Comparing lights

[danielrlee]

A topic of discussion that crops up regularly is that of lights. There is such a bewildering variety available and new lights seem to appear on the market weekly. Now, we all know that manufacturers/retailers claims of lighting power varies from truthful to outright deceitful, so unless you have multiple lights available in front of you, it is impossible to compare them.

I've been thinking about this problem as of late and I would like to suggest a standardised method of comparison that we can use to compare them. Using a camera that allows full manual control, a pre-agreed set of camera settings can be used that allows us to compare photos of a light projection that are of equal EV (exposure values).

As a starting point, I suggest the following parameters:

• Shutter speed: 1/60th second
• Aperture: f/5.6
• ISO: 1600

Of these three parameters, the one that might prove tricky is the aperture. Cheap cameras tend to not support wide apertures. I have chosen f/5.6, as even with the cheapest of lenses, this value should be available at any reasonable focal length, on any camera that allows manual control. I have chosen the other two parameters to allow a reasonable range of luminosity (we are talking only artificial light sources, after all) to be recorded with a single EV.

This would only leave two variables; height of the light source and angle of projection. We could attempt to standardise these, but in the grand scheme of things, they shouldn't affect the final image too much, so we'd probably be better to keep things simple and not try to do so.

Finally, if not already obvious, light projections can only be captured on the horizontal plane (the ground). After all, a wall lit from close up would appear brighter than one lit from afar.

Does anyone have any thoughts about the proposed system, either generally, or specific issues?

 

[LeighPing]

Does anyone have any thoughts about the proposed system, either generally, or specific issues?

You make taking a photo an art-form. That's a bit of a mission and too complicated for me. Anyway, I'm not even sure if my camera can do all that. I'm going to have to stick to videoing it, through the woods, at night.

 

[soundwave]

cant find shutter speed on mine?

 

[soundwave]

ok got it now led flash light.

cree x3

 

[signwave]

ok got it now led flash light.

cree x3

It's close, but I reckon the cree x3 wins.

 

[EddiePJ]

Does anyone have any thoughts about the proposed system, either generally, or specific issues?

Only that it is an ill conceived idea, which unless shot in a controlled environment indoors, is impossible to implement.

You haven't taken into account location in relation to light pollution, weather conditions, light level V time of evening, or time of month/year in relation to level of darkness.

Next!

 

[danielrlee]

Only that it is an ill conceived idea, which unless shot in a controlled environment indoors, is impossible to implement.

You haven't taken into account location in relation to light pollution, weather conditions, light level V time of evening, or time of month/year in relation to level of darkness.

Next!

Have you tried it? Don't write off the idea too quickly!

I forgot to say in my initial post that 'darkness' will be required. An exposure value was chosen that will render your average streetlight in near darkness (nothing set in stone, so this can be changed if we need to do so), so unless you want to capture a pound shop flashlight, there should be plenty of dynamic range available when it comes to capturing the modern, high intensity lighting we are seeing nowadays.

 

[danielrlee]

You make taking a photo an art-form. That's a bit of a mission and too complicated for me. Anyway, I'm not even sure if my camera can do all that. I'm going to have to stick to videoing it, through the woods, at night.

Photography is an art form (well, part art, part science). It's not complicated though. If your camera supports manual exposures, it shouldn't take longer than 10-15 seconds to select the correct parameters.

 

[RobF]

No need for a league table, it's quite simple.

Those of us with an eye for quality buy proper bicycle lights from respected manufacturers such as Lezyne.

The rest buy the cheap and nasty Chinese lights recommended by d8 - and hope charging them doesn't burn their house down.

 

[danielrlee]

No need for a league table, it's quite simple.

Those of us with an eye for quality buy proper bicycle lights from respected manufacturers such as Lezyne.

The rest buy the cheap and nasty Chinese lights recommended by d8 - and hope charging them doesn't burn their house down.

Still doesn't help the 'difficulty with comparisons' situation that I'm trying to address, does it though? It almost seems that you don't want to be able to compare your overpriced light source with any other, but I guess it's an expensive truth. Any constructive criticism that you can offer is appreciated, but that is just plain unhelpful.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Those of us with an eye for quality buy proper bicycle lights from respected manufacturers such as Lezyne.

The rest buy the cheap and nasty Chinese lights recommended by d8 - and hope charging them doesn't burn their house down.

Biased and hysterical comments!

Where do you get the idea that these lights are nasty? Did you try one? Did you suffer from delusions and heard it calling you names or telling you to do bad things.

Where do you think Lezyne lights are made?

Many forum members buy their lights directly from China or from Ebay re-sellers. Can you name one who burnt down his house by charging one?

Naturally, we hope that we don't burn down our houses by charging our electrical stuff, but does that stop people from buying iphones, for which there's lots of examples of them catching fire when being charged.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=iphone+catches+fire&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwifpvnw0t7OAhVlIsAKHYxsBvcQsAQIHQ&biw=1280&bih=595

Do people worry about what laptop brand to buy?

http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1042700/dell-laptop-explodes-japanese-conference

You can find examples of just about anything catching fire, just the same as you can find many examples of people being run over by a bus or stabbed by a terrorist. Life is dangerous. Luckily, the risk of any of those things happening to us is fairly small - including Chinese lights.

 

[RobF]

Still doesn't help the 'difficulty with comparisons' situation that I'm trying to address, does it though? It almost seems that you don't want to be able to compare your overpriced light source with any other, but I guess it's an expensive truth. Any constructive criticism that you can offer is appreciated, but that is just plain unhelpful.

Biased and hysterical comments!

Where do you get the idea that these lights are nasty? Did you try one? Did you suffer from delusions and heard it calling you names or telling you to do bad things.

Where do you think Lezyne lights are made?

Many forum members buy their lights directly from China or from Ebay re-sellers. Can you name one who burnt down his house by charging one?

Naturally, we hope that we don't burn down our houses by charging our electrical stuff, but does that stop people from buying iphones, for which there's lots of examples of them catching fire when being charged.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=iphone+catches+fire&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwifpvnw0t7OAhVlIsAKHYxsBvcQsAQIHQ&biw=1280&bih=595

Do people worry about what laptop brand to buy?

http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1042700/dell-laptop-explodes-japanese-conference

You can find examples of just about anything catching fire, just the same as you can find many examples of people being run over by a bus or stabbed by a terrorist. Life is dangerous. Luckily, the risk of any of those things happening to us is fairly small - including Chinese lights.

The pair of you need to lighten (ho-ho) up a little bit.

Or has the sense of humour ban in the Brexit thread been extended to the rest of the forum?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Hmm! We didn't really read your post as light-hearted, but if that's how you meant it, apology accepted and given.

 

[RobF]

Hmm! We didn't really read your post as light-hearted, but if that's how you meant it, apology accepted and given.

No worries, Dave.

As with all my attempts at humour there is an element of seriousness.

If you say a Chinese light provides a good beam at a decent price, I believe it.

But I do wonder about the longevity of the components.

In my experience, paying a bit more generally gets you something that is better made and lasts longer.

However, I do have a bargain contribution to make.

This front light has been well recommended elsewhere, and while the fifty quid list price may be taken with a pinch of salt, it looks pretty good to me for £8.

http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/LISMLU60/smart-lunar-60-lux-front-light?source=affwin&awc=6502_1472211477_1088bd8de34d18c5a4cb30d3ae2589e3&utm_source=affiliatewindow

 

[KirstinS]

No worries, Dave.

As with all my attempts at humour there is an element of seriousness.

If you say a Chinese light provides a good beam at a decent price, I believe it.

But I do wonder about the longevity of the components.

In my experience, paying a bit more generally gets you something that is better made and lasts longer.

However, I do have a bargain contribution to make.

This front light has been well recommended elsewhere, and while the fifty quid list price may be taken with a pinch of salt, it looks pretty good to me for £8.

http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/LISMLU60/smart-lunar-60-lux-front-light?source=affwin&awc=6502_1472211477_1088bd8de34d18c5a4cb30d3ae2589e3&utm_source=affiliatewindow

I'm will start my third season of winter commuting on cheap Chinese cree light. Frankly it lights up the sun and is way too bright. I use it pointed down to bathe me in light or for South Downs night rides.

About 12 quid from memory and has out shined and outlasted a cateye and knog and an exposure flare.

 

[EddiePJ]

Have you tried it? Don't write off the idea too quickly!

I owe you an apology for my completely ignorant and terse reply, so sorry about that.

You actually got me thinking and I know how I can get this to work.

On the screen shot below just off centre is an old cricket pitch that is no longer used and has become very over grown and secluded. It is set in a hollow and the light pollution level is probably going to be as low as you are going to get in the South East.
I won't do this until say November, but my plan would be to set up a tripod at handle bar level, and onto it mount a tubular T piece that lights could be mounted to.
Using a second tripod for the camera, I could then take a series of timed remote shots, all on the same evening and all within relative minutes of each other. I would place markers at say 2 metre intervals working away from the light source, and hopefully an accurate gauge of a lights beam, could be achieved.

I have plenty of lights to choose from, and being up for a challenge, it is even something that I will get enjoyment from doing.

The one downside at the moment, is that I had my camera stolen on the way back through France a couple of weeks ago, and I now need to replace it. Currently I am considering a Nikon D5300.

edit... I am thinking of something similar to the 1.00min point in the misleading promo clip of my Fenix BT20.

What I have always found odd about the above clip, is that my light beam is broader than shown, and the light has more of softer almost yellow tint, not the bright white as shown. I personally don't like the bright white light of many lights, but this isn't the thread to discuss that.

 

[soundwave]

i have the d3200 its a bit of a brick to carry around tho as its not light and the shutter is loud.

if you want to take action shots pic after pic then will need a fast mem card or it can take a few mins for the pics to buffer.

 

[IR772]

No need for a league table, it's quite simple.

Those of us with an eye for quality buy proper bicycle lights from respected manufacturers such as Lezyne.

The rest buy the cheap and nasty Chinese lights recommended by d8 - and hope charging them doesn't burn their house down.

Does Moon count as respected as it is expensive or nasty Chinese as that's where its made.

The boast on a Moon is that it's designed in Hong Kong. I must say that this is the first time I have heard such a credit, I suppose similar to German engineering?

 

[mw1]

The boast on a Moon is that it's designed in Hong Kong. I must say that this is the first time I have heard such a credit, I suppose similar to German engineering?

The headstock badge on an Izip mountain trailz proudly proclaims that they are designed in California....

Mark

 

[soundwave]

took a pic with those settings and it comes out like this out side?