Woosh Big Bear and Santana CD-L Comparison

[CameraDealer]

I posted yesterday about my experience riding a Big Bear (BB) around Lake Annecy, which was brilliant. This morning I did the same trip using my wife's Santana CD-L (SCD).

I've only ridden the SCD once before, which was a sixteen mile trip from my office,where it had been delivered, to my home. Only one steep hill up to my house, short but very, very steep. I made it with effort. I was generally pleased with the bike but I hadn't taken delivery of the BB so had nothing to compare it with.

The BB knocks the SCD into a cocked hat! (Where did that phrase come from?) First of all the very long and steep hill north out of Talloire. This is a hell of a climb and the BB ate it up. I hardly broke sweat and was overtaking fit young cyclists in lycra.

The SCD was hard work. I made it up the col but with a hell of a lot of effort. It didn't help that it wouldn't go into first gear. I thought I'd adjusted the gears properly but obviously not.

The other striking thing is that the SCD is harder to ride! Around Annecy yesterday on the BB I turned off the power as it was flat and we were going slowly in low gears as there were many pedestrians. Turning off the power on the SCD meant that I had to put in more effort. Could this be because of the crank drive? Of course on the BB, being a front hub drive, you are pedaling as on a normal bike. On a crank drive with the power turned off are you also having to turn the crank motor when pedaling?

I also found that, whereas I was happy to have the BB on level one, I was having to use the SCD on level three to have as easy a ride.

I don't want to get involved in this crank versus hub drive debate as I know nothing about the technicalities of either. However, the hub drive BB is easier to ride, climbs hills much better and is far easier to ride without power.

Could this be simply because the BB has a much more powerful drive? Obviously, a hub drive with a power of 100, should be better than a crank drive with a power of 50, if you see what I mean? The figures are meaningless and purely to make a point.

When my wife recovers from her spill I'm going to let her try the BB. If she's happy with it I may well be looking at selling the SCD and getting another BB.

 

[JohnCade]

The Woosh Sport CD I had was not pleasant to ride unpowered and needed to be on at least three to get any benefit. It was fast on the flat and fine on moderate hills, but struggled with very steep ones. As to CD versus hub I doubt it has any relevance since my Kalkhoff CD pedals very well unpowered. So more about the individual units than anything else.

From what I've read it's more that the BPM in the Big Bear is one of the most powerful motors around now.

Isn't knocked into a cocked hat literally to ruin something? Like knocking a normal hat around and turning it into something like an old naval cocked hat, which is a triangle shape turned up at the brim.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You've summed it up pretty well when you said, "a hub drive with a power of 100, should be better than a crank drive with a power of 50". The big Bear has a bigger, more powerful motor.

It would have made a big difference on the SCD if you could've got first gear. The motor doesn't have a lot of torque, but the gears multiply it. The trick to get easy hill-climbing on the SCD is to let the bike slow right down in first gear, which will give fairly effortless pedalling, but you go pretty slow.

The higher effort to pedal is a mystery. Lift each wheel off the ground and spin them. If they don't spin, something is wrong, like brakes binding or tight wheel bearing. If they do spin, lift the back-wheel off the ground and turn the crank by hand. Can you feel the motor turning. There's a free-wheel in the motor, so you shouldn't feel anything significant. If you turn the crank fast to get the wheel spinning, then while the wheel's spinning fast, turn the crank slowly to feel its actual resistance.

 

[neptune]

Cocked Hat. http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/knocked-into-a-cocked-hat.html

 

[CameraDealer]

I've just ridden my Big Bear to the bike shop up the road from where we're staying at Lake Annecy. The difference in power and responsiveness of the BB is very noticeable. If my wife likes it when she's fit to give it a try I may be talking to the lovely, understanding and very helpful Hatti (just in case she reads this!) about a trade-in. I'm a retailer and know what's what but if it comes to this I just hope I'm not losing too much. But the bikes are such super value compared to what I was originally considering that I'll still be quids in.

The bike shop is going to set up the gears for me so that I can get first gear on the Santana. It's hopeless trying to do it myself without a stand. And I can never get it right anyway!

 

[derf]

I've just ridden my Big Bear to the bike shop up the road from where we're staying at Lake Annecy. The difference in power and responsiveness of the BB is very noticeable. If my wife likes it when she's fit to give it a try I may be talking to the lovely, understanding and very helpful Hatti (just in case she reads this!) about a trade-in. I'm a retailer and know what's what but if it comes to this I just hope I'm not losing too much. But the bikes are such super value compared to what I was originally considering that I'll still be quids in.

The bike shop is going to set up the gears for me so that I can get first gear on the Santana. It's hopeless trying to do it myself without a stand. And I can never get it right anyway!

have a look at this http://sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html
having destroyed the rear hanger on a lovely old kona, I decided to be very careful when doing the Santana and used Sheldon's instructions - its very easy (you just twiddle the plastic screw that's perpendicular to the rear wheel clockwise or anticlockwise)

 

[derf]

have a look at this http://sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html
having destroyed the rear hanger on a lovely old kona, I decided to be very careful when doing the Santana and used Sheldon's instructions - its very easy (you just twiddle the plastic screw that's perpendicular to the rear wheel clockwise or anticlockwise)

sorry puterglitch, that was meant for cameradealer