Bike for long fastish commute

[mfj197]

I have a 22 mile each way commute and for much of the last few years I've split the journey by driving half way and cycling the rest on a Specialized Secteur Sport road bike. Recently I've gone the whole way a few times but am completely knackered in the evening. I've been thinking a pedelec could allow me to do the entire journey rather more frequently so have been looking into the possibility of buying something to replace my 5-year old roadie).

Primary requirement: To be able to ride the distance at speed on road. The last time I commuted the whole way I averaged 17.8 mph in and 16 mph on the return (I run out of energy!). I'm aware of the 15 mph cutoff and do want to keep legal, but I don't want to be going any slower than I already do without assistance. I know it's a bit of a grey area - for example I believe the BH Neo series are still providing assistance up round 18 mph?

Secondary requirement: My wife has an old Clockwork Orange hybrid bike whereas I only have my roadie. I therefore can't go on trails. Added to that we now have two children (3 and 1) and it would be good to head out on trails for family cycles - with necessary child seats or whatever. I don't think this is a difficult requirement as pretty much all e-bikes are better off-road than mine (with the exception maybe of the BH Neo Race or Carbon).

Any thoughts? I'm considering the BH Neo Cross, KTM E Cross P etc.

Michael

 

[Alan Quay]

Most bikes are restricted in some way by the controller. Many 250w bikes will assist up to the 18mph mark, even if a little bit of, errr, adjustment is required.

44 miles round trip is just about do-able on a big battery/lots of input from the rider. If you can charge at work then you can get away with a smaller battery.

 

[mfj197]

Yes, I should have added that I can charge at work although there'll be no shortage of input from me when cycling either.

 

[trex]

it seems a job for the BS10:

 

[RobF]

The assistance cut-off can vary by a mph or two, but I don't think you can rely on that if you want to be certain of meeting your speed target.

To achieve 18mph average, you presumably do long stretches above that speed.

Pedalling the bike unassisted at speed will be much harder than your road bike, unless you are going down hill.

Sounds as if you input will be much higher than most ebikers, so it may be you can rest sufficiently while doing 15mph or under to be able to do the faster bits.

My gut feeling is that won't work, so the solution would be a derestricted bike, like the one Trek has just posted.

But you say you want to stay legal which such a bike is not.

I can't advise you to ride a derestricted bike, but one would do the job for you perfectly.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

The BH Neos are just about the hardest bikes to derestrict. . The Kalhoff BS10 is already de-restricted, so is pretty fast, but the 11aH battery won't be enough. Any Bosch bike with a Badass derestrictor would do it, but, again, you'll need two batteries.

If you want a bike with off-road potential, the new Oxygen MTB is very fast derestricted, but the 12aH battery would be on the limit. For 44 miles at maximum speed, you need about 20aH.

The Kalkhoffs with the Impulse motor have bigger batteries. It's possible to derestrict them too.

 

[JohnCade]

The Kalkhoffs with the Impulse motor have bigger batteries. It's possible to derestrict them too.

Do you have to borrow a device from 50 Cycles to do that?

 

[flapajack]

I agree that a Kalkhoff BS10 as trex recommend is your best solution, or something similar. I have a similar commute of 18 miles each way and am a reasonably fit cyclist but it still take most (about 70%) of the 400w to make the journey in tour mode, with good input from me.

The best thing about the bs10 is that the assistance doesn't stop at 15mph, which make cycling very natural and easy instead of the brick wall that you hit once you get to the cut-off. my journey average about 17/18 mph so can make the commute in about an hour - more than lkng enoigh after a hard days's work. I used to use a normal mtb and gradually manage to get tje journey times down to 1:20 hr but wouldn't want to do more than once a week to keep fit. With the bs10 usually do twice a week, usually one after the other before giving up - had to get up almost an hour early to make the commute.

BTW, at that speed, you will need shower facility at work. You cannot ride at 18/20mph without breaking a sweat, no matter how helpful the motor is unless it has more than 50cc.

Good luck with your search.

 

[Jonah]

If you enjoy cycling, the Kalkhoff Pro Connect would be very suitable and manage 44 miles without recharging. Fastest average speeds are achieved in undulating terrain. The Endeavour Impulse S10 XT would be my pick of the 'not legal' bikes. The KTM E-Race P is also a nice bike. I think you would enjoy riding any of these bikes.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Do you have to borrow a device from 50 Cycles to do that?

I'd have to kill you if I told you the secret, just in case you don't keep it. In fact, I'd have to kill you first, just to make sure.

BTW, at that speed, you will need shower facility at work. You cannot ride at 18/20mph without breaking a sweat, no matter how helpful the motor is unless it has more than 50cc.

I'm not sure that that's true. The Oxygen MTB is fast and powerful. 18 to 20 mph is a breeze if you de-restrict it, but if you let it do all the work, it won't do 44 miles. There's other bikes too: The Volt Plus; a Mountainsport, just to name a couple.

 

[trex]

one more possibility is to convert something like this £369 Cube Aim SL 29 with an 8Fun BBS01 or 02. It has much higher assist and you have a throttle too.

 

[D8ve]

The real heretic might look at a recumbent?
If you are doing over 16 on manual then there is very little a legal over the counter electric bike can do.
A good bike like a kalhoff will help on the up hills to keep at 15mph ish and you work the down hill and flats for 20+ to keep up the ave speed, but it is limited.
The BBS kit could help on the hills with a good frame but that is virtually the crank drive on the BH kalhoff again.
(Interested in buying mine?)

 

[trex]

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/focus-jarifa-29er-for-sale.18541/

£1700 may be a bit too high - I reckon I'd sell for £1350

 

[RobF]

The OP mentioned being able to charge at work.

I assume he's grasped the fact he will need to charge both ends so will either have two chargers, or will carry the charger each day.

If that's the case any bike with a battery of 10ah or more should be fine.

I see the Kalkhoff BS10 is currently £1,995 from 50Cycles.

Fair price, some of the BS10s had the smaller battery, but the spec makes it clear the bike has the 11ah battery.

http://www.50cycles.com/electric-bikes/endeavour-sport-fast.html

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

I'm not going to comment on the bike choice, because I could be considered biased. But I will comment on the eBike bit of this.

My commute over the winter was 16 miles each way, but it was from Huddersfield to Saddleworth, so right over the A62, which is a pretty big hill.

As you, I can ride it all, and I also drove parts etc etc. However when I used the ebike (a legal one) I found it loads better. I could ride every day, because whilst my top speed wasn't actually much higher (not higher at all) its all the 0-15mph sections where the time end effort is saved. Not having to put in as much effort away from lights, or on climbs or into headwinds means I could get to work in one of two ways.

either

a) in the same time as my normal road race bike, with loads less effort... enabling me to do it every day. And still go for a leisure / sport ride after work.

or

b) put in the same amount of effort (i checked this with a heart rate monitor) and get to work 15ish minutes quicker (no real change in top speed). This mean I had an extra 30 mins a day, still got lots of exercise etc etc.

All good things

Certainly it converted me to the benefits of an eBike as a commuter tool.

Plus it was loads of fun.

If you have any questions about the commute or KTM, I'll be happy to give more details.

Cheers
Col

 

[mfj197]

Thanks for a lot of good information here. Some thoughts:

• Battery / Range. Probably won't be a problem - if necessary I can charge at home and at work, although I would hope not to have to by putting in a reasonable amount of legwork. Chargers cost a wee bit I think?
• I commute in to south west London from Surrey, along some of the route used for the Olympics 2012 road race or this weekend's Ride London event. It's not particularly hilly (I don't do the Box Hill bit!) and RobF is quite right in that I do spend some time above 18mph. That might knock the idea on the head then, unless some of the legal bikes are still providing assistance up around this sort of speed. I averaged 16.5mph on the 22 mile cycle in this morning (but definitely knew about it afterwards - my bike isn't the most comfortable!).
• The BS10 would certainly fit the bill but it is derestricted. I have in the past considered a recumbent but depending on my route I can encounter traffic, and filtering past stationary cars on a recumbent would be pretty difficult.

How does the cutoff work on most bikes? Does the motor suddenly stop providing any assistance as you breach the cutoff speed (for example the rider might have to only put in 100 watts at 15mph but suddenly 350 watts at 16mph) or does it continue providing the same amount of assistance as when the cutoff is breached (but no more)? EddiePJ's review of the KTM E-Cross P suggests the power assist is all over by an indicated 15.5mph whereas the BH Neo carries on up to a higher speed?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

How does the cutoff work on most bikes? Does the motor suddenly stop providing any assistance as you breach the cutoff speed (for example the rider might have to only put in 100 watts at 15mph but suddenly 350 watts at 16mph) or does it continue providing the same amount of assistance as when the cutoff is breached (but no more)? EddiePJ's review of the KTM E-Cross P suggests the power assist is all over by an indicated 15.5mph whereas the BH Neo carries on up to a higher speed?

Every bike is different. Some of the cheaper ones can be a bit abrupt, which is annoying, but overall it makes little difference: On most bikes, you're pedalling on your own once you've passed 16 mph. The only difference is that on some bikes it's dead easy to change that.

 

[trex]

I take it that by continuing with this thread, you are not totally averse to derestricting your bike.
Then any bike with a big motor, 15AH battery or better will do the job provided that you can derestrict it.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I don't think we've found a bike yet that couldn't be de-restricted somehow.

 

[trex]

John Cade's Kalkhoff still is restricted.