Cyclematic powerplus power problem

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
Hi any help would be greatly appreciated I have a powerplus model and everything was working fine until yesterday when there was no power opened where the control unit is and saw these wires like this any ideas what the problem could be ie control unit or anything else tested the wires from the battery terminals and they are ok
 

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vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
6,194
2,274
Basildon
Those connectors are not very good. I've seen that many times. It can happen if one is loose, if you go up a long steep hill too slowly, or if the motor connector isn't fully in.

There are two versions of the Cyclamatic Power Plus. One had a connector underneath the right hand chain-stay and the other didn't, so have a look, and if you have one, make sure it's fully in and the contacts are clean.

Test if your bike is working with those three motor phase wires kept separated.

The yellow wire that's come adrift only works the LEDs in the throttle, so it's not important for now.
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
Those connectors are not very good. I've seen that many times. It can happen if one is loose, if you go up a long steep hill too slowly, or if the motor connector isn't fully in.

There are two versions of the Cyclamatic Power Plus. One had a connector underneath the right hand chain-stay and the other didn't, so have a look, and if you have one, make sure it's fully in and the contacts are clean.

Test if your bike is working with those three motor phase wires kept separated.

The yellow wire that's come adrift only works the LEDs in the throttle, so it's not important for now.
thank you for replying ive got the one with the connector by the chain-stay checked it and it looks ok pushed all connectors in to make sure they are connected. what would your suggestion be in doing just changing the connectors or the control unit. All the three connectors go to the motor connector the battery works when off the bike and lights up on the battery but dosnt when it is connected to the bike and nothing works. The motor did turn until it just suddenly stopped
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
6,194
2,274
Basildon
thank you for replying ive got the one with the connector by the chain-stay checked it and it looks ok pushed all connectors in to make sure they are connected. what would your suggestion be in doing just changing the connectors or the control unit. All the three connectors go to the motor connector the battery works when off the bike and lights up on the battery but dosnt when it is connected to the bike and nothing works. The motor did turn until it just suddenly stopped
That's bad news. It sounds like you've blown a mosfet or two in the controller, which is shorting out the battery as soon as you connect it. When the motor phase wires touch, blown mosfets is often the result.

The only problem now is that we don't know what caused the connectors to melt. It could be the result of another fault, so we need to test both the motor and the controller to see what needs to be sorted,

You will need a digital multi-meter to do the tests, so get one if you haven't got one. They're about £5 to £10 on Ebay.

Test 1. Disconnect everything from the controller. Measure the resistance between the black battery wire and each of the three motor phase wires. Each reading should be the same and somewhere around 7k to 14k. The exact result isn't important as long as you get the same for each. Repeat with the red battery wire to get another three results. Sometimes, the main capacitor in the controller causes the reading to continually climb or fall. That doesn't matter as long as all three do the same.

Test 2. You need to test that the motor hall sensors are switching, which will be tricky as you can't connect your battery. Basically, you need to apply 5v to the thin red and black wires in the 6-way white block connector, then measure the voltage on each of the other three between them and the black wire, while you rotate the wheel backwards. You should see the 5v switching on and off as the wheel rotates.

It might be worth getting one of these, which will make testing of the hall sensors and the motor very easy:
UK supplier
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
That's bad news. It sounds like you've blown a mosfet or two in the controller, which is shorting out the battery as soon as you connect it. When the motor phase wires touch, blown mosfets is often the result.

The only problem now is that we don't know what caused the connectors to melt. It could be the result of another fault, so we need to test both the motor and the controller to see what needs to be sorted,

You will need a digital multi-meter to do the tests, so get one if you haven't got one. They're about £5 to £10 on Ebay.

Test 1. Disconnect everything from the controller. Measure the resistance between the black battery wire and each of the three motor phase wires. Each reading should be the same and somewhere around 7k to 14k. The exact result isn't important as long as you get the same for each. Repeat with the red battery wire to get another three results. Sometimes, the main capacitor in the controller causes the reading to continually climb or fall. That doesn't matter as long as all three do the same.

Test 2. You need to test that the motor hall sensors are switching, which will be tricky as you can't connect your battery. Basically, you need to apply 5v to the thin red and black wires in the 6-way white block connector, then measure the voltage on each of the other three between them and the black wire, while you rotate the wheel backwards. You should see the 5v switching on and off as the wheel rotates.

It might be worth getting one of these, which will make testing of the hall sensors and the motor very easy:
UK supplier
ordered one of them testers as it will come in handy if i get other bikes. The bike did start moving on its own without pedaling or using the throttle when i had stopped at a junction if i do need a controller do you know where i can get one from seen this on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cyclamatic-Power-Plus-motor-controller-unit-breaking-bike/154109511623?_trkparms=aid=111001&algo=REC.SEED&ao=1&asc=225076&meid=70e6727e7d134eacbfcd522c34377cf1&pid=100667&rk=1&rkt=8&mehot=none&sd=154109511623&itm=154109511623&pmt=0&noa=1&pg=2334524&brand=Cyclamatic&_trksid=p2334524.c100667.m2042
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
6,194
2,274
Basildon
ordered one of them testers as it will come in handy if i get other bikes. The bike did start moving on its own without pedaling or using the throttle when i had stopped at a junction if i do need a controller do you know where i can get one from seen this on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cyclamatic-Power-Plus-motor-controller-unit-breaking-bike/154109511623?_trkparms=aid=111001&algo=REC.SEED&ao=1&asc=225076&meid=70e6727e7d134eacbfcd522c34377cf1&pid=100667&rk=1&rkt=8&mehot=none&sd=154109511623&itm=154109511623&pmt=0&noa=1&pg=2334524&brand=Cyclamatic&_trksid=p2334524.c100667.m2042
Yes, I have lots of ideas of what you can do, but it's better to test everything first because that can make a difference what to choose.

£40 for a Cyclamatic controller is ridiculous. It's got to be one of the crappiest ones that you can get. You can get similar crappy ones for about £12, but Your bike will be 1000 times better if you get a decent controller. You should also be looking ahead to when your battery expires. An upgrade to 36v and a decent controller will make your bike as good as anything you can get today and better than a lot of them.
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
Yes, I have lots of ideas of what you can do, but it's better to test everything first because that can make a difference what to choose.

£40 for a Cyclamatic controller is ridiculous. It's got to be one of the crappiest ones that you can get. You can get similar crappy ones for about £12, but Your bike will be 1000 times better if you get a decent controller. You should also be looking ahead to when your battery expires. An upgrade to 36v and a decent controller will make your bike as good as anything you can get today and better than a lot of them.
il check the controller and the motor when i get the tester. The battery has only just been upgraded its still a 24v tho the person i got it off showed me the old battery if the contoller is faulty il appreciate your advise on the controller to get
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
il check the controller and the motor when i get the tester. The battery has only just been upgraded its still a 24v tho the person i got it off showed me the old battery if the contoller is faulty il appreciate your advise on the controller to get
i got the tester and attached it to the controller as it said in the instructions to the motor and controller with the red and black battery wire connected like it said. The instructions said a 5v light will light up when i turned the key but it didnt so im guessing the controller has gone. There is a red wire on the throttle and pedal assist connectors that are soldered together would i be able to put them in a connector block can you suggest a controller to get please
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
il check the controller and the motor when i get the tester. The battery has only just been upgraded its still a 24v tho the person i got it off showed me the old battery if the contoller is faulty il appreciate your advise on the controller to get
Yes, I have lots of ideas of what you can do, but it's better to test everything first because that can make a difference what to choose.

£40 for a Cyclamatic controller is ridiculous. It's got to be one of the crappiest ones that you can get. You can get similar crappy ones for about £12, but Your bike will be 1000 times better if you get a decent controller. You should also be looking ahead to when your battery expires. An upgrade to 36v and a decent controller will make your bike as good as anything you can get today and better than a lot of them.
i got the tester and attached it to the controller as it said in the instructions to the motor and controller with the red and black battery wire connected like it said. The instructions said a 5v light will light up when i turned the key but it didnt so im guessing the controller has gone. There is a red wire on the throttle and pedal assist connectors that are soldered together would i be able to put them in a connector block can you suggest a controller to get please

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vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
6,194
2,274
Basildon
i got the tester and attached it to the controller as it said in the instructions to the motor and controller with the red and black battery wire connected like it said. The instructions said a 5v light will light up when i turned the key but it didnt so im guessing the controller has gone. There is a red wire on the throttle and pedal assist connectors that are soldered together would i be able to put them in a connector block can you suggest a controller to get please

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Did the lights on the throttle light up. If not, no battery power was connected. Don't start jumping to conclusions, it will only slow you down.

The two wires soldered together are the 5v to power the pedal sensor. The 5v comes from the red wire from the controller that is connected to the throttle. It goes up to the red switch and then back down the grey (white?) wire to the red one connected to the pedal sensor. It's an unusual arrangement, presumably to use the red switch to switch the PAS on and off.
 
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gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
Did the lights on the throttle light up. If not, no battery power was connected. Don't start jumping to conclusions, it will only slow you down.

The two wires soldered together are the 5v to power the pedal sensor. The 5v comes from the red wire from the controller that is connected to the throttle. It goes up to the red switch and then back down the grey (white?) wire to the red one connected to the pedal sensor. It's an unusual arrangement, presumably to use the red switch to switch the PAS on and off.
Hi no there was no lights on the throttle would I be better just changing the controller as it looks to be the original one that was on the bike
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
6,194
2,274
Basildon
There's nothing yet to indicate that anything is wrong with the controller. If the throttle doesn't light up, it shows that you have a problem somewhere else. Until you fix it, a new controller will be a waste of money and time. The problem is between your battery and the controller.

Check the fuse in the battery and measure the voltage between the outer two terminals underneath.
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
There's nothing yet to indicate that anything is wrong with the controller. If the throttle doesn't light up, it shows that you have a problem somewhere else. Until you fix it, a new controller will be a waste of money and time. The problem is between your battery and the controller.

Check the fuse in the battery and measure the voltage between the outer two terminals underneath.
The battery lights up when it is not connected to the bike tho so surely the fuse is ok? And I tested where the battery connects to the terminals on the bike and there was a continuous circuit on the bike terminals The motor did try turning before then just cut out that was before I got the tester tho
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
There's nothing yet to indicate that anything is wrong with the controller. If the throttle doesn't light up, it shows that you have a problem somewhere else. Until you fix it, a new controller will be a waste of money and time. The problem is between your battery and the controller.

Check the fuse in the battery and measure the voltage between the outer two terminals underneath.
i have taken the battery off the bike and tested it without being switched on. There is no volts but when i turn the key on there is 29 volts. Also there is no display unit. This is making me think that it is the control unit as i have done what you have told me to.

any more advice would be a great help
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
6,194
2,274
Basildon
I've already told you, if the throttle lights don't light up, it's nothing to do with the controller. The black and yellow wires that go to the throttle and power those lights are connected directly to the main battery wires that go into the controller.

Put the battery back, switch it on and measure the voltage on the bullet connectors attached to the thick red and black wires.
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
i dont have any lights on the throttle tho pal at all the bike only has pedal assist and a twist throttle with no lights on it at all
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
6,194
2,274
Basildon
A standard Cyclamatic Power Plus has a half-width throttle with a red switch and three coloured LED lights above the switch, as shown in this photo:
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
A standard Cyclamatic Power Plus has a half-width throttle with a red switch and three coloured LED lights above the switch, as shown in this photo:
Morning vfr400 as you can see from the picture my bike does not have any lights in the throttle 38865
 

gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
A standard Cyclamatic Power Plus has a half-width throttle with a red switch and three coloured LED lights above the switch, as shown in this photo:
A standard Cyclamatic Power Plus has a half-width throttle with a red switch and three coloured LED lights above the switch, as shown in this photo:
This is when the motor is turning on the tester
 

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gazza19

Pedelecer
Aug 22, 2020
56
1
Also when I do the motor winding test only the blue and yellow lights twinkle the green one does not