of course claim that this is a warranty case. But I doubt I want to reverse the trade, because I'm very happy with the bike except this battery.
The whole case is now about Bosch , and if they are willing to admit responsibility for this problem. If they are not , I can risk getting next battery destroyed one week after the warranty has expired. I must then decide whether I want to buy a new one.
The best had been that Bosch could guarantee me that they had solved the problem on all new battery which they replace.

Best regards Arne

 

[jonathan75]

Hi Arne,

If the rights you have are the same or greater than those in the EU, then, if Bosch wrongly refuse to honour their warranty, then you can challenge Bosch at your local small claims court, for a small fee. Bosch's warranty agreement with you is a contract made on Norweigan soil, which is enforceable against Bosch in Norway, because you relied on it when you made your purchase from the retailer. It was a promise addressed to you, to encourage you to enter the contract with the retailer, which you acted upon, and is a collateral contract, which is binding upon Bosch.

I need to correct what else you said. Reversing the transaction is not the only option with the retailer. They normally have a choice to repair, replace, or reverse the transaction. This right to this remedy from the retailer lasts long after the warranty has run out, whenever you have paid a substantial amount of money for the goods. This is a contractual right, separate from the warranty: it is a promise that the goods last as long as they ought to last, no matter how long the warranty runs for. Even if the warranty runs out after one year, then if your bike breaks completely after two or three years, (up to six in the UK, I don't know what the limit is in Norway) you still have this right against the retailer, subject to a deduction for usage.

If you challenge Bosch in a small claims court, then you may need an independent report as evidence. Perhaps the retailer could prepare this for you as a courtesy gesture. You might want to consider asking the retailer for help in dealing with Bosch right now, so that you don't have to go to court. I don't like their attitude in trying to avoid dealing with you or helping you.

All best, Jonathan

 

[Arne Hafskjer]

Hi Arne,

If the rights you have are the same or greater than those in the EU, then, if Bosch wrongly refuse to honour their warranty, then you can challenge Bosch at your local small claims court, for a small fee. Bosch's warranty agreement with you is a contract made on Norweigan soil, which is enforceable against Bosch in Norway, because you relied on it when you made your purchase from the retailer. It was a promise addressed to you, to encourage you to enter the contract with the retailer, which you acted upon, and is a collateral contract, which is binding upon Bosch.

I need to correct what else you said. Reversing the transaction is not the only option with the retailer. They normally have a choice to repair, replace, or reverse the transaction. This right to this remedy from the retailer lasts long after the warranty has run out, whenever you have paid a substantial amount of money for the goods. This is a contractual right, separate from the warranty: it is a promise that the goods last as long as they ought to last, no matter how long the warranty runs for. Even if the warranty runs out after one year, then if your bike breaks completely after two or three years, (up to six in the UK, I don't know what the limit is in Norway) you still have this right against the retailer, subject to a deduction for usage.

If you challenge Bosch in a small claims court, then you may need an independent report as evidence. Perhaps the retailer could prepare this for you as a courtesy gesture. You might want to consider asking the retailer for help in dealing with Bosch right now, so that you don't have to go to court. I don't like their attitude in trying to avoid dealing with you or helping you.

All best, Jonathan

Thanks again Jonathan , I greatly appreciate your involvement . I'm no lawyer , but I think that I must relate to my dealer. And I have no problems with him.
Visited him today and demanded a date for when I have a new battery. He is working with this case, and he could tell me that all bicycle dealers in Norway had to order new batteries through only one Norwegian importer . This means that all importers of different bicycles in Norway with Bosch motors must go through them.
Actually it is not my responsibility , but I have today sent an email to Bosch directly and told them about the problem.
As I said , I am a lawyer, but I doubt if I can go to local court against Bosch, because if you buy a Jaguar and are not satisfied with the structure of the leather seats you can hardly go to the city court and sue the farmer who fed the cow.
As you mentioned we also in Norway , have a rule that says you have a warranty for 5 years in product that is expected to live for more than 5 years
such as a freezer, but not a pair of shoes
Best regards Arne

 

[jonathan75]

I think that I must relate to my dealer. And I have no problems with him.

That sounds a good idea. That sounds your safest bet.

I doubt if I can go to local court against Bosch, because if you buy a Jaguar and are not satisfied with the structure of the leather seats you can hardly go to the city court and sue the farmer who fed the cow.

Good point - I was confused. I meant the manufacturer which made a promise (a 'manufacturer's warranty') that the product would be good for a short period e.g. 1 year. I thought it was Bosch but I realise Bosch don't make whole eBikes.

Normally a Jaguar is sold by a dealer, and there are two contracts (this is useful for you and others to know). The first contract is that between you and the dealer, that everything will be good for up to e.g. six years. The second is between you and Jaguar that the car will be good for three years, and if anything goes wrong, Jaguar will fix it at their cost. Even the leather on the seats ;-)

As you mentioned we also in Norway , have a rule that says you have a warranty for 5 years in product that is expected to live for more than 5 years
such as a freezer, but not a pair of shoes
Best regards Arne

It is the same in the UK, but it's calculated by price, so a cheap freezer will not have to last long, but an expensive freezer will have to last a very long time.

Good luck with this!

All best, Jonathan

 

[Arne Hafskjer]

That sounds a good idea. That sounds your safest bet.



Good point - I was confused. I meant the manufacturer which made a promise (a 'manufacturer's warranty') that the product would be good for a short period e.g. 1 year. I thought it was Bosch but I realise Bosch don't make whole eBikes.

Normally a Jaguar is sold by a dealer, and there are two contracts (this is useful for you and others to know). The first contract is that between you and the dealer, that everything will be good for up to e.g. six years. The second is between you and Jaguar that the car will be good for three years, and if anything goes wrong, Jaguar will fix it at their cost. Even the leather on the seats ;-)



It is the same in the UK, but it's calculated by price, so a cheap freezer will not have to last long, but an expensive freezer will have to last a very long time.

Good luck with this!

All best, Jonathan

Thank you Jonathan ! I will now await the response from my dealer and eventual Bosch before I do anything more.
Best regards Arne