Cyclotricity kit, no Pas but throttle works.

[Cambiker71]

So after a huge 275 miles my cyclotricity kit has stopped working on PAS, the throttle works normally with no power loss at all, and cyclotricity have just called in the receivers, awesome.
So anyway looks like it's down to me to fix it, the little red LED flashes when turning the cranks, but nothing happens to the front wheel, all the connections are good, no damaged wiring either, battery charged, fuse ok and throttle still works.
I've bought another PAS unit from good old Amazon, slightly different set up, one of the ones that sits into the bottom brackets fitting teeth, and the square taper turns the centre part, fitted it, plugged it in, no change at all.
This PAS click me
Does that look right or is it set to go back?
So where do I go now, I'm thinking the controller may be dead? How do I check it?
Can't find one anywhere with the same part number, except for the defunct cyclotricity one, but I can find some with similar ones, same connectors etc, are all these pretty much the same assuming I match the power numbers up? None of them seem expensive.
I'm a vehicle tech with 35 odd years of experience so I'm not scared of checking or testing things to fix them rather than just playing a game of parts darts, but I've zero experience of testing these.
The wheel connection is a 9 pin, looking at previous threads these seems fairly standard as far as working goes, it's a 36v 250w front wheel kit with LCD display if it helps.
Thanks all in advance!

 

[saneagle]

Show a picture of the LCD and the label on the controller so we know what you have.

 

[Cambiker71]

This is the controller..

 

[Cambiker71]

LCD screen

Thanks for the reply too!

 

[Nealh]

Buying generic PAS may not work esp if Cyclo have change the wiring sequence , we know Cyclo use KT stuff but the KT stuff is or may be custom customer versions so they may have changed the sequence to prevent generic third party stuff working. .
Problem is with moulded connectors on the perifferal side it isn't always easy to test the sequence.

The fact the illegal throttle works (if beyond 4mph) and the PAS LED blinks on /off indicate the controller is fine .

Is the original PAS a one piece or two piece PAS ?

Did anything unusual occur ?
Bike fell over , chain came off to the inside or something get wedged between crank and PAS ?

 

[Nealh]

Your LCD1 is the basic model so one can't change any setting for a different PAS type (if used) .

 

[Cambiker71]

Buying generic PAS may not work esp if Cyclo have change the wiring sequence , we know Cyclo use KT stuff but the KT stuff is or may be custom customer versions so they may have changed the sequence to prevent generic third party stuff working. .
Problem is with moulded connectors on the perifferal side it isn't always easy to test the sequence.

The fact the illegal throttle works (if beyond 4mph) and the PAS LED blinks on /off indicate the controller is fine .

Is the original PAS a one piece or two piece PAS ?

Did anything unusual occur ?
Bike fell over , chain came off to the inside or something get wedged between crank and PAS ?

Nothing unusual happened, I noticed it wasn't cutting in and out on a ride as usual, most of the time it was fine again if I sped up a teeny bit and I was thinking I might have had some dirt on the magnets or something and I'll sort it out when I got home, but then after a quick stop to have a drink and take some pics the Pas didn't work at all, the throttle does work and yes it's illegal but it came with the kit and to be fair I hate using it so may as well just take it off and blank the connector to be fair.
I bought the kit because I had a heart attack in January and it's supposed to be helping get me back out on two wheels again with a bit less strain until my recovery moves on. The throttle was a nice thought in case I got over tired on the way home and could do a bit of plodding and still get home, but it's awful to use.
Glad I still have a Swytch conversion bike to carry on.
I do miss this one though cos it's a little more trail orientated, road riding is pretty boring to me !

So anyway, my thoughts are that the motor works and the battery works, if it came to chucking the throttle, changing the display and controller etc then that's the way to go, but there's absolutely loads of similar stuff out there which probably isn't compatible, like my new Amazon pas for example ha ha
I love the simplicity of my swytch led display, if I could replicate that it would be great, I have a Garmin for miles and speed etc so just power up and down and a battery indicator would work just fine for me.
Again though, thanks for the help and reply!

 

[Cambiker71]

Your LCD1 is the basic model so one can't change any setting for a different PAS type (if used) .

I can get into the P1 to 5 settings with a bit of press and holding buttons but to be totally honest I've no idea what they mean or do beyond looking at them.
Pretty sure the Mrs won't be overly happy if I burn the house down adjusting stuff either!

 

[Cambiker71]

Oh I forgot, the original Pas was the two semi circle, push together type with a big C clip holding the halves together, the pickup has a little bracket cable tied to the bottom of the seat tube part of the frame, the gaps were good, I took it all off cleaned it, checked the gap was close and still no go sadly.

 

[saneagle]

Oh I forgot, the original Pas was the two semi circle, push together type with a big C clip holding the halves together, the pickup has a little bracket cable tied to the bottom of the seat tube part of the frame, the gaps were good, I took it all off cleaned it, checked the gap was close and still no go sadly.

Pedal sensors are very simple and all work the same. There's a hall sensor that's supplied by 5v (2 of 3 wires), and when a magnet passes, it pulses and sends that pulse down the third wire. If it doesn't work, it's mainly because either the magnets aren't moving or a wire is broken. There's one other very common problem that people encounter when they have a KT controller: Many non-KT pedal sensors are wired incorrectly for the controller. They have the same three wires, but in a different sequence in the connector. All you have to do is cut the connectors off and join the wires in the correct sequence.

 

[Nealh]

The LCD1 is the basic model which only enables P settings , these are factory set so should need no changes.

Regards to the PAS one expects it was a set up issue , over time the two part ones with seperate sensor and disc may need checking and adjusting.
The stop start experienced is typical of this and some minor checks are needed.
I would refit the old two piec PAS and then follow the following steps , it should work again.
1. The magnet disc gap to the sensor head needs to be very close/tight approx. 1mm gap , make sure the disc isn't warped in it's rotation or cracked.
2. Check the sensor is secured and tight, one says the red LED blinks on/off so electrically the signal is fine. If signal is solid red then it isn't fine .
3. Check the disc mounting on the sq taper axle , see if it can be manually moved or rotated by hand pressure/ light to moderate force around it's axis. It should be solid and firmly fitted with no movement detected.
4. If disc can be rotated or moved by hand then it needs either replacing or securing to the axle shaft .
Clean the axle shaft with isopropal or degrease it, wrap a few winds of electrical or amalgam tape around the axle then refit the disc on to said tape. The small plastic splines over time do lose grip as they lose tension to do so, ensure the mgnet gap is 1mm to the sensor head.
5. When refitting the magnet disc check the correct face is facing out wards as the magnet poles affect the directional signal, if it doesn't work cw rotate acw to see if it works.

 

[Nealh]

That V12 one piece PAS will not work with his KT LCD1 d8veh as he is unable to change the setting in the C1.