Orbea Gain auxiliary battery

Inveral

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jan 10, 2019
21
3
I've just read on another forum that the aux battery for the Gain and I assume other bikes using the same system is soon to be released. Some details here
https://www.ebikemotion.com/web/x35-range-extender/

Word is that its going to cost £510 , the capacity is 208 Wh, I'm guessing there must be quite a profit margin in that price.

I think the Bosch 500 Wh power tube battery is around the £650 level so not sure how they justify £510 for a battery with less than half this capacity.

The £510 is only what I have read on another forum it has not come from Orbea so the cost could be less than this.
 

Inveral

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jan 10, 2019
21
3
Interesting that they can quote a price for something that doesn’t even have a release date yet. It does seem very expensive.
 

Andy McNish

Pedelecer
Nov 28, 2018
203
110
Perhaps I should give a bit more detail about this, as I would not want someone thinking everyone is going to get that kind of range from an ALP powered bike.

The battery indicator dropped from 4 bars down to 3 bars within a couple of miles from home, it does not provide exact percentage read out but my guess would be I probably had about 57 or 58% capacity left.

To provide some more context I did exactly the same ride last summer on a Cube e-mtb with the CX motor. I had two bars left but it had switched from 3 bars down to 2 several miles from home so probably would have had about 30% capacity left.

I do ride quite a lot above cut off though, and this is much easier on the Cannondale Neo than on the Cube, for this reason its sort of difficult to compare say a CX equipped mtb with a an ALP equipped racing bike, as one is going to be riding above cut off more often on the racing bike than one is on the mtb.
Yes but it's real world use that counts after all.
Like you I get insane range out out my Cube Touring ALP but for the opposite reason - I only turn the motor on when I feel it's needed.

I did a 4 hour 70km trip at the weekend and used circa 25% of the battery up. Maybe one third of the time motor was off and two thirds of the time on Eco.

But if I am hammering my 40km round trip commute on Tour mode that will use up 40% of the battery on its own, and a really steep climb on Turbo like going up over Werneth Low might drain 20% in a couple of km.

So we all understand it's about context but real world usage info is still invaluable...
 
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Nealh

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 7, 2014
7,135
2,717
55
West Sx RH
Orbea have marketed the bike cleverly as a lowish KG road bike with a little help for those hills, the promise of a range extender battery to come is a little teaser. Once you have spent a good sum buying the bike you have but no choice to buy the battery if you want more range.
It is the problem with closed systems bikes you can't willy nilly parallel another battery in.
That's the main reason I why I like China kits easy to work with and batteries even with great cells are a lot cheaper.
 
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DroidOne

Finding my (electric) wheels
Aug 12, 2016
18
5
64
Stockholm (Sweden)
Orbea have marketed the bike cleverly as a lowish KG road bike with a little help for those hills, the promise of a range extender battery to come is a little teaser. Once you have spent a good sum buying the bike you have but no choice to buy the battery if you want more range.
It is the problem with closed systems bikes you can't willy nilly parallel another battery in.
That's the main reason I why I like China kits easy to work with and batteries even with great cells are a lot cheaper.
Most people on here are very happy with the range though as far as I can tell: https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/orbea-gain-e-road-bike.33598/page-3

Not that these cyclists represent the "average joe", who mostly pedals around with the maximum assist level active. In that case, the range extender will probably be needed.
 

MartinRomford

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jun 5, 2018
8
2
53
Sorry to ask a few dumb questions about the orbea gain.
I have the d30, have good range, about 60 to 70 miles but would love the reserve battery. Why cant a battery pack of same voltage and Wh capacity be just plugged in. Ebay have water bottle battery for 220 GBP. Alter power lead from charger with waterproof connectors.
What stops the main battery just accepting the second battery as a charger whilst being ridden? What is the closed system alluded to previously?
Even using the second battery when stationary would extend the range when stopping for a coffee break.
 

Nealh

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 7, 2014
7,135
2,717
55
West Sx RH
Likely that the Orbea system won't excep a third party battery, it depends on any comms between battery, controller & display info via the app.

Only connect batteries in Parallel if their voltages are pretty much equal.

You could try Paralleling another pack but both will need to be at or very near the same voltage otherwise to much current will flow high to low which may be dangerous. The current can be high if voltage is out by a lot so don't try charging one with another. The current flow causes a lot of heat and if the wiring can't cope it or connectors will melt as well as component damage to the battery bms/pcb. If all were able to cope with the current flow cell damage will also occur.

A closed system is where the component parts use comms/protocols to speak to each other, like Bosch,Yamaha & Steps systems etc. So battery, controller and display electrically speak to each other sending the correct info.
 

MartinRomford

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jun 5, 2018
8
2
53
Thank you for your detailed reply but I assume that a lot of that is assumed as well. I see no information that it is a closed system. If the charger cable were examined are you saying there may be more than two cables other than power charging cables? The reserve battery states it as three setting even charging when above speed limit. So am I correct in assuming that the voltages would be different at that point so how does the system recognise that?
Again sorry for dumb questions but 400 to 500 Gbp for a battery is excessive for 100 gbp for parts
 

Andy McNish

Pedelecer
Nov 28, 2018
203
110
If the mooted price of £510 for 203W/hr is correct it's not even just 'excesssive for parts'. All closed system battery prices are 'excessive for parts' as the manufacturers take a very healthy mark-up up on them but this seems excessive even compared to other closed system battery prices like the Bosch/ Yamaha and Fazua ones.

Bosch is generally regarded as the most expensive mainstream battery pack and that's £650 for a new 500W/hr tube battery (so £1.30 per W/hr).

This would be a simply astonishing £2.51 per W/hr if true.
 

vfr400

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 12, 2011
1,236
171
Basildon
Sorry to ask a few dumb questions about the orbea gain.
I have the d30, have good range, about 60 to 70 miles but would love the reserve battery. Why cant a battery pack of same voltage and Wh capacity be just plugged in. Ebay have water bottle battery for 220 GBP. Alter power lead from charger with waterproof connectors.
What stops the main battery just accepting the second battery as a charger whilst being ridden? What is the closed system alluded to previously?
Even using the second battery when stationary would extend the range when stopping for a coffee break.
If you're going to do that, you might as well make your own from scratch, which, as I already said, would be about the same cost for the whole bike as the Orbea replacement battery, and you get complete flexibility over speed, power and range.
 

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