Bosch reliability

[Yew Tree]

I see a detaiked review about Bafang hub kits in electric bike. The option to fit into a standard bike is attractive. This maybe a good option.
Has anyone had a bad experience with this? Are they easy to fit by someone with two left hands full of thumbs? .

 

[Deleted member 25121]

I see a detaiked review about Bafang hub kits in electric bike. The option to fit into a standard bike is attractive. This maybe a good option.
Has anyone had a bad experience with this? Are they easy to fit by someone with two left hands full of thumbs? .

If you're unfamiliar with the term "pawl" I suspect you'd struggle to build up an ebike yourself, better go for one that's already assembled eg from the likes of Woosh and Wisper who are both UK companies and provide good support.

Woosh Bikes

Woosh Bikes Ltd Electric bikes and kits assembled in Southend-On-Sea. Affordable and comfortable e-bikes to suit every pocket.

wooshbikes.co.uk

Electric Bikes | E-Bike Finance via V12 | Wisper Electric Bicycles

Wisper is the UK's most experienced manufacturer of Electric Bikes, and has been making ebikes since 2005. Shop the Wisper Range Today!

wisperbikes.com

Having said that though, I'm not aware of pawls failing on Bosch motors being a common problem, it could be that the first repair was a botched job. I'd be inclined to ask the company that's repairing it now for more details of the failure, are they even qualified repairers of Bosch equipment?

 

[Nealh]

Yew Tree as you are in Norwich still a fair few miles from Woosh in Southend, it might be worth a visit down to them. They sell and fit kits as well as some sturdy built e- bikes.

 

[sjpt]

I see a detaiked review about Bafang hub kits in electric bike. The option to fit into a standard bike is attractive. This maybe a good option.
Has anyone had a bad experience with this? Are they easy to fit by someone with two left hands full of thumbs? .

They are fairly easy to fit. For first time it would be worth getting a complete kit, that saves complications about what parts go with what. As was said above, its much easier and cheaper to replace standard parts than propriety (eg Bosch) ones, but things are far from so standard that arbitrary combinations of bits will work together. Woosh will be a good bet whether you go for a complete bike or a kit on an old bike. Also they will fit a kit to you old bike for around £70 (???) extra, could be a good option if you are attached to your old bike but don't feel up to fitting a kit.

 

[Yew Tree]

That's helpful. £70 is a reasonable cost for avoiding struggle and strife
However, if push comes to shove, i could put the bits in the right place.
I made Airfix kits when I was a boy, so I guess i could work out which bit goes where

 

[Woosh]

However, if push comes to shove, i could put the bits in the right place.

if you can remove the bottom bracket, then you will be OK.

 

[Yew Tree]

There are a range of conversion kits available, but they don’t have a battery. What is the best battery for a kit? Are the cable plugs standard fittings? How do I match the motor with the battery?? Cost????

 

[sjpt]

Many of the Woosh kits have battery, and I'm sure they will provide appropriate batteries for those that don't (http://wooshbikes.co.uk/) It was partly to be sure that all the bits would work together that I bought a complete kit from them rather than various parts from around the web. Also, they made sure that the cables were appropriate for the tandem I was converting.

It seems the kits with batteries have had a price hike recently (?falling pound; the prices had been fairly stable for some time) , so around the £550 to £650 mark. Batteries are a major cost, and there is a significant price difference depending on capacity; what is best for you it is very dependent on how far and how fast you want to ride, and hilliness in your area (did I see Norwich? maybe windiness is more of a factor).

Yosepower (https://www.yosepower.com/en/category/Kits-with-battery-43.html) is another source of kits with battery. They seem to be a bit cheaper at the moment, but make sure you compare battery like with like. Not sure of Brexit implications if you don't order soon, and you probably won't get the same really helpful service you will get with Woosh.

 

[Yew Tree]

Thanks - I see that the cost of a woosh bike is not much more than a kit plus battery !..

 

[sjpt]

Thanks - I see that the cost of a woosh bike is not much more than a kit plus battery !..

Apart from the Crusa, Woosh doesn't seem to have any complete bikes under £1000 now. In very round figures that is £400 for the bike and £600 for the electrics. But yes a complete bike has lots of advantages unless you have strong reason for keeping the old bike (as we did for the tandem)

You could get a complete bike cheaper at somewhere like https://www.e-bikesdirect.co.uk/electric-bikes/ or http://www.kudoscycles.com/index.php?intro=done, but the specs (especially battery) are likely to be lower and the service less good.

 

[Woosh]

:

Thanks - I see that the cost of a woosh bike is not much more than a kit plus battery !..

take the new Woosh Camino as a ball park example.
The kit would be the XF08C with 15AH battery, cost: £549.
Since the EU imposed anti-dumping duty on Chinese e-bikes, we have to assemble the bike ourselves in the UK. Cost: £75.

Camino: £1,049

Electrics: £549
Assembly: £75
Bike transport: £50
Mechanical bike: £375

For £375, you get a mechanical bike with Suntour NEX suspension fork and hydraulic brakes, rack, mudguards, lights and bell.
That's comparable to an entry level Cube Aim Pro or Carrera Vengeance + accessories.
Some customers order their bikes online and get the bikes sent directly to us for conversion.

 

[sjpt]

I said earlier Yosepower (https://www.yosepower.com/en/category/Kits-with-battery-43.html) is another source of kits with battery. Be aware that many of their kits are nominally 350w and technically illegal as a pedalec in the UK (and in other parts of the EU). Probably no more powerful than many legal kits rated 250w, but that's an oddity in the way the law is written.

 

[Yew Tree]

I'll be away from home next week, and not able to access the web, so I will no longer contribute to the thread. However, I extend my sincere thanks to all who have contributed. The thread has proved to be more interesting and informative than I anticipated.
I won't close the thread because others may want to continue the conversation.
Thanks again everyone.
"Yew Tree"

 

[Andy-Mat]

I have a Haibike roadster. Its an early series made in 2015 (i think). On two occasions the drive has failed. The pedals turn, but will not engage. This has left me stranded. A trip to the repair shop reveals that the "palls" (sorry if the spelling is wrong) have failed. I'm not technically minded, so this means nothing to me. What it does mean is that the bike is unreliable, and i no longer trust it. I'd like to know if anyone else has had this problem, and if so what is the solution? Should I sell the bike, or is there a repair option that is reliable?
Incidentally, my partner has a Halkoff. Currently her bike does not work due to some computer issue, and the dealer is getting NO support about this problem from Halkoff.
My opinion of e-bikes, based on these experiences, is that they are expensive and unreliable. I'm inclined to stay with my trusty "Edinburgh" town bike that I bought 20 years ago and is still going strong.

I live in Germany, and although I have not even ridden such a bike from Bosch (old WW2 name for "rubbish" by the way!), I have read the many complaints from owners of the original versions, writing on German websites. It put me off buying one completely.
If you happen to be able to read German yourself, go and take a look.
I have not seen such massive amounts of complaints from users in other countries/websites, maybe fewer bikes sold, but that is just a guess.
I believe that someone here mentioned that the later Bosch models are far better deigned and are far more reliable, but I forget who that was.
The early versions (I am told and have read about) have plastic gears, which is apparently also a constant source of problems, but as to whether replacement parts have been redesigned in some way to improve them, I have no idea, sorry.
I hope that you are able to get your bike up and reliably running.
As an old engineer, the weakness of using a single drive chain for both the electric motor and the human muscle power, became very apparent when reading online complaints.
Which is why both of my e-bikes have been rear wheel motors with a Derailleur gear change, which always gets me home if the battery is empty..... I have never experienced a motor failure YET!
The big plus with middle motors are for anyone who wishes to ride faster than the legal limit, and not having to pedal like a maniac to do it (assuming illegal electrical changes have been made!), but I am personally happy with the legal limit!
Just my thoughts on the matter.
Regards
Andy
UPDATE. I have just see the pictures posted of the internal gears, so that is showing the plastic gear parts so many Germans are upset with.
Just guessing, but does the motor and man - Power all pass through same gears? That might explain such problems as many Germans experience......Just a thought!

 

[Deleted member 25121]

I live in Germany, and although I have not even ridden such a bike from Bosch (old WW2 name for "rubbish" by the way!), I have read the many complaints from owners of the original versions, writing on German websites. It put me off buying one completely.
If you happen to be able to read German yourself, go and take a look.
I have not seen such massive amounts of complaints from users in other countries/websites, maybe fewer bikes sold, but that is just a guess.
I believe that someone here mentioned that the later Bosch models are far better deigned and are far more reliable, but I forget who that was.
The early versions (I am told and have read about) have plastic gears, which is apparently also a constant source of problems, but as to whether replacement parts have been redesigned in some way to improve them, I have no idea, sorry.
I hope that you are able to get your bike up and reliably running.
As an old engineer, the weakness of using a single drive chain for both the electric motor and the human muscle power, became very apparent when reading online complaints.
Which is why both of my e-bikes have been rear wheel motors with a Derailleur gear change, which always gets me home if the battery is empty..... I have never experienced a motor failure YET!
The big plus with middle motors are for anyone who wishes to ride faster than the legal limit, and not having to pedal like a maniac to do it (assuming illegal electrical changes have been made!), but I am personally happy with the legal limit!
Just my thoughts on the matter.
Regards
Andy
UPDATE. I have just see the pictures posted of the internal gears, so that is showing the plastic gear parts so many Germans are upset with.
Just guessing, but does the motor and man - Power all pass through same gears? That might explain such problems as many Germans experience......Just a thought!

One of the arts of engineering is knowing when not to over engineer, have you ever designed a gearbox?
For example, have you ever wondered why the jockey wheels on your derailleur gears aren't made of metal with roller bearings? Why don't plastic jockey wear out anything like as quickly as chains....

 

[Yew Tree]

Thanks for your comments. It’s good to know the opinions of folks in other places.
I’m convinced that a rear-wheel drive is the best option for me, simply for peace of mind that I can peddle home.
Apart from the Bosch motor (which certainly is rubbish on my bike) I like the bike itself, so feel let down by the engineering. Hopefully this thread will alert others to the issue.