Orbea Gain e road bike

badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
I don't know how Level1 relates to the previously quoted Low,medium,High, but assuming its not 'High', don't forget that this is the mode some of us are interested in you repeating your initial experiment with - and also, hear rate figures as well so we can also compare effort as well as time.

Cheers!
Joe, sorry to mix my metaphors, level 1, 2, 3 = low, medium, high. I was planning to ride today, I will do that aforementioned 25 mile route again.
 

GLJoe

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 21, 2017
401
168
UK
Joe, sorry to mix my metaphors, level 1, 2, 3 = low, medium, high. I was planning to ride today, I will do that aforementioned 25 mile route again.
Turbo mode here we come!!
I look forward with interest to the results.
(dont' forget to take your phone in case you run out of battery power and need to call for assistance :) )
 

badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
Ok, I tried to duplicate my ride on my Orbea Gain (page1 #11) using assistance levels 2 & 3 = medium & high.
I messed up a little cos I took a wrong turn and I finished with a very similar mileage but a little more climbing 1,867 ft vs about 1,600 ft.
Garmin ride details are :-
Distance: 25.65 mi
Time: 1:30:18
Avg Speed: 17.0 mph
Elev Gain: 1,867 ft
Avg HR: 123 bpm
Max HR: 143 bpm

I didn't set out to 'be faster' but I like to work reasonably hard on my rides.
What can I say but Wow ! This bike is brilliant, I'm 72 now 70kg and a pretty good climber but it's some years since I have covered 'undulating' roads at this pace.
I was on level 1 for the 1st mile and then (as requested) on levels 2 & 3 for the remaining 25 miles.
I used level 3 whenever the elevation grade went above approx 6%. There were about 6 instances of this
(see included graphs, courtesy of ebikemotion's app) The two major blocks of level3 use cover climbs of about 2 miles of constant elevation peaking around 13/14%.
I still had 57% of my battery left. This surprised me but I think this can be partly explained because the
higher assist levels allow me to maintain a high average speed up the the climb and then quickly into the
15.5mph (no assist level)
Comparing the rides: Ride 1 (level1 only) 1hr 37:58 avg 15.6 mph Today 1hr 30:18 avg 17 mph.

Here are the graphs, showing Level of assistance and Consumption.
N:B The graphs are showing the same info but the top one shows the spread well and the bottom one the figures.





So no red means over the assist level (no battery drain)
Important to note (hmm difficult to explain this ?) As I understand it, when you are at any assist level and below the 15.5 mph (approx) cut-off point the battery power (torque) supplied by the battery is inversely
proportional to the amount of power you are contributing. e.g if level 2 can provide 60% of the batteries
torque, it is not a 'given' that it does because the more you contribute the less the battery needs to.
As evidenced by the red consumption spikes the torque can fall below or go above the level2 median.
This is the beauty of 'Pedal Assistance' on these bikes where the available battery range is to a large extent
dependent on the riders input.
Ok, feel free to disagree with me, I do not claim to be an expert. Hopefully this may help someone but hey !
if not it has kept me out of the wife's way for an hour. :p
 
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GLJoe

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 21, 2017
401
168
UK
Ok, I tried to duplicate my ride on my Orbea Gain (page1 #11) using assistance levels 2 & 3 = medium & high.
....
I was on level 1 for the 1st mile and then (as requested) on levels 2 & 3 for the remaining 25 miles.
I'm late coming back to this so sorry for the delay.
Thanks for doing the test. There was some interesting data in there, however I guess I was hoping that you'd do the whole route completely in level3 assist. The difference in battery drain and time taken between the different modes is tricky to figure out when you only ride in level 3 for part of the time.

Go on ... once the storm is gone, you know you want to do the ride again (and with as much assistance as you possibly can have!) :)
 

badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
Hi again Joe,
Not sure how much it will help as I ride above the assistance level a lot of the time. However I will do it for you (because I like you :) ) not sure when, but I will send you a PM when I’ve done it.
 
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MartinRomford

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jun 5, 2018
12
8
53
I have the d30 and find when climbing or general riding that level 3 red does get me to cut off speed quicker so I tend to use less battery. My next experiment is to do climbing with spinning and grinding to see what difference that makes whilst in level 3. Anyone who has a comment on that I would be interested in. Go to Alps late June so will be doing lots of climbs and seeing what works better for me and the bike. Looking at local tourist info, they have so many ebikes that the restaurants have charging points and rider just needs to check with staff and plug in free of charge. Will see if true
 

badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
I have the d30 and find when climbing or general riding that level 3 red does get me to cut off speed quicker so I tend to use less battery. My next experiment is to do climbing with spinning and grinding to see what difference that makes whilst in level 3. Anyone who has a comment on that I would be interested in. Go to Alps late June so will be doing lots of climbs and seeing what works better for me and the bike. Looking at local tourist info, they have so many ebikes that the restaurants have charging points and rider just needs to check with staff and plug in free of charge. Will see if true
Hi Martin,
I haven’t tested your theory but I would be surprised if level 3 red in any situation results in longer battery range. I read somewhere the assist levels by default ( they can be changed) Are 30/60/100%. Spinning or grinding ? I would choose spinning every time, bugger the battery think of your knees. :)
 

Jowwy

Pedelecer
Jul 20, 2018
89
22
43
I have the d30 and find when climbing or general riding that level 3 red does get me to cut off speed quicker so I tend to use less battery. My next experiment is to do climbing with spinning and grinding to see what difference that makes whilst in level 3. Anyone who has a comment on that I would be interested in. Go to Alps late June so will be doing lots of climbs and seeing what works better for me and the bike. Looking at local tourist info, they have so many ebikes that the restaurants have charging points and rider just needs to check with staff and plug in free of charge. Will see if true
Are you able to take the ebike on a plane or you travelling by car and ferry
 

badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
My Orbea gain continues to amaze and delight me. The perfect e-bike for me.
I did a couple of rides recently over 'flatish' terrain (about as flat as you can get around here)
Conditions were good, fine with 4/5mph winds (also pretty unusual)
The bike was in Level1 assist (Green) all the time.
My Level1 assist has been adjusted down to 90% of max.
Here are the rides:

Ride 1. 28th april
Distance: 20.07 mi
Time: 1:14:15
Avg Speed: 16.2 mph
Elev Gain: 568 ft
ebikemotion app reports 91% of battery still remaining

N:B I didn't charge the battery.

Ride2. 01st may
Distance: 29.35 mi
Time: 1:48:46
Avg Speed: 16.2 mph
Elevation gain 912 ft
Battery used 14%

Total over two rides
Mileage 49 mi
Time 3hrs 03 mins
Avg Speed 16.2 mph
Elev Gain 1,480ft
Battery used 23%

I appreciate this is not necessarily representative but it shows what 'range' may be available for the right rider in the right conditions.
 
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Andy McNish

Pedelecer
Nov 28, 2018
232
123
But on flat tarmac on a road bike with no wind why would you really need a battery at all?
You'd expect a road bike to not need assistance to get over 25kph in those conditions.

I mean for the price of a base level Gain you could get a carbon road bike with half the weight. like these ones (both 8.5kg):

https://www.rutlandcycling.com/bikes/road-bikes/specialized-roubaix-elite-2018-carbon-road-bike-red_379960?currency=GBP (£1600)

or even

https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/CBPXPCEDRIV22/planet-x-pro-carbon-evo-disc-rival22 (£999)

Surely the ebike is only better into stiff winds or going up hills - unless you have significant physical impairment you'd be faster on a normal bike no?
 
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badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
But on flat tarmac on a road bike with no wind why would you really need a battery at all?
You'd expect a road bike to not need assistance to get over 25kph in those conditions.

I mean for the price of a base level Gain you could get a carbon road bike with half the weight. like these ones (both 8.5kg):

https://www.rutlandcycling.com/bikes/road-bikes/specialized-roubaix-elite-2018-carbon-road-bike-red_379960?currency=GBP (£1600)

or even

https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/CBPXPCEDRIV22/planet-x-pro-carbon-evo-disc-rival22 (£999)

Surely the ebike is only better into stiff winds or going up hills - unless you have significant physical impairment you'd be faster on a normal bike no?
Hi Andy,

I have a carbon road bike, a Felt with ultegra groupset & campo zonda wheels
, an 8 kg beauty that I still ride.
I have no physical impairment, unless you count being 72 and by many
riders criteria I don’t ‘need’ an e-bike. I ride 4,000 - 5,000 miles a year in and
around the Yorkshire Dales and it is very ‘lumpy’ around here.
I can still ride 15% hills on my unassisted bike but the Orbea Gain
is a second alternative that allows me to go further and higher with confidence.
The rides I posted above are not a true reflection of my usual rides, as I indicated.
I was giving an idea of the possible range of the bike in those conditions.
You appear to have made the assumption (like many others) that a ‘pedal assisted ‘ bike is only ridden by a ‘certain’ type of rider. Hopefully I have given you a glimpse of another kind ?
 
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Artstu

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 2, 2009
2,304
865
But on flat tarmac on a road bike with no wind why would you really need a battery at all?

Surely the ebike is only better into stiff winds or going up hills - unless you have significant physical impairment you'd be faster on a normal bike no?
I'm really glad you asked that question, it's a question I could level at you, I'd be pleased if you would give it some thought and answer the same question given your average speeds down at 9 to 11 mph. Wouldn't you be better off on a normal bike?
 

Andy McNish

Pedelecer
Nov 28, 2018
232
123
I'm really glad you asked that question, it's a question I could level at you, I'd be pleased if you would give it some thought and answer the same question given your average speeds down at 9 to 11 mph. Wouldn't you be better off on a normal bike?
Well often I would be yes - and for short rides at weekends I do use my old all steel Marin MTB because it's lighter and more agile (I also still use it often it's the base line for my fitness route so I track how fit or otherwise I am over the past 4-5 years using it and my HRM on that route).

I use the ebike when I know I'm going up hills, for 2+ hour rides (when I might get tired - especailly if it's hot) or when I'm exploring and have no idea what I'm going to find. And for commuting to make it faster, easier and less sweaty.

I'm not criticising anyone for using an ebike or for giving real world usage figures for their battery and bike- obviously you can use whatever bike you want for any ride and real world usage figures are always useful if properly caveated -but if you test the range of an e- road bike on flat tarmac on a windless day, you have to especially bear in mind that most people will be cycling at or above the cut-off the vast majority of the time in such conditions (which indeed is what the figures suggest).

Given that its logically much easier to reach and exceed cut-off on an 8.5kg bike than a 16.5kg one, the obvious first question is - "if the Gain was 8.5kg would you have used the battery at all"? And if the answer is 'no' or 'only marginal use' what do you 'gain' (pardon the pun) from using an ebike on such a route?

Any road bike has a 60km + range in those conditions (unless the rider is under some form of disability) and a 8.5kg bike will generally go faster than a 16.5kg one.

So if I owned a 8.5kg road bike and a 16.5kg Gain and knew I was going on a 20-30km flat tarmac ride on a windless day, then yes, I'd personally tend to take the lighter bike. Wouldn't you?
 
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MartinRomford

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jun 5, 2018
12
8
53
I have two broken vertabrae so the Gain allows me to go on club rides, hilly routes are obviously easier but put less strain on my spine. I have a carbon di2 ultegra under 8kg but any hills hurt. Yes on the flat i can keep above 15.5 mph so that benefits me with range on one battery.
No you cant take an ebike on a plane but ferry yes.
 

Artstu

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 2, 2009
2,304
865
All of the reviews I have read for the Orbea Gain e road bikes are posted by professional or very fit road cyclists. I am thinking of buying an Orbea Gain but am worried that it might not handle some of the very steep hills and on average 50 miles day trips in my area. I am not as fit I was due to having a long layoff with knee ligament damage resulting in increased weight to 15st. Does anybody have any information regarding how this motor performs on very steep hills.
I had a ride on a Gain yesterday, it was a nice bike and felt very similar to my racing bike, it rolled well above the 16 mph cut-out. I tried it on a couple of steep hills, I'd say the assistance was a bit less than the Tour setting(1/2 power) of my weedy (deuned for hub gears) Bosch Classic. The biggest plus of the bike is how it rolls above 16 mph. I'm not sue whether it is a bike I'd want myself, I prefer the greater level of power options on my Bosch crank drive.
The owner of the Gain was having a much easier ride on my bike, although my bike is stuck in Turbo mode (full power) due to a faulty remote switch.
 

badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
I know there are many interested in this bike so a current update on my experience.
Close to 600 miles completed on my Gain D30 ( I also ride a non-assisted road bike) I have to say this is the perfect pedal assisted bike for me.
I have just finished my 4th ride without needing to charge the battery. Total of 90 miles, 3,600ft of climbing 16.1mph avg speed and the ebikemotion app shows 42% battery remaining. Admittedly not a lot of climbing for this mileage.
I am 72, 70kg and a pretty strong rider with no handicaps so you have to factor the rider in when looking at these figures.
" Just enough" I believe is Orbea's claim for the assistance on this bike and that describes it brilliantly.
I deliberated long and hard before buying this bike as I was concerned I would lose some fitness and stamina riding an assisted bike ?
If that has happened it is negligible. Riding this 16kg (on the road) bike, most of the time above the 15.5mph assist levels certainly helps the fitness. I rarely if ever move out of the lowest assistance level 1 which again helps with the fitness. Incidentally I have 'dialled down' the assistance levels to Level1 (lowest) 90%
Level2 80% and Level3 70%. Many may say " why bother to buy the bike" and that is fair comment.
Apart from the fact I like nice shiny new bikes
^_^
It is reassuring to know the assistance is there when needed and age related decline is cetainly noticeable over the last few years and it ain't gonna go away.
:sad:


Absolutely brilliant bike providing you do not expect high levels of assistance over large distances.
 
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MartinRomford

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jun 5, 2018
12
8
53
Try one before buying. I did and have had mine for 6 months. If I going on a flat route then conventional bike suits. But hills are so easy on the gain. Have a second battery arriving soon. Will wire up in parallel and then test before an Alps trip
 

badlywornroy

Pedelecer
Nov 1, 2018
65
37
Richmond North Yorkshire
Try one before buying. I did and have had mine for 6 months. If I going on a flat route then conventional bike suits. But hills are so easy on the gain. Have a second battery arriving soon. Will wire up in parallel and then test before an Alps trip
I presume you are not talking about the long awaited (but never seen) 'water bottle' battery Martin ?
Do you mean you are getting another battery as per the one fitted ? how are you carrying/attaching this second battery. Intriguing, care to explain ?