I'll let you lot dissect this, as I'm still reeling from amazement
How on earth does he get away with this?
- Thread starter Fordulike
- Start date
I'll let you lot dissect this, as I'm still reeling from amazement
It shows how being polite pays.
The insurance he showed was blank, it's one of those Dr Who has where you see what you expect to see.
The insurance he showed was blank, it's one of those Dr Who has where you see what you expect to see.
Now who's worried about a throttle on an ordinary ebike
I'll let you lot dissect this, as I'm still reeling from amazement
If the police were happy I do not see he is getting away with anything.
He obviously keeps a good look out, spots walkers, kids on bikes etc. Seemed to be riding safely. No one harmed and no harm done and police satisfied.
He obviously had some form of third party insurance.
He obviously keeps a good look out, spots walkers, kids on bikes etc. Seemed to be riding safely. No one harmed and no harm done and police satisfied.
He obviously had some form of third party insurance.
Maybe I'm missing something here.... like his number plates
Maybe I'm missing something here.... like his number plates
Exactly my first thought as well.
I'd love to hear that conversation with Direct Line.
" Hi, I have an un-registered, non road legal motorcycle for which I don't have a license. It's not taxed, and it looks like something out of a sci-fi movie. Can you quote me for third party insu...."
"CLICK...Brrrr".
But it is not a motorcycle, just an e-bike as they all should be.... OK the Stealth maybe a bit fast, but looks certainly not more SciFi than many D/H MTB's
These 15mph PAS bikes are a waste of space, slower than most people who are even at basic fitness levels can pedal, and barely able to pull you up a reasonable hill before the 250w limit runs out of steam.
You'd not need to buy third party insurance, (though I am sure you can), my household policy used to cover me for third party cycle risks.
I'd not advocate every 14 year old riding Stealth bikes, but that won't happen due to cost.
Current rules, just cripple what would otherwise be a great alternate means of transport. To have e-bikes capable of at least what many people can pedal up to, would get people out of cars.
Over the past few years I have been given,certainly over 20, 15mph PAS bikes, bought by owners who after paying £1000 or more find they are lumbered with something slower and heavier than their normal bikes. They buy them, use for a bit, are disappointed and get shoved to the back of the garage for batteries to go flat and dead... bad lithium cells etc,
I constantly hear complaints about weight and speed.
Make them a little more capable and their popularity would soar.
These 15mph PAS bikes are a waste of space, slower than most people who are even at basic fitness levels can pedal, and barely able to pull you up a reasonable hill before the 250w limit runs out of steam.
You'd not need to buy third party insurance, (though I am sure you can), my household policy used to cover me for third party cycle risks.
I'd not advocate every 14 year old riding Stealth bikes, but that won't happen due to cost.
Current rules, just cripple what would otherwise be a great alternate means of transport. To have e-bikes capable of at least what many people can pedal up to, would get people out of cars.
Over the past few years I have been given,certainly over 20, 15mph PAS bikes, bought by owners who after paying £1000 or more find they are lumbered with something slower and heavier than their normal bikes. They buy them, use for a bit, are disappointed and get shoved to the back of the garage for batteries to go flat and dead... bad lithium cells etc,
I constantly hear complaints about weight and speed.
Make them a little more capable and their popularity would soar.
Only the restriction makes them slow. The S class bikes all used to be based on standard 250 watt pedelcs using exactly the same motor and controller, just without the restriction. Those with limited gear ranges assistd to about 22 mph, those with more extensive gear ranges like 10 speed or the Rohloff hub were good for 26 mph. Both those speeds are well beyond what the average cyclist normally continuously achieves on the flat.
I think you've got the wrong idea, e-bikes are not motor vehicles, they're bicycles with motor assistance. Look at the logic, if someone can't cruise at 26 mph when assisted with the allowed 250 watts rating, (actually typically circa 500 watts), they certainly wouldn't be able to on an unpowered bike, which rather dismisses your argument that the lack of power makes them slower. The only thing that makes them slow at 15 mph is the law.
Those who want a more capable powered two wheeler can buy a moped or motorbike, no-one's stopping them. They can even have one bike-style with pedals, so long as it meets the relevant safety standards and is registered and has motor vehicle insurance and the rider is licenced.
Which brings us to what this is all about, those who just want to dodge all the laws and just do anything, 1kW, 2 kW, 5kW or more, with 30mph, 40mph or very much more.
The law is what it is and isn't going to change, simply because it's entirely logical. Those who can cycle a bike at 20mph or more can continue to do so on their unpowered bike. Those who can only manage much less can get some assistance to keep them riding at up to the speeds they can manage on an unpowered bike.
That's the logic, pedelec law isn't about performance improvement. It's giving some assistance to enable people to continue cycling at normal cycling speeds, which are not 20 to 30 mph or more.
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Yes, I understand that is the restriction that makes them slow..that is the big problem.
E-bikes are not motor vehicles..correct.. and it would be silly to make them so..because you then have all the hassle and expense that goes with them..as you say buy buying a motor bike..which then means they become costly and hassle of registration, licence insurance helmets etc etc (and can't easily be brought in the house.)
I am just pointing out what I have seen over the past few years with countless bikes and people coming to see me about them to either fix or sell them ..or ask for a bit more power ..to 'de restrict ' them. People paying £880-£1500 or more want and expected something that gives the more performance than they can generally pedal a normal bike, but WITHOUT the hassle, size, cost and weigh of getting a moped.
Your last paragraph sums up the problem, people who know nothing about e-bikes expect a performance improvement..not to moped speeds but better than they can do without assistance.
Yes, limit the speed to 20-25mph 30mph would be too much since then it is moped class, so has to be less than that. I'd also say not have a power limit, so the speed set can be reached.
There is so much talk of getting people on more environmentally friendly transport, and a class of vehicle like that would encourage more people to use them.
I have let people ride my bikes..and even at my lower power settings..they often find them too much. At full power my 5304 24s lipo bike is good for well..I rolled off the throttle at 50 mph ..and saw a peak of 15kW. After that ride I reduced to 20 series, HoC 80 volts and reduced current to around 80amps. It now peaks at about 35-40 mph....Not that I use it any more. got fed up with the hassle of looking over my shoulder all the time..after 5 years and 16,000 incident free miles I have gone back to to the Landcruiser
It is not something that will be resolved ..and no one is that interested really to change the laws..most politicians would not be even aware of the issue..it would need a green campaign....Souped up Boris bikes ...etc.
E-bikes are not motor vehicles..correct.. and it would be silly to make them so..because you then have all the hassle and expense that goes with them..as you say buy buying a motor bike..which then means they become costly and hassle of registration, licence insurance helmets etc etc (and can't easily be brought in the house.)
I am just pointing out what I have seen over the past few years with countless bikes and people coming to see me about them to either fix or sell them ..or ask for a bit more power ..to 'de restrict ' them. People paying £880-£1500 or more want and expected something that gives the more performance than they can generally pedal a normal bike, but WITHOUT the hassle, size, cost and weigh of getting a moped.
Your last paragraph sums up the problem, people who know nothing about e-bikes expect a performance improvement..not to moped speeds but better than they can do without assistance.
Yes, limit the speed to 20-25mph 30mph would be too much since then it is moped class, so has to be less than that. I'd also say not have a power limit, so the speed set can be reached.
There is so much talk of getting people on more environmentally friendly transport, and a class of vehicle like that would encourage more people to use them.
I have let people ride my bikes..and even at my lower power settings..they often find them too much. At full power my 5304 24s lipo bike is good for well..I rolled off the throttle at 50 mph ..and saw a peak of 15kW. After that ride I reduced to 20 series, HoC 80 volts and reduced current to around 80amps. It now peaks at about 35-40 mph....Not that I use it any more. got fed up with the hassle of looking over my shoulder all the time..after 5 years and 16,000 incident free miles I have gone back to to the Landcruiser
It is not something that will be resolved ..and no one is that interested really to change the laws..most politicians would not be even aware of the issue..it would need a green campaign....Souped up Boris bikes ...etc.
Point is no insurance, household or pedelec, will be valid if the bike is illegal. Which this bike is by a country mile.
The copper who stopped him was clearly unaware of the law because if he was he could have nicked him and he would have been prosecuted and lost his licence. If he has one.
BTW I don’t know how many pedelecs you’ve ridden recently but most modern legal bikes will get you where you want to go and up steep hills without busting a gut either.
Re your other post there have been many threads here about Speds and the possibility of them ever becoming legal in the UK; and others about the difficulty of making an overpowered bike legal by turning it into what is in effect an electric moped. In both cases registration and insurance and helmets become compulsory, and they can’t be used on bicycle paths etc.
True, but not understanding what a pedelec is for is their problem. Your last line say it all, they want a law to enable them to dodge the law! That's never going to happen!
But that is not a typical cycling speed Neil, it's only arisen since the British largely abandoned cycling decades ago, leaving it to the lycras. As a result we have those Britons who are still dedicated cyclists on road bikes and similar who approach cycling in a rather sporting manner, riding at around 20mph. Politicians and law makers see these as capable cyclists who have no need of assistance.
The mass of our population only cycled at around 12 mph or less in the days when much of Britain still cycled. Go into mainland Europe and you see the same moderate speeds, below 15 mph and often far below as in the Netherlands. It's this utility cycling that the politicians want to see return in the UK, cycling for shopping, school, work, library and other social purposes, just like that in the Netherlands, Denmark and Germany.
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