Brexit, for once some facts.

oldgroaner

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This is why Brexit is so Critical, failure will have serious consequences and claiming "It's the Will of the People" is utter nonsense


It was a protest Vote from a large Faction, and of course some very dubious people as well intent on misleading them.
And that is all it was.
Well now the consequences are clear and that there will be no advantage whatsoever in going ahead with it.
Why is it still happening?
 

oyster

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Nov 7, 2017
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And just who supports brexit most fervently?

MI5 to take over in fight against rise of UK rightwing extremism

Security service to handle intelligence gathering then inform police to take action
MI5 is to take the lead in combating extreme rightwing terrorism amid mounting fears that white supremacists are increasing their efforts to foment violent racial conflict on Britain’s streets, The Guardian has learned.


The switch from the police – which has always previously taken responsibility for monitoring far right extremism – to MI5 means that the ideology will now sit in the same portfolio as Islamist terrorism and Irish terrorism, which are both covered by the domestic security service.


The decision also means that extreme rightwing activity will now be officially designated as posing a major threat to national security.


It comes amid growing global fears of the threat posed by far-right terrorists. In the US in recent days a man was charged with sending 13 pipe bombs to opponents of Donald Trump, including Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton. A second man was taken into custody after an antisemitic terror attack left 11 people dead at a synagogue in Pittsburgh.


Rest of article here:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/oct/28/mi5-lead-battle-against-uk-rightwing-extremists-police-action
 
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soundwave

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May 23, 2015
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there will be no deal they will string us along till the last day and on that day the eu will say naaaa mate not going to happen go crash and burn.:D
 
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Woosh

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May 19, 2012
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there will be no deal they will string us along till the last day and on that day the eu will say naaaa mate not going to happen go crash and burn.:D
there will be a deal, the big businesses need a deal, even if temporarily.
We need the transition then EFTA membership.
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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there will be a deal, the big businesses need a deal, even if temporarily.
We need the transition then EFTA membership.
AS we discussed earlier, the deal is already done, this is window dressing to sell it to the Bexit Voters as it isn't what they wanted, but can be lauded as a "Victory!":D
 
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oldgroaner

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In the Telegraph
Boris is lying again
"
No wonder Dyson's off to Singapore - Britain is currently doomed to humiliation

Come off it Boris, it isn't because of the Chequers Deal is it?
 
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tillson

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May 29, 2008
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Really? nice Urban myth you have there Tillson

The Tory fallacy: that migrants are taking British jobs and driving down wages
Vince Cable
The leaked proposals on post-Brexit immigration give us a useful insight into the government’s thought processes. The desire seems largely to be about addressing “public concern” over pressure on public services, depression of wages and displacement of UK workers: that is, issues of perception, whether or not they are real.


Post-Brexit immigration: 10 key points from the Home Office document
Read more
That policy is driven by an obsession with meeting the net immigration target of “tens of thousands”: despite it being continually exceeded since the Conservative pledge was made seven years ago; despite its dependence on levels of emigration over which the government has absolutely no control; and despite the inclusion of overseas students in the net immigration numbers whose contribution we now know to be massively overstated.

The document makes much of the distinction between skilled and unskilled labour and between “hard” and “soft” skills. Bankers, engineers and footballers are welcome, but not hotel receptionists, care workers, chefs or cleaners. By implication, unskilled jobs should be reserved for British workers. But it isn’t clear where, with record levels of employment, the reserve army of unemployed, unskilled Britons is currently billeted.

At the heart of the politics of immigration is the belief, repeated by Theresa May as a fact, that immigrants, especially unskilled immigrants, depress wages. At first sight the argument seems plausible – and undeniably there is low-wage competition in some places. But there is no evidence that this is a general problem. When the coalition embarked on its review of EU competences in 2013, I commissioned a range of reviews and studies to establish the facts. They showed that the impact on wages was very small (and only in recession conditions). By and large, immigrants were doing jobs that British people didn’t want to do (or highly skilled jobs that helped to generate work for others). This research was inconvenient to the Home Office, which vetoed the publication of its results. I have now written to the prime minister to ask her to publish them as part of the current public debate.

Take note of the sentence I marked out in Bold.
All very nice. I’m surprised to see you quoting “Cable Guy” I thought he’d fallen out of favour.

Stripping away all the flowery sentiments & political agenda from the above, we are left with a simple supply and demand situation. Thanks to free movement, we have an oversupply of people willing to accept low wages and poor / nonexistent contracts. The rich business owners are cashing in.
 

anotherkiwi

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Jan 26, 2015
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All very nice. I’m surprised to see you quoting “Cable Guy” I thought he’d fallen out of favour.

Stripping away all the flowery sentiments & political agenda from the above, we are left with a simple supply and demand situation. Thanks to free movement, we have an oversupply of people willing to accept low wages and poor / nonexistent contracts. The rich business owners are cashing in.
That's trickle down economics! They (rich business owners) create the jobs, they cash in and pay their taxes in tax havens! Please tell Margaret Thatcher it is working the next time you bump into her.
 

oldgroaner

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Nov 15, 2015
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All very nice. I’m surprised to see you quoting “Cable Guy” I thought he’d fallen out of favour.

Stripping away all the flowery sentiments & political agenda from the above, we are left with a simple supply and demand situation. Thanks to free movement, we have an oversupply of people willing to accept low wages and poor / nonexistent contracts. The rich business owners are cashing in.
And I see you still using Character assasination as an opening ploy.
Why do that?
With a minimum wage in force your assertion
"people willing to accept low wages and poor / nonexistent contracts. The rich business owners are cashing in"
Applies to all people seeking work as they are offered mainly part time insecure work that won't give a wage that can be used for a normal life

In fact the latest from the ONS is this

The estimated number of EU citizens coming to the UK to work has continued to decrease. The main decrease between 2016 and 2017 was in EU citizens looking for work, but much of the most recent decrease can be accounted for by a fall in the number coming to the UK for a definite job over the last year, particularly citizens of EU15 countries.
with around 90,000 more EU citizens coming to the UK than leaving in the year ending March 2018.
270,000 more people are coming to the UK than leaving,

So in fact only a third (90,000) of people coming in are from the EU
There were 32.39 million people in work, March to May 2018

that as a percentage is 0.002778635381290522


Well done for making a mountain out of a molehill
You are still peddling Urban Myths.
Tell me is Brexit with all it's disadvantges worth disrupting the NHS, farming , catering and other seasonal industries for so trifling an advantage?
Not to mention the Polish contingent who have brought a level of professionalism to the plumbing and building trade (and others) that were sorely lacking.

Amazing the passion Brexit voters have for shooting their own feet.

And after Brexit what will happen? the jolly old UK government will come to trade deals all over the world and presto! more immigrants from further afield, more than filling up the gap left by eliminating EU immigrants.
Great Plan.......NOT.
And all of this needs to be placed in context
"
The proportion of children in the UK population has declined from over 24% in 1975 to less than 20% in 2015. This proportion is projected to decline even further in future years.

The proportion of the UK population who could be described as “traditional working age” (16 to 64 years old) has remained relatively stable over the last 40 years, but it is projected to decline in future years as a result of the growth of the ageing population."

Without immigration the Future is quite simply one of decline as most immigrants are of working age.
And in the long term the ethnic mix of the nation will change as a result, and that is simply well underway already whether you like it or not.
 
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