On 06/04/2026 at 19:38, lenny said:

Association between COVID-19 vaccination and sudden death in apparently healthy younger individuals: A population-based case-control study

https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.1004924

The organisation that administered the vaccines funded that research. TV news presenters and footballers were dropping dead in front of our eyes in 21/22 - strange that it never happened before or after. It must have been climate change if it wasn't the vaccine, or maybe the Russians.

6 hours ago, D8veh said:

The organisation that administered the vaccines funded that research. TV news presenters and footballers were dropping dead in front of our eyes in 21/22 - strange that it never happened before or after. It must have been climate change if it wasn't the vaccine, or maybe the Russians.

Conclusions

These findings do not support the hypothesis that COVID-19 vaccines increase the risk of sudden cardiac death in young healthy adults.

3 hours ago, nigelbb said:

Conclusions

These findings do not support the hypothesis that COVID-19 vaccines increase the risk of sudden cardiac death in young healthy adults.

You had better tell the audiance whether you had anything to do with administering covid jabs, just to put your comment in context.

30 minutes ago, D8veh said:

You had better tell the audiance whether you had anything to do with administering covid jabs, just to put your comment in context.

I didn't have anything to do with administering covid jabs but I did see plenty of patients dying because they had not been vaccinated. What are your qualifications? Just to put your comment in context.

Mate of mine in his mid-20s ended up on oxygen in intensive care and almost died, was resolutely against vaccines before that. Barely survived. When he eventually recovered, his BMW SUV was rolled over by a direct hit from a car going like a missile into the side. Survived that too. What surprised me was he'd studied sports science at university.

Edited April 13Apr 13 by guerney

Now that I am 75, I have been offered a bunch of vaccines which I will be taking up.

Covid

RSV

Pneumonia

Shingles.

I will certainly have the covid, pneumonia and RSV. Shingles is a possibility, but I understand from my partner who retired recently as a GP, that you don't really catch shingles - as in coming into contact with someone who has it, but that if you are 'run down', your immunity declines, and the old varicella virus which we all had when we had chickenpox as children, which has been lying dormant and kept there in nerve cells by your immune system, will break out again. It can be very nasty in older people leading to some horrible effects.

I had thought of not bothering with that one, since I am lucky to have pretty good general immunity, but having just reviewed the complications of shingles - I have changed my mind.

I'm having all of them.

I really HATE being unwell and fortunately, I rarely am, so I am going to take advantage of what science offers rather than the idiocy that pollutes the Internet with stupid, gormless, rubbish that is so keenly lapped up by some.

Right after this posting I will phone my local pharmacy and arrange my vaccination fest. Thanks for reminding me to do this Dave and others.

Complications of shingles:

Shingles can lead to serious, long-term health issues:

• Postherpetic Neuralgia (PHN): The most common complication, this is severe, long-lasting nerve pain that persists for months or even years after the rash heals.

• Vision Loss (Ophthalmic Shingles): If shingles occurs around the eye, it can cause infections leading to swelling, scarring, and permanent vision loss.

• Ramsay Hunt Syndrome: If the virus affects the facial nerve, it can cause facial paralysis, hearing loss, and balance issues (vertigo).

• Skin Infections: Blisters can become infected with bacteria if not kept clean, requiring antibiotics.

• Neurological Problems: In rare cases, the virus can cause inflammation of the brain (encephalitis).

• Muscle Weakness: Temporary or permanent muscle weakness can occur in the area of the rash.

Of all health progress which has lengthened our lives so that the average life expectancy has risen from about 42 years to about 80, in the last 150 years, vaccination has probably had the greatest impact, along with improvements in hygiene, water supply purity and proper disposal of human waste. NONE of the other developments come near to these four things in allowing us to almost double our lifetime from the previous state.

Why some of us are so hung up on conspiracy theory, lies, rumour, and distortion is a mystery.

To me, it is obvious that not availing yourself of vaccination when offered, is like playing about with unstable explosives. A very stupid risk, being taken deliberately for no good reason.

EDIT:

All booked.

This Thursday Covid at the pharmacy

30th April RSV, Pneumonia and Shingles at GP surgery.

Edited April 13Apr 13 by Tony1951

14 hours ago, D8veh said:

The organisation that administered the vaccines funded that research. TV news presenters and footballers were dropping dead in front of our eyes in 21/22 - strange that it never happened before or after. It must have been climate change if it wasn't the vaccine, or maybe the Russians.

When was it that some people didn't suddenly 'drop dead', and of course, people dropping dead usually do so in front of other people's eyes.

In a complex society, with billions of us going about doing our thing, and the fact that people have always been suddenly dropping dead, and the coincidence of it happening when something else was going on, means nothing in terms the two things being related. I have several times been present when someone dropped dead. Usually, they had a heart attack.

The only sane way to look at this is to take account of the risk ratio of infection of a disease to death and then look at the numbers of people who unexpectedly die, or get sick after covid and after the the vaccination.

We know from very good data that across the population a very large number of people were dying who would not normally have done.

In April 2020, in the UK, excess deaths were 43,796 above the average of the previous five years. That number is 99% larger than the usual state. At that point for that month, the disease was killing about 1% of the people who were admitted to hospital and diagnosed with covid19.

The best data we have is from the ONS. This was before there was a vaccine.

Here it is:

Comparison: COVID-19 vs. Vaccine Risks (2020-2022)

During the first half of 2020 (pre-vaccine), the risk of death from the virus was significantly higher than the subsequent risk from the vaccine:

• Risk of death from COVID-19 (2020): ~1 in 100 infections (1.0% IFR).

• Risk of death from Vaccine: ~1 in 840,000 people (~0.0001%).

Summary: While vaccine-related deaths are tragic, they remained an extremely rare statistical event in the UK, affecting roughly 0.0001% of the vaccinated population.

There were other risks from the vaccine besides death, but you mentioned deaths so I sought out the data.

Looking at less serious side effects which did affect some people, lets look at the commonest one - myocarditis.

Comparing the relative risks of myocarditis in 2022 requires looking at two distinct triggers: the viral infection (SARS-CoV-2) and the mRNA vaccines (Pfizer/Moderna).

Data from the British Medical Journal (BMJ) and the Office for National Statistics (ONS) for the 2022 period indicate that while both the vaccine and the virus carry a risk of myocarditis, the severity and frequency differ significantly.

Myocarditis was something which affected some younger people who were given the MRNA vaccines.

It was also a complication of having covid-19. The incidence of myocarditis during and after covid-19 infectionwas , between 7 and 11 times greater than the risk of having it after vaccination. So you were between 7 and 11 times LESS LIKELY to get it by protecting yourself by MRNA vaccination than if you didn't and caught covid -19 - which most people did.

Looking at the 2022 data for young people (the group at highest risk for this specific complication), the estimated "extra" cases were:

• Following Infection: ~2.24 extra cases per 100,000 people.

• Following Vaccination: ~0.85 extra cases per 100,000 people.

Most of the cases of myocarditis after vaccination were mild. This was not the case for those who experienced it after covid-19

I personally knew well two people who died of covid-19. They were perfectly normal older people until they caught it. I know many other people who also knew people who died of covid-19.

Billions of doses of covid vaccination have been given across the world.

It is not entirely risk free, but it was vastly less risky than the disease which killed many millions of people. It is impossible to accurately say how many it killed because not all countries collect data in the same way and some barely collect it at all, but the estimated number. The best estimate world wide is between 20 and 30 million people died from covid-19.

There have been about 200 confirmed cases of death caused by vaccine related complications.

Edited April 13Apr 13 by Tony1951

10 hours ago, Tony1951 said:

Now that I am 75, I have been offered a bunch of vaccines which I will be taking up.

Covid

RSV

Pneumonia

Much the same here, we can get vacination for Pneumonia and Shingles at 70 though and a booster for the Pneumonia around 5 years later, Covid and Flu yearly. I didn't need the Shingles this year but had all the rest including RSV which I'd never heard of.

My father had Shingles in his early 60s and suffered vicious pain from it till the day he died, I didn't want any of that!

8 hours ago, Tony1951 said:

When was it that some people didn't suddenly 'drop dead', and of course, people dropping dead usually do so in front of other people's eyes.

In a complex society, with billions of us going about doing our thing, and the fact that people have always been suddenly dropping dead, and the coincidence of it happening when something else was going on, means nothing in terms the two things being related. I have several times been present when someone dropped dead. Usually, they had a heart attack.

The only sane way to look at this is to take account of the risk ratio of infection of a disease to death and then look at the numbers of people who unexpectedly die, or get sick after covid and after the the vaccination.

We know from very good data that across the population a very large number of people were dying who would not normally have done.

In April 2020, in the UK, excess deaths were 43,796 above the average of the previous five years. That number is 99% larger than the usual state. At that point for that month, the disease was killing about 1% of the people who were admitted to hospital and diagnosed with covid19.

The best data we have is from the ONS. This was before there was a vaccine.

Here it is:

Comparison: COVID-19 vs. Vaccine Risks (2020-2022)

During the first half of 2020 (pre-vaccine), the risk of death from the virus was significantly higher than the subsequent risk from the vaccine:

• Risk of death from COVID-19 (2020): ~1 in 100 infections (1.0% IFR).

• Risk of death from Vaccine: ~1 in 840,000 people (~0.0001%).

There were other risks from the vaccine besides death, but you mentioned deaths so I sought out the data.

Looking at less serious side effects which did affect some people, lets look at the commonest one - myocarditis.

Comparing the relative risks of myocarditis in 2022 requires looking at two distinct triggers: the viral infection (SARS-CoV-2) and the mRNA vaccines (Pfizer/Moderna).

Data from the British Medical Journal (BMJ) and the Office for National Statistics (ONS) for the 2022 period indicate that while both the vaccine and the virus carry a risk of myocarditis, the severity and frequency differ significantly.

Myocarditis was something which affected some younger people who were given the MRNA vaccines.

It was also a complication of having covid-19. The incidence of myocarditis during and after covid-19 infectionwas , between 7 and 11 times greater than the risk of having it after vaccination. So you were between 7 and 11 times LESS LIKELY to get it by protecting yourself by MRNA vaccination than if you didn't and caught covid -19 - which most people did.

Looking at the 2022 data for young people (the group at highest risk for this specific complication), the estimated "extra" cases were:

• Following Infection: ~2.24 extra cases per 100,000 people.

• Following Vaccination: ~0.85 extra cases per 100,000 people.

Most of the cases of myocarditis after vaccination were mild. This was not the case for those who experienced it after covid-19

I personally knew well two people who died of covid-19. They were perfectly normal older people until they caught it. I know many other people who also knew people who died of covid-19.

Billions of doses of covid vaccination have been given across the world.

It is not entirely risk free, but it was vastly less risky than the disease which killed many millions of people. It is impossible to accurately say how many it killed because not all countries collect data in the same way and some barely collect it at all, but the estimated number. The best estimate world wide is between 20 and 30 million people died from covid-19.

There have been about 200 confirmed cases of death caused by vaccine related complications.

Try Google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=which+footballers+died+on+live+tv+between+2020+and+2023&client=tablet-android-samsung-ss&hs=o0M&sca_esv=bd994f6720ac3641&sxsrf=ANbL-n69V2gDWFzZz4art8ENSShqcjL6hg%3A1776122975879&ei=X3zdafarNdeehbIP7__r8A8&biw=1204&bih=579&ved=0ahUKEwi217fY_euTAxVXT0EAHe__Gv4Q4dUDCBM&uact=5&oq=which+footballers+died+on+live+tv+between+2020+and+2023&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiN3doaWNoIGZvb3RiYWxsZXJzIGRpZWQgb24gbGl2ZSB0diBiZXR3ZWVuIDIwMjAgYW5kIDIwMjMyBRAhGKABMgUQIRifBUibxQFQugpY1rwBcAF4AJABAJgBvgWgAc8qqgELMjcuMTkuMS42LTG4AQPIAQD4AQGYAiygAuEqwgIKEAAYRxjWBBiwA8ICCBAAGIAEGKIEwgIIECEYoAEYwwTCAgYQABgHGB7CAgsQABiABBiKBRiGA8ICChAhGAoYoAEYwwTCAgQQIRgKwgIEECEYFcICBxAhGAoYoAHCAggQABiJBRiiBMICBRAAGO8FmAMAiAYBkAYIkgcLMTEuMzEuMS41LTGgB9vJAbIHCzEwLjMxLjEuNS0xuAfXKsIHCDAuOS4zMy4yyAfMAYAIAQ&sclient=gws-wiz-serp

13 hours ago, nigelbb said:

I didn't have anything to do with administering covid jabs but I did see plenty of patients dying because they had not been vaccinated. What are your qualifications? Just to put your comment in context.

I have many qualfications but the ones most pertinent to this matter are 3 eye tests in the last 10 years and my vision was confirmed as 20-20 with my glasses, which I wear all the time. I also had an IQ test and scored 142.

Edited April 13Apr 13 by D8veh

9 hours ago, D8veh said:

I have many qualfications but the ones most pertinent to this matter are 3 eye tests in the last 10 years and my vision was confirmed as 20-20 with my glasses, which I wear all the time. I also had an IQ test and scored 142.

I assume you must be wearing glasses similar to those used by the famous Zaphod Beeblebrox, you know the ones that go completely opaque if you see something that contradicts your beliefs!😀

Dermcidin has antiviral activity and protects against influenza

This study identifies dermcidin, an antimicrobial peptide previously found in sweat, as a key factor in innate resistance to influenza symptoms.

https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2424461123

Measles takes a plane to Idaho, which has worst vaccination rate in US

In the 2024-2025 school year, only 78.5% of kindergartners had measles vaccination.

https://arstechnica.com/health/2026/04/airport-measles-case-reported-in-idaho-state-with-lowest-vaccination-rate/

This is the warning Big Alcohol wants to keep off your bottles of beer

Ireland was set to become the first EU country to put cancer warning labels on alcoholic drinks.

https://investigativedesk.com/this-is-the-warning-big-alcohol-wants-to-keep-off-your-bottles-of-beer/

On 14/04/2026 at 01:41, D8veh said:

I have many qualfications but the ones most pertinent to this matter are 3 eye tests in the last 10 years and my vision was confirmed as 20-20 with my glasses, which I wear all the time. I also had an IQ test and scored 142.

20-20 vision refers to reading text at 6m (20') so is a test of distance vision & not to the ability to read text in articles which you would know if you had the appropriate qualifications. Aside from being able to read you also need to apply critical thinking to understand research papers.

BTW Your willy waving doesn't impress me as I was tested with an IQ of 152 when I joined MENSA.

Being intelligent, and being wise are different things.

A person may be intelligent and also be un-wise, or they may have only ordinary levels of intelligence, and use it wisely.

We can all mis-apply information, and ignore that which does not appeal, but is nonetheless correct.

Confirmation bias is common. We seek out and consider only the information supporting pre-conceived ideas.

You can see this all over any forum. People dismiss sources out of hand, are hostile to opposing opinions and use ad hominem attacks to discredit those suggesting alternatives. It is understandable that this happens, but it is unfortunate. We usually form an idea on the basis of some sort of evidence, but become too wedded to that idea, and ignore attempts to show by reason, and evidence, that it was wrong.

I think one of the most powerful tools in finding what is true, is to make it a habit to seriously consider that what you already think, might be mistaken. This paradigm is at the heart of the Scientific Method. It is a way of investigating, where the approach is to find fault with a theory, not to support it. You don't try to prove that you are right - you try to discover if you were wrong.

4 hours ago, nigelbb said:

4 hours ago, nigelbb said:

20-20 vision refers to reading text at 6m (20') so is a test of distance vision & not to the ability to read text in articles which you would know if you had the appropriate qualifications. Aside from being able to read you also need to apply critical thinking to understand research papers.

BTW Your willy waving doesn't impress me as I was tested with an IQ of 152 when I joined MENSA.

My 20-20 vision isn't used much for reading, nor what comes out of a TV or computer. Instead, I use to to see what's actually in front of me.

If you really had such an IQ, you'd be helping people on this forum solve their ebike problems, but you don't because you can't even understand how they work.

Edited April 15Apr 15 by D8veh

2 hours ago, D8veh said:

My 20-20 vision isn't used much for reading, nor what comes out of a TV or computer. Instead, I use to to see what's actually in front of me.

If you really had such an IQ, you'd be helping people on this forum solve their ebike problems, but you don't because you can't even understand how they work.

I knew and old woman once, who sometimes used to say, 'Horses for courses', when she wanted to point out that we are not all the same and not all interested in exactly the same things.

The fact that a person is not an expert in mending e-bikes -a pretty esoteric form of knowledge anyway - does not at all indicate that they are less intelligent or educated than a person who has devoted a lot of time to that pursuit.

What one ought to maybe try and do, is to avoid thinking that because we are very good at a particular specialism, this automatically makes us generally brilliant, and expert in other specialisms, which in actual fact, we do not know about in any serious way.

Neither are all habits of mind and enquiry applicable to every field.

Because a person has expertise in diagnosing mechanical failures and rectifying them, it does not mean that without any study, they can waltz into a different field, and somehow magically become an expert in five minutes, on the basis of reading the thoughts of random people on the internet.

If that were the case, why would we take our friends and loved ones to hospital? A man who is a skilled and experienced car mechanic, might consider that he could just help his wife at home, by doing a hip transplant, having made up the parts on a lathe in his shed. After all, he removes worn out parts and replaces them all day long doesn't he?

Maybe not.

I would be rather reluctant to dismiss the opinion of a doctor on the value of vaccination, in favour of Internet chatter. He has a lifetimes experience on medical matters. What I read from untested randoms on the Internet is probably wrong - especially if it is couched in a conspiratorial fashion, assuming that the medical profession is filled with cheats and quacks who are intent on hiding the truth from people. This used to be an almost entirely American phenomenon, born of the fact perhaps, that anything medical you get there is vastly expensive and has to be paid for by you, but it has spread here too.

I know that in a different context, I have seen you give very short shrift (correctly) to individuals who rocked up here and started to contradict your own expert advice on how e-bikes work, and how to fix them. I was at times amused by this - like the time when a person became angry when you pointed out that the use of regenerative charging (on braking) on an e-bike was not a great idea and that this was why no major manufacturer have done it, or if they did, the bikes disappeared from sale very quickly because they didn't work properly. I remember that you explained something of your work history and expected them to take that seriously. They didn't because they were stupid or nuts. They thought they knew better, but we know that they didn't, did they?

Edited April 15Apr 15 by Tony1951

3 hours ago, D8veh said:

My 20-20 vision isn't used much for reading, nor what comes out of a TV or computer. Instead, I use to to see what's actually in front of me.

If you really had such an IQ, you'd be helping people on this forum solve their ebike problems, but you don't because you can't even understand how they work.

If you are seeing people dropping dead from COVID jabs then there something seriously wrong with your vision.

My expertise is in medicine. Yours is not. You only joined this forum a couple of weeks ago. Why not wind your neck in with the ludicrous anti-vax conspiracy BS & stick to what you know?

2 minutes ago, nigelbb said:

If you are seeing people dropping dead from COVID jabs then there something seriously wrong with your vision.

My expertise is in medicine. Yours is not. You only joined this forum a couple of weeks ago. Why not wind your neck in with the ludicrous anti-vax conspiracy BS & stick to what you know?

Actually he didn't join a couple of weeks ago. It is Saneagle who has been a mainstay of the forum since it began. He got locked out from his previous identity because the new forum requires that you log on with the original email address, which he can't remember or has lost touch with, having been here for a very long time.

I agree with the rest of your post, though I wouldn't have said, 'wind your neck in'.

Edited April 15Apr 15 by Tony1951

1 hour ago, Tony1951 said:

Actually he didn't join a couple of weeks ago. It is Saneagle who has been a mainstay of the forum since it began. He got locked out from his previous identity because the new forum requires that you log on with the original email address, which he can't remember or has lost touch with, having been here for a very long time.

I agree with the rest of your post, though I wouldn't have said, 'wind your neck in'.

Thanks. I didn't realise. I wouldn't have bothered replying if I had known it was one of our existing antiVax conspiracy theory nut jobs. It's odd how someone apparently functioning normally otherwise can conjure up these delusions. Delusions are impossible to argue against as they are matters of belief not fact. Trying to justify his fantasises by boasting that his IQ is less than mine was a bit strange.😀

On 15/04/2026 at 06:47, nigelbb said:

I was tested with an IQ of 152 when I joined MENSA.

Snap! Identical to my MENSA score. I became a MENSA member some 50 years ago, but immediately left, since paying annually to be a member of an organisation that has no aims isn't a very intelligent thing to do.

.

Covid jabs huge success, but work needed on trust in vaccines - key findings from Covid report

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce3dp52l70zo

Scientists discover why bread can cause weight gain without extra calories

Carb-heavy foods like bread and rice may trigger weight gain in unexpected ways.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2026/04/260414075637.htm