brompton - electric or not

[flecc]

I haven't seen my A to B yet Stuart, and don't even know yet if the test is in this issue, since ther's a queue of tests around.

That 14.4 kilos I mentioned before it seems may not include the battery they had with it, since that's carried in the separate front bag, so it might be back to being a bit too heavy for carrying far.

I'll mail you as promised Leonardo, either with the test, or to let you know it's not in the magazine yet.
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[coops]

oops, sorry - didn't mean it as a spoiler, just I read a thread with some information in it from the review & thought you must have read it... I think the total bike weight they gave was 18.8kg, including battery. I can post a link to the thread if you like?

Stuart.

 

[flecc]

No, it's not a spoiler Stuart, doesn't matter where the info comes from. I'll probably get the mag tomorrow.
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[Leonardo]

In the meantime I’ve asked some information. They sell the kit with the modified forks, the motor fitted into the wheel and the 7ah battery li-po at £ 625 without the front luggage, but they are also available to supply the complete bicycle (following the delivery time of the Brompton). I ask myself
which model of Brompton is the ideal one for this kind of electrification. Above all with which gearing. I was thinking to buy a M6L with the 12% gearing reduction for muscular use, but I wonder if with the motor wouldn’t be enough a normal 3 speeds without reduction.

 

[nigel]

Nigel

What a great review by A&B for the brompton NANO maybe at last we will have a decent electric folder on our hands with good power + distance + and hill climbing must nearly be the perfect electric folder NIGEL

 

[danieldrough]

Leonardo

I bought the 3 speed Bromptom. I found that it was geared too high, so I fitted the reduction chainwheel. I still found it lacking in range so I then fitted the 6 speed conversion (supplier:Whites) replacing the standard Brompton sprockets with Highpath Engineering's 12/18 welded sprocket. The bike is lovely to ride now with only the steepest hills a problem. I think it would be awesome with the electric motor.

Hoping this helps.

Steve

 

[coops]

Nigel, I haven't read the review: what does it say the power & hillclimbing ability of this bike is, and do the AtoB reviewers specify how much of each comes from the bike and how much from the rider? As I said, the figures I've seen for 16% gradients aren't realistic unless the motor:rider power input is around 1:1?

Leonardo, I should tell you that these two threads raise questions for me over the reliability and hillclimbing ability of the motor, . I don't know the accuracy or truth of what is said.

Stuart.

 

[flecc]

I've read it Stuart and A to B say it's very competent on hills. Of course David is a very strong rider, but he says a restart on 1 in 6 is quite possible, so it must be pretty good. I've scanned and mailed it to Leonardo in Italy so he should have the test information now.

 

[flecc]

I should tell you that these two threads raise questions for me over the reliability and hillclimbing ability of the motor, . I don't know the accuracy or truth of what is said.

Stuart.

Those wouldn't surprise me Stuart. Personally I don't like the powerband on that motor, the peak sitting too high for my liking. It seems it will pull at low climb speeds, but is very energy wasteful then. A to B got an extraordinary 48 miles range, but their area is very flat and they did say that with less rider help it could have been as little as 20 miles.
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[coops]

The information on top speed and peak torque speed in the thread I said I came across the other day, were in line with what I'd expect, and I agree on the likelihood of energy waste on hills.

I also expected the usual flattish AtoB test area must have been used for that range. I think it would struggle in hills without major rider help and with motor energy inefficiency, 20 miles on that battery size would be optimistic. Plus you'd be tired out. Reminds me of another, faster bike with a powerband too high for big hills... except that one can do 20mph+ on the flat!

Stuart.

 

[Leonardo]

Many thanks Steve, Stuart and Flecc. All very precious info. Now I have to think and study... and to earn some money as well if I still want that bike, since prices are unfortunately higher than reported by A-to-B!

 

[flecc]

Yes Leonardo, as I read the A to B report, I thought those prices seemed too good to be true. I didn't see how Tony Castles, the chap who is producing this, could possibly make a profit on them, or even break even.

A to B used to be the Folding Society magazine, so they have a strong folding bike bias, and have for years wanted a good folding electric that could be carried. They are also fans of Brompton folders, and turned up at the Presteigne e-bike rally as a party of four all coming by train with their Bromptons!

So I think enthusiasm might have meant them getting carried away on the details.

Let's just say they want it to be successful.
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[coops]

You're most welcome as ever Leonardo . And congratulations on becoming a senior member now .

Stuart.

 

[flecc]

Careful Stuart, the power might go to Leonardo's head!
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[coops]

Careful Stuart, the power might go to Leonardo's head!

The latest updated AtoB bike price guide has it listed as a conversion kit, is that right?

 

[Leonardo]

Mmm…Senior member: I’m quite proud of it. I’ll make an effort to remain the same as I was though!

AtoB price guide is wrong unfortunately: the price nano-motor sent me is £ 629.69 + shipping, i.e. 26% more than reported. If I follow my plan and Steve’s suggestion and take a 6 speeds Brompton with gearing reduction and the front luggage for storing the battery, the total would be more than £ 1300 for the complete bicycle. It is still less than a Flyer Faltrad (by the way, I think that A-to-B should test this brand: the folding is very similar to the old Panasonic and better I think than the Dahon Roo-El) but weight is comparable: the Brompton folds much better and splitting the weight can be an advantage, but I think it cannot beat the uphill ability and the comfort of the other one… Anyway a super-folding like the Nano-Brompton would be a much more sensible add-on to my Giant Twist.

I have to understand better. In Italy we have now a new brand (it says to be Belgian) called E-Move, which I suspect to use the same Tongxin motor (it pretends to be a 250W but I don’t believe it): its folding Mini-Move seems to be not so bad but hill-climbing is not its argument… I’ve also found this blog which could be interesting to follow.

@ flecc: I don’t know the Boulton folders, may be you have a link?

 

[flecc]

@ flecc: I don’t know the Boulton folders, may be you have a link?

Apologies for that Leonardo, it was a mistake. I'd just been involved with a matter concerning a Boulton company and absent mindedly typed Boulton. It should have been Brompton of course. I've edited out the mistake.

The Flyer Faltrad is interesting but would be too expensive here, probably twice the price of the tested Brompton-Nano. It's the same with all those models. I think it would have a short range too, perhaps 30 km at best?
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[Leonardo]

I think the Faltrad should cost auround £ 1600 in your country Flecc, so very expensive but not so much more than the Nano-Brompton. The size folded, the weight which is not splitted as the Nano and the lack of a towing system like the rollers on the Brompton, make it however much less suitable for intermodal commuting. Even tough "cyclistic" may be not at the same level of a Brompton, overall quality is very good and you know better than me the advantages of the crank drive Panasonic unit. Reports of its use that we have on our Italian forum attest a surprisingly good range of more than 40 km, in a collaborative pedelec use of course .

 

[Miles]

Leonardo,

Nothing else folds quite as compactly as the Brompton (I have an S2XL), but you might like to have a look at other folders. The new Bike Friday Tikit, the Pacy, the Birdy, the GoBike... all in some ways easier to electrify than the Brom....

Miles

 

[flecc]

Reports of its use that we have on our Italian forum attest a surprisingly good range of more than 40 km, in a collaborative pedelec use of course .

That 40 km does look good Leonardo. I was going by the older tests on the Panasonic folder which seems to use the same battery size but is reported to have the lower range, plus the Twist with larger battery which only does about 35 km at best. Maybe Panasonic has improved that since.
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