What bike is best for learning the Knowledge of London (black cab) on?

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#1
Hello all,

Thanks for taking the time to read my post and possibly reply.

I want to start (for the third time) learning the Knowledge of London to become a black cab driver.
The reason i wont to do it on a ebike is for cost, i live near Luton and previously i had to rent a garage in Hendon which cost £150 per month plus everytime i went out generally £5-10 in fuel. So i figured get an ebike for the same price as a moped, put it in the back of my car, drive to hendon, get ebike out and go from there saving me around £200 a month.
Trouble is i know very little about ebikes but i do know what my requirements are and would appreciate some advice from some of you more experienced bikers.

Generally id need a bike that can cover around 50miles per outing but am willing to get a spare battery if req'd.
One that will go upto around 30mph, even faster would be great but not essential.
A bike that has quick release wheels (this maybe standard these days but not sure) so i can put it into the back of my car.
Comfortable, as ill be in the saddle for around 4-8 hours some days, 3-4 times a week (ouch already!).
i currently weigh about 20stone so something that will carry me!

On first look the Moustache Dimanche 28 Speed 2016 Bosch caught my eye but realise this is expensive and wondered/hoped if theyd be anything cheaper that would be just as good.

Any advice is appreciated.

Many thanks
Lee
 

paul20v

Pedelecer
Nov 18, 2015
150
20
#3
Hi
I hate too say it but the legal speed cut off point is 15.5mph so your 30mph is an illegal bike in the UK
 
Oct 25, 2006
41,344
2,119
#4
Bear in mind that the legal motor-assist speed limit is 15.5 mph and most e-bike motor systems are limited to that. Any rider of an e-bike capable of more is prosecutable.

To cover 50 miles a day, around four hours riding, needs a very large capacity battery as John says. I'd say a minimum of 20 Ah since you'll be stop-starting a lot if doing the knowledge, so even that may not be enough.

N.B. Crossed with Paul's post.
.
 

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#5
Hi
I hate too say it but the legal speed cut off point is 15.5mph so your 30mph is an illegal bike in the UK
Thanks Paul, i would de-restrict it tho, i know its bad but needs must
 
Oct 25, 2006
41,344
2,119
#6
Thanks Paul, i would de-restrict it tho, i know its bad but needs must
In that case, choose the bike carefully, some cannot be derestricted since they are designed to the limit anyway and therefore do not have restriction in the first place. Even derestricted very few will get near 30 mph.
.
 

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#7
Bear in mind that the legal motor-assist speed limit is 15.5 mph and most e-bike motor systems are limited to that. Any rider of an e-bike capable of more is prosecutable.

To cover 50 miles a day, around four hours riding, needs a very large capacity battery as John says. I'd say a minimum of 20 Ah since you'll be stop-starting a lot if doing the knowledge so even that may not be enough.

N.B. Crossed with Paul's post.
.
thanks for your advice.
I would buy a spare battery if req'd.
with regards to the 15.5mph, how serious do i have to take this, can you give me an estimate of how many ebikes are de-restricted? because i thought nearly all of them would be but i am a newbie and know very little
 

paul20v

Pedelecer
Nov 18, 2015
150
20
#8
Thanks Paul, i would de-restrict it tho, i know its bad but needs must
Just worth a mention ,
before I had me ebike I was going to derestrict it but too be honest I haven't felt the need and im above the cut off point on the flat most of the time its just nice to know when the trails or road hills get steep and frequent I have an assistance if needed ,
that and the fear of being done for no license or insurance etc kept me from doing it .
Good luck with your search
 

Cyclezee

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 13, 2007
6,835
73
#9
Hi again Lee,
If you like the eZee Sprint GTS, we have one remaining 2015 model which still has full assist with the throttle priced from £995 depending on battery capacity.
We are based in Milton Keynes, so not far from Luton.

This is it
IMG_20151220_102500 copy.jpg
 

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#10
In that case, choose the bike carefully, some cannot be derestricted since they are designed to the limit anyway and therefore do not have restriction in the first place. Even derestricted very few will get near 30 mph.
.
really? how fast do you think a de-restricted bike can go then, with a 20stone lump on it like myself?
 

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#11
Just worth a mention ,
before I had me ebike I was going to derestrict it but too be honest I haven't felt the need and im above the cut off point on the flat most of the time its just nice to know when the trails or road hills get steep and frequent I have an assistance if needed ,
that and the fear of being done for no license or insurance etc kept me from doing it .
Good luck with your search
noted and thanks for your valuable input Paul.
if i were to get pulled over on my bike would i lose my licence if it was de-restricted then?
 

paul20v

Pedelecer
Nov 18, 2015
150
20
#12
noted and thanks for your valuable input Paul.
if i were to get pulled over on my bike would i lose my licence if it was de-restricted then?
Basically its like driving a car without a license or insurance
I don't know how many people are getting done at present but it is happening and not worth losing my license and fines as far as im concerned .
 

Cyclezee

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 13, 2007
6,835
73
#13
Thinking about load carrying, although we can supply 11, 15, 21 and 28Ah batteries, if you have somewhere to leave a spare you might be better to opt for two of the smaller capacities. The 21 and 28Ah weigh 6Kg, the 11Ah only 3.2Kg.
 
Oct 25, 2006
41,344
2,119
#14
thanks for your advice.
I would buy a spare battery if req'd.
with regards to the 15.5mph, how serious do i have to take this, can you give me an estimate of how many ebikes are de-restricted? because i thought nearly all of them would be but i am a newbie and know very little
Two 15 Ah batteries would be a good idea, I used to ride up to 60 miles using two or more batteries this way.

There's very little chance of an excess speed bike being detected, especially if you are pedalling. The problem can arise if you have an accident though, since the police do then sometimes investigate the bike.

Many e-bikes can be derestricted one way or another, but the speed gain can be small, for example to just 18 mph on many hub motor bikes. The only way to get more then is by changing to higher voltage batteries which probably wouldn't fit in the usual position so the bike would need mods. And anyway, batteries are expensive. Speed is pro-rata, for example switching from 36 volts to 48 volts means that one third gain in speed, less a little bit for the increased wind resistance at speed. About 20 mph for example.

Some of the crank drive bikes like those using the Bosch unit or Kalklhoff units can have "dongles" attached which permit up to double the speed assisted, though in practice a little less at 25 to 30 mph. Disconnecting the dongle disguises the illegality, but its use shows up in the software so invalidates the manufacturer's warranty.
.
 
Last edited:

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#15
Basically its like driving a car without a license or insurance
I don't know how many people are getting done at present but it is happening and not worth losing my license and fines as far as im concerned .
hmm. ok, perhaps id better think again then, i just thought riding around at 15mph would take too long..
 

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#16
Two 15 Ah batteries would be a good idea, I used to ride up to 60 miles using two or more batteries this way.

There's very little chance of an excess speed bike being detected, especially if you are pedalling. The problem can arise if you have an accident though, since the police do then sometimes investigate the bike.

Many e-bikes can be derestricted one way or another, but the speed gain can be small, for example to just 18 mph on many hub motor bikes. The only way to get more then is by changing to higher voltage batteries which probably wouldn't fit in the usual position so the bike would need mods. And anyway, batteries are expensive. Speed is pro-rata, for example switching from 36 volts to 48 volts means that one third gain in speed, less a little bit for the increased wind resistance at speed. About 20 mph for example.

Some of the crank drive bikes like those using the Bosch unit or Kalklhoff units can have "dongles" attached which permit up to double the speed assisted, though in practice a little less at 25 to 30 mph. Disconnecting the dongle disguises the illegality, but it shows up in the software so invalidates the manufacturer's warranty.
.
Thanks for your advice flecc.
So god forbid and i do have an accident, if i disconnected the dongle would i be ok in terms of legalities? ive seen the ones where you plug it in via a 3.5mm jack so you can connect/dis-connect very easily.
i think the chance of me getting pulled over having a de-restricted bike are very slim but like you say i wouldn't want to be on the end of a large insurance claim.
 

Cyclezee

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 13, 2007
6,835
73
#17
The eZee bike I mentioned has top legal restricted speed of 17 mph, there is a 10% margin allowed above the 15.5 mph limit.
As Flecc has already mentioned going faster means more wind resistance and increased power consumption.
 
Oct 25, 2006
41,344
2,119
#18
hmm. ok, perhaps id better think again then, i just thought riding around at 15mph would take too long..
I agree with others, I find about 15 mph is fine around London, inner or outer. Of course that speed drops a lot on hills, but you can make it on the downhills.

Over all my e-biking I average about 12 to 13 mph, so 50 miles doing the knowledge means around four hours plus some stopped time, which is practical.
.
 

Lee123

Pedelecer
Feb 8, 2016
44
1
43
#19
I agree with others, I find about 15 mph is fine around London, inner or outer. Of course that speed drops a lot on hills, but you can make it on the downhills.

Over all my e-binking I average about 12 to 13 mph, so 50 miles doing the knowledge means around four hours plus some stopped time, which is practical.
.
Thanks Flecc, makes sense.
 
Oct 25, 2006
41,344
2,119
#20
Thanks for your advice flecc.
So god forbid and i do have an accident, if i disconnected the dongle would i be ok in terms of legalities? ive seen the ones where you plug it in via a 3.5mm jack so you can connect/dis-connect very easily.
i think the chance of me getting pulled over having a de-restricted bike are very slim but like you say i wouldn't want to be on the end of a large insurance claim.
If the dongle is disconnected it's legal. You might not have a chance to disconnect it if dizzy after an accident though, since in crowded London you'd instantly be surrounded by helpers.
.
 

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