Hi - I need some help choosing a bike for my wife

[jules_wake]

Hi from the South of France - I am fortunate to live in a great region for biking about 20 minutes from the coast near Nice and with the Alps just behind. I am a regular rider on a road and mountain bike and I would like to get my wife an electric bike so we can go out on trips together. Realistically I think it would be best to get a road bike as the mountain trails are pretty tricky. I normally do up to 100 km rides with some big climbs and average around 25 km/h on a good day. My wife is pretty fit but does not do much biking so I would like to see if there is a bike which could enable her to match me (or even better push me to go faster!)

Reading the site I guess a crank would be best for range and also give the possibility of more gears. I don't think drop handle bars are necessary but a reasonably sporty feel would help for the downhills/corners. Budget is reasonably unrestricted. Comfort wise front suspension might be nice as long as it does not add too much weight. For sure skinny tyres are a must otherwise on the downhill she is going to be way behind.

Any ideas/thoughts gladly received.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Crank drive doesn't give any more range and normally restricts you to less gears because of the single chainwheel.

Without knowing what hub-motored bikes are available where you live, it would be difficult to give specific advice on them, and most probably wouldn't be suitable for what you want. Without a budget, you can go down to your nearest Ebike shop and buy whichever crank-drive bike floats your boat. The difference in power isn't enough to be a deal breaker. For warranty, you're pretty well stuck with whatever is in your local shop because it will be difficult to get things sorted otherwise. If you were on a tight budget, advice would be different.

 

[jules_wake]

I'm not so fussed about buying locally I come back to the UK reasonably often and in my experience warranties are Europe wide.

Are you saying that we can get better gear ratios with a hub?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Warranties are not Europe wide. That's the point. We've been discussing this intensively on this forum. It turns out that there is virtually no brand warranty. Your warranty is with the shop you bought it from. Ebikes are not handled like cars or washing machines. There's very little structure to deal with warranties, as you'll find out if you have a warranty issue to deal with and you didn't buy locally.

 

[jules_wake]

That's a pain... Will need to find a local retailer although I've not seen many electric bikes here so far...

 

[anotherkiwi]

You can buy her an s-pedelec if she has her drivers licence. She may need a second battery to do 100km. How about a nice Grace MXII Urban? Of course she will have to wear a motorbike helmet but I am sure you can get away with a UVEX or Casco.

 

[jules_wake]

Had a look at the Grace what is the gear system? I am used to cassettes this looks something different. I guess I am worried about having the battery run low a long way from home and with everything being electric/heavy ending up being stuck. Also ideally I'd like something as close to a normal bike but with just assist for hills. Would it just be better going for a hub kit on a lightweight mountain bike with skinny wheels?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You don't necessarily need a hub-motor for light weight. A hybrid type bike with thin 700c wheels and rigid thin forks will be much more efficient. You should be able to find bike that weighs 22kg or less. Derailleur gears will give the lightest weight and highest efficiency. You need to get down to the shops and see what they've got.

You didn't give any idea of your capability to sort out problems. If you buy a cheaper bike or do a DIY conversion, warranty won't be a problem.

How much does she weigh? You mentioned the mountains behind you, but do you ride up them? What sort of hills do you encounter? Will you be riding on trails or only on roads?

 

[oldtom]

Also ideally I'd like something as close to a normal bike but with just assist for hills.

If you want 'off-the-shelf', you could do worse than consider the offerings from 'Cytronex', aka 'No Hills'. They produce a range of lightweight, (some very light!), bikes from fairly decent manufacturers which are easily ridden with power switched off but are transformed for hills or headwinds with the push of a button.

The bottle battery is charged from empty in 90 minutes and is 90% charged in just over half an hour and is good for 20+ miles if used most of the time but can accomplish a lot more if used sparingly. Pedalling many other EAPCs without power can be difficult due to the weight factor.

Tom

 

[jules_wake]

You don't necessarily need a hub-motor for light weight. A hybrid type bike with thin 700c wheels and rigid thin forks will be much more efficient. You should be able to find bike that weighs 22kg or less. Derailleur gears will give the lightest weight and highest efficiency. You need to get down to the shops and see what they've got.

You didn't give any idea of your capability to sort out problems. If you buy a cheaper bike or do a DIY conversion, warranty won't be a problem.

How much does she weigh? You mentioned the mountains behind you, but do you ride up them? What sort of hills do you encounter? Will you be riding on trails or only on roads?

So to answer I am pretty competent at bike maintenance.

The hills can be steep and long some of the top bike teams do mountain training here to give you an idea. . My wife is around 60kg. We would only go on roads.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

In that case fit a Bafang BBS01 kit to her existing bike. It's dead easy to fit. I'd need to see the frame before recommending a battery.

BMSbattery.com do some nice hub-motor kits that would be good too. If it's a stepthrough frame, they do a 36v rack battery with an included 18A sinewave controller kit. Just add the motor you want (260 rpm Q100H) and away you go.

If you want to have a go at converting, show us the bike. With conversions, at least you know that you'll be able to fix any problem with the electrical stuff. Figuring out how it all works, is a lot easier than it looks.

 

[jules_wake]

If you want 'off-the-shelf', you could do worse than consider the offerings from 'Cytronex', aka 'No Hills'. They produce a range of lightweight, (some very light!), bikes from fairly decent manufacturers which are easily ridden with power switched off but are transformed for hills or headwinds with the push of a button.

The bottle battery is charged from empty in 90 minutes and is 90% charged in just over half an hour and is good for 20+ miles if used most of the time but can accomplish a lot more if used sparingly. Pedalling many other EAPCs without power can be difficult due to the weight factor.

Tom

Thanks Tom those look pretty much what I was looking for will read some reviews and see whether I can test one locally. Seem to have a huge range and I like the fact that they retain both the front and rear gears for tough climbs. With the motor on the front wheel does this impact handling to any extent?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You need to think twice and do a bit more research before leaping in. The Cytronex with Tongxin motors, by today's standards, are very low power and short on range, maybe good as a city bike, but not for mountain climbing. The motors are very fragile too and difficult to repair when they break. There's plenty of modern stuff that's much more reliable and versatile.

Does anybody know what motors they use today because Tongxin closed down? Did Cytronex buy up all their stock beforehand? The pictures still look like Tongxins.

 

[JohnCade]

If you want 'off-the-shelf', you could do worse than consider the offerings from 'Cytronex', aka 'No Hills'. They produce a range of lightweight, (some very light!), bikes from fairly decent manufacturers which are easily ridden with power switched off but are transformed for hills or headwinds with the push of a button.

The bottle battery is charged from empty in 90 minutes and is 90% charged in just over half an hour and is good for 20+ miles if used most of the time but can accomplish a lot more if used sparingly. Pedalling many other EAPCs without power can be difficult due to the weight factor.

Tom

These seem quite expensive for what is a low powered front motor conversion though. To take the example of a Cannonade Quick 5 that is £499 list and available from Evans Cycles for £359 currently. The Cytronex converted bike is £1445. I don’t know what else is on it but over a grand for a low powered motor wheel with a speed sensor and on/off power with no other control, and a 4ah battery and charger seems a bit steep.

I was thinking of converting a Cube I have with a lightweight system to give some assistance on hills only, but there must be a cheaper way than this.

 

[jules_wake]

Yes I've done some reading on the Cytronex - and it appears that it has 2 speeds. In practice how does this work if you are riding with someone. Do they have to match your speed the whole time you are in power mode? Or is it a case of if you pedal faster it is like someone is pushing you as well. 15 mph is pretty slow on a relatively flat road so it would be a pain if she is stuck with that as a limit? I guess for the range you could always carry a spare battery...but I agree they seem pretty low powered.

 

[oldtom]

Thanks Tom those look pretty much what I was looking for will read some reviews and see whether I can test one locally.

Jules, I missed your original post in this thread earlier so I apologise for misleading you somewhat.

As far as I'm aware, Cytronex retain a base in Winchester and I don't think they sell through agents elsewhere in the UK, let alone overseas. Your location means it would make more sense to buy from a dealer within a reasonable distance from your home, albeit you may then be restricted in choice.

As d8veh has pointed out, a kit fitted to a suitable bike of your/her choice may be the best solution given that you feel sufficiently competent to install it yourself. At least, if you noticed on the Cytronex site, many of the bikes they sell are very light and less weight is a huge advantage with EAPCs so that gives an idea of what you can achieve with a good kit if you attach it to a light bicycle.

My Cannondale weighs in at 17Kgs including lights and mudguards and isn't a chore to ride with power switched off yet gets me up any hill without protest with the touch of a button. These machines, evidently, are quite popular with aged roadies who like to continue riding but need a little help with the hills. A Sunday morning 20 miler should therefore be pretty painless on a 13kg road bike if one is prepared to pay the extra money.

In answer to your question about handling, quite a number of riders prefer the front wheel drive utilising the little Tongxin motor which is little bigger than a hub dynamo and doesn't really weigh enough to significantly alter the bike's handling characteristics. It keeps things simple also as both front and rear wheels are easily removed for puncture repairs for example. On some rear wheel drive bikes, puncture repairs can be a bit of a nightmare.

Although these bikes can handle some fairly rough terrain, they are best viewed as road bikes. I have ridden mine across some tracks that I should have avoided but I simply kept the power off till I was back on smooth roads again and I have had no problems with the motor.

Cytronex-powered bikes make a lot of sense and would suit a great many people far more than many of the offerings available elsewhere. Things like manhandling a bike up and down stairs or attaching it to roof bars or a tailgate carrier are much easier with less weight. People talk about batteries that permit 70-100+ miles between charges but I never need to go that far - that's what public transport's for! I'd guess that most riders rarely go much farther than a Cytronex would take them on a single charge and when the battery is fully charged again in an hour or so, that would be perfect for many people.

I hope you find something which suits and I wish you well in your search.

Tom

 

[JohnCade]

Yes I've done some reading on the Cytronex - and it appears that it has 2 speeds. In practice how does this work if you are riding with someone. Do they have to match your speed the whole time you are in power mode? Or is it a case of if you pedal faster it is like someone is pushing you as well. 15 mph is pretty slow on a relatively flat road so it would be a pain if she is stuck with that as a limit? I guess for the range you could always carry a spare battery...but I agree they seem pretty low powered.

You aren’t stuck with 25 kph as a limit on any pedelec. My Kalkhoff is heavy but can be pedalled past the 17 mph -25 kph plus 10% - cut out easily on the flat once it’s rolling. This Cytronex will be much lighter so once the power cuts out you keep pedalling.

 

[oldtom]

Yes I've done some reading on the Cytronex - and it appears that it has 2 speeds.

The 2-speed models were dropped quite early in the bike's gestation and were replaced with a simpler version which provides assistance from very low speed up to cut-off.

The Tongxin is a low-powered motor but it's all that's required.

Tom

 

[oldtom]

These seem quite expensive for what is a low powered front motor conversion though.

Yes John, they are rather expensive but should anyone baulk at the price, one can choose a kit elsewhere from a variety of sources which can be tailored to suit. To end up with a bike of 17Kgs or even far less though, may not save a great deal of money but at least the choice of donor bike is far greater.

As for other matters, I'm not certain which of my bikes is quicker but there is little to choose between them so the Tongxin motor, while low in power output, is certainly close enough in real-time riding to my far more powerful Xion-drive Pro-Connect for it to be of little consequence. Cytronex do produce differently wound motors for different purposes including those which may or may not be legal outside of a racetrack.

I know which bike is easier to pop into the back of my car though!

Tom

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I was thinking of converting a Cube I have with a lightweight system to give some assistance on hills only, but there must be a cheaper way than this.

Checkout the new Keyde motor, which is bigger and stronger. It looks like they've had a go at sorting out the reliability issues with the old one. The complete kit with a 10Ah battery is about £700 including duty. I'm tempted:

http://www.keyde.com/en/Product/motor/Rear_motor/2015/0827/116.html