Best Budget Kit and a few questions?

[cathl]

Hi, I'm a new user here, we've had a Cyclotricity Stealth for a few years now and are about to embark on our first conversion, so I've come here for some advice

Basically looking for the best budget kit to go onto an old Marin full suspension bike for a bit of off roading...

I got the Marin from eBay it looks decent can't wait to get started! We've been looking at Panda conversion kits after reading a thread on here. Ideally budget £300-400 for the lot including battery. Any advice gratefully received!

Ideally looking at min 10ah battery, open to suggestions on front/rear wheel options - rear looks harder to fit is that correct? Can't work out how to keep the gears?

Not sure we'll fit a bottle battery onto the frame as it's one of those triangular style frames (don't know the name) so looking at a "frog" seat post one - any pros/cons to these?

Do I get variable pedal assist with an LCD screen?

Not sure I need a throttle but can't see a kit without one - any reason for this?

Many thanks!

 

[Alan Quay]

Rear hub motors all have either a cassette (usually 8 or more gears) or freewheel (usually 7 or less) fitting, so you just put your old gears on the new motor. You will probably have to adjust the derailleur once fitted. All this means that a rear kit requires a bit more time and a few more tools than a front.

For off roading a frog type battery is a bad idea. From what I've heard the bracket always snaps, and off roading won't help with that.

Post a pic of the bike to help us to help you.

Full suspension conversions are normally the hardest due to the lack of triangle space. It may be possible to rivnut the battery on to the top tube though....

As far as throttle/PAS goes, don't worry. You can fit both or either, up to you.

 

[cathl]

Thanks Alan, this is the bike:

Dad and brother are MTB nuts so lots of tools and expertise available. We've sat our old bottle batteries on the top tube and there is just about enough room for the bracket but it's tight. Dad reckons he can make a plate to sit on the existing rivnuts and attach it to that... Looking at the squarer bottle battery that slides on and off I don't think there's enough room to slide it The round bottle ones that clip in should be OK.

Any recommendations on which kit to go for?

 

[Alan Quay]

Choice of kit depends on how fast you want to go, how far, how heavy and how many gears you have.

 

[cathl]

OK - fast as I can! Definitely don't want it limited.
The 25 miles the smaller bottle batteries do is OK - obviously if I can get better great, but not seen anything better in my budget range so far
Heavy - I'm heavy, let's not talk about that I'm 6ft tall anyway. Currently got a 36v/15ah Cyclotricity battery on the Stealth and I'm getting about 40 miles out of it on the flat trails (my husband takes this one when we go up the hills and he's lighter than me so not got anything to compare to there)
The bike has 24 gears.
Ta

 

[Alan Quay]

At your budget, fast as you can is really only 15-18 mph anyway. With 24 gears (8 speed cassette I'd guess) you have to make a choice. You can get a cassette motor which limits your choice, or a freewheel motor and set up your changers for 7 speed, loosing a position. You will need to get hold of a 7 speed freewheel in addition.

 

[RobF]

Thanks Alan, this is the bike:

Dad and brother are MTB nuts so lots of tools and expertise available. We've sat our old bottle batteries on the top tube and there is just about enough room for the bracket but it's tight. Dad reckons he can make a plate to sit on the existing rivnuts and attach it to that... Looking at the squarer bottle battery that slides on and off I don't think there's enough room to slide it The round bottle ones that clip in should be OK.

Any recommendations on which kit to go for?

The bike looks in good nick.

That's a very long stem on the handlebars, probably because the bike was a bit too small for the previous owner.

Nothing wrong with it, but the steering won't be very precise.

Most mountain bikers prefer a short stem because it gives direct, sharp, steering.

Might be a good idea to fit a shorter one, assuming the bike will still fit you with a shorter reach.

 

[D C]

looking at a "frog" seat post one - any pros/cons to these?

Most definitely cons, particularly if you are fairly heavy yourself.
I fitted a seat post rack battery to a suspension bike and the weight of the battery (plus me) put so much leverage and strain on the seat tube that the frame cracked at the weld at the top of the seat tube, that was with a 10ah rack battery weighing 4 kilos.
As Alan has said, quite a few folk have also had problems with the frog batteries, do a search of some older posts on here.
I know it's not what you want to hear but I feel from personal experience that you may save a lot of heartache by using a different bike, it would be a shame to spoil what looks like a very nice bike.
Dave.

 

[cathl]

At your budget, fast as you can is really only 15-18 mph anyway. With 24 gears (8 speed cassette I'd guess) you have to make a choice. You can get a cassette motor which limits your choice, or a freewheel motor and set up your changers for 7 speed, loosing a position. You will need to get hold of a 7 speed freewheel in addition.

Thanks Alan

 

[cathl]

The bike looks in good nick.

That's a very long stem on the handlebars, probably because the bike was a bit too small for the previous owner.

Nothing wrong with it, but the steering won't be very precise.

Most mountain bikers prefer a short stem because it gives direct, sharp, steering.

Might be a good idea to fit a shorter one, assuming the bike will still fit you with a shorter reach.

Thanks Rob - I like the longer reach, I've had a shorter one and hated it. My shoulders are knackered and the wider reach eases that.

 

[cathl]

Most definitely cons, particularly if you are fairly heavy yourself.
I fitted a seat post rack battery to a suspension bike and the weight of the battery (plus me) put so much leverage and strain on the seat tube that the frame cracked at the weld at the top of the seat tube, that was with a 10ah rack battery weighing 4 kilos.
As Alan has said, quite a few folk have also had problems with the frog batteries, do a search of some older posts on here.
I know it's not what you want to hear but I feel from personal experience that you may save a lot of heartache by using a different bike, it would be a shame to spoil what looks like a very nice bike.
Dave.

Thanks Dave, the bike cost me £156 so I'm quite happy to spoil it, it was a last minute impulse bid to be honest and I didn't have time to do any research, I wasn't really expecting to win it. It looks better in the pics than it does in real life.

Will avoid the frog then. I reckon we can get a bottle onto that top tube. Are there any other reasons not to use this bike?

 

[Yamdude]

Definitely not a bike i would use for a conversion, thats not to say it cant be done, but its far from suitable.
Full sussers are heavy even before a kit is added, the rear suspension soaks up pedal power so the kit will use more battery power to compensate. But the main problem is that the only place to fit a battery is on top of the top tube.... this is going to make the bike really top heavy, added to the other cons of a full susser it wont be a nice bike to ride.
If it were me, i wouldn't use it at all and get a hardtail where the battery can be fixed lower down in the frame.

 

[cathl]

Definitely not a bike i would use for a conversion, thats not to say it cant be done, but its far from suitable.
Full sussers are heavy even before a kit is added, the rear suspension soaks up pedal power so the kit will use more battery power to compensate. But the main problem is that the only place to fit a battery is on top of the top tube.... this is going to make the bike really top heavy, added to the other cons of a full susser it wont be a nice bike to ride.
If it were me, i wouldn't use it at all and get a hardtail where the battery can be fixed lower down in the frame.

Thanks but I love full suspension - it's definitely a requirement of my new bike

It weighs 13kg, the Panda kit weighs 12kg taking the total to 25kg, I was happy with that.

 

[cathl]

Don't forget guys this is a budget thing to mess about with - not looking to win any prizes for best conversion

 

[Yamdude]

Thanks but I love full suspension - it's definitely a requirement of my new bike

It weighs 13kg, the Panda kit weighs 12kg taking the total to 25kg, I was happy with that.

Obviously you're set on using this bike, so carry on, its you that'll be riding it.
The cheapest kit, with a small 9amp/hr battery is going to be about £430.... so with the cost of the bike, you'll be around, or just under £600. If you're happy with that, go ahead.
Can get kits of this price from 8fun, or Electric Bike Conversions on Ebay.

 

[cathl]

Obviously you're set on using this bike, so carry on, its you that'll be riding it.
The cheapest kit, with a small 9amp/hr battery is going to be about £430.... so with the cost of the bike, you'll be around, or just under £600. If you're happy with that, go ahead.
Can get kits of this price from 8fun, or Electric Bike Conversions on Ebay.

No not set on this bike but am set on full suspension

Happy to sell this bike and get another full suspension within budget.

Budget was £500, but as the cost of the kit seems to be fixed I will have to go to £600 or sell this bike and try to find one for £50

 

[Yamdude]

No not set on this bike but am set on full suspension

Happy to sell this bike and get another full suspension within budget.

Budget was £500, but as the cost of the kit seems to be fixed I will have to go to £600 or sell this bike and try to find one for £50

Why are you so set on full suss ?
Full suss bikes are for serious off roading and downhilling..... and for that you need proper quality suspension.

 

[cathl]

Why are you so set on full suss ?
Full suss bikes are for serious off roading and downhilling..... and for that you need proper quality suspension.

Because it's so much more comfortable. Maybe I just have really sensitive private parts who knows. I saw an article in the news recently about the damage done to the Olympic female cyclists private areas and how some had to have saddles specially made.

We current have at home: no suspension, hard tail and full suspension. I've ridden them all and get pain on all other than a full suspension.

Before you tell me to get a new saddle I have a lovely ladies saddle with loads of padding and I've tried it on all 3 bikes: The suspension makes a difference and I want to keep it.

 

[Yamdude]

Because it's so much more comfortable. Maybe I just have really sensitive private parts who knows. I saw an article in the news recently about the damage done to the Olympic female cyclists private areas and how some had to have saddles specially made.

We current have at home: no suspension, hard tail and full suspension. I've ridden them all and get pain on all other than a full suspension.

Before you tell me to get a new saddle I have a lovely ladies saddle with loads of padding and I've tried it on all 3 bikes: The suspension makes a difference and I want to keep it.

Have you not heard of suspension seat posts ?
They work just as well as cheap rear suspension, with none of the cons that come with cheap rear suspension.
Plus fatter tyres and lower psi for an even more smooth ride.

 

[cathl]

Yes, and I have tried those too. I'm not using cheap rear suspension I'm riding a Boardman full suspension bike. Obviously I'm not going to 'ruin' the Boardman, so an old Marin is the best budget alternative. And guess what, I can put a suspension seat post and fat tyres on that to help even more.

You're starting to get a bit rude now with the 'have you not heard of...' patronising comment.

How about you either believe me when I say full suspension helps with the pain and help me convert a full suspension bike, or go and unproductively question someone else's genital pain on another thread.