jdunphy

Thought I would share this for a potential upgrade if you need extra battery or are having a problem with the connector later that can't be resolved. These are pictures I have found of what others are trying - This came from a facebook post in the group: Swytch Bike Chat. They use that balance/extra battery cable I posted in a previous post on this thread and stick the entire bag into a new front bag + extra battery. They cut a hole to pass the cables from the bottom of the bag and also cutaway some fabric on the top so you can see the display from the existing bag. That would be a fairly easy hack to extend battery range without doing much to the existing kit. Threading that balance wire pigtail through the existing opening in the Swytch battery bag is the only technical challenge. One could also bypass the entire cable connector harness and plug directly into the individual components like PAS, throttle, motor, etc. They are using water proof connectors inside the bag for PAS, Throttle, Brake, etc. Pictures shown earlier in the thread of these cables and ends. Most difficult part would be to map external 9 pin to an internal 9 pin cable. Perhaps someone else has already done that. I haven't researched it that far yet nor dissembled that connector harness myself to see what is the best strategy.

Chris, Swytch support (Edwin) diagnosed it as a bracket problem and would arrange the replacement to be shipped. We immediately heard from Michael - 13 mins later (aftercare team??? - they didn't use that term with my wife) stating they didn't know when it would be available to be shipped but we should expect it. Summary... item wasn't in inventory April 25 they diagnosed it as a bracket problem May 10 item arrived in Victoria, BC We were notified of pending shipment and had tracking. Jim

Chris, It wasn't just one support person according to my wife. Here is who she delt with: Tommy, Michael, Latisha, Kirsty, Graziano, Edwin. My wife was very detailed and specific in her reporting and questioned them many times and they were patient and polite with each response. She felt like they were trying to get to root cause but it took some time because of that checklist and one email per day correspondence rate. Her biggest frustration was they had no idea when it would leave the warehouse given they were out of stock and there would be no tracking. In the end, they provided both and it arrived fairly fast. Jim

We are only using the Handlebar mount (bracket). I felt like our PAS was working and I think they pulled their standard accessory box kit which includes a 2A charger with UK plug (can't use here), a PAS, and the new bracket mount.

Chris, Yes...it definitely feels like they are following a flow chart and the one answer per day email response pace (at least for us in the west coast of Canada) does take a bit of time. We have not had any further issues and it seems to be working flawlessly. We road tested it over some serious broken roads and bumps without issue. Our goal has been to try and make it fail. Not yet. If you are comfortable, you might pull the battery tray out and verify cables are snug and seated. I used that opportunity to take some pictures and research replacements if that was the direction we were headed. Swytch has a video how to replace a controller which is what I used as guidance for myself. Putting it all back is where that video was helpful as it can be a tight fit. Our upgrades. 1) I added a 3rd party throttle - as a backup in case it cut off on her while we were waiting for parts. She rarely uses it. 2) I ordered a new 3rd party PAS yesterday (all in one design) that you pull the crank and slip on. If it works, I'll add that to this thread. Nothing wrong with the current PAS but this looks like it could have less maintenance. 3) we will probably come up with a solution for the eco battery range. I am torn between getting an add on cable that works with the current battery + another battery OR replacing her battery pack with higher quality and more energy dense cells. We don't have that need but it is something we will probably explore at some point. My wife is happy with her kit and hopefully this problem is resolved for us. Jim

Replacement parts arrived today in Victoria, BC Canada May 10. We also had tracking and were notified of the parts leaving the warehouse in contrast to what my wife was told by support. They sent a few extra's too. New PAS, new charger, and new handbar mount. Next up is to give this some testing. Will report back after a few hundred miles in a few weeks if the new handbar mount corrected it.

Interesting where this topic has gone with the gen 3 product line. My wife has the gen 2 product and it would appear that not much has changed other than better damping, more mechanical strain reduction, etc between gen 1 and gen 2. After market products have come forward and are readily available so that one can attach a second battery and locate that battery where it makes sense for ones bike. An example is this little $30 cable. Ref: https://batterypowersupplied.co.uk/products/dual-battery-balance-circuit?variant=37695448809635 Likewise a community of swytch owners have been sharing their experiences, enhancements, and repairs to various parts that fail from hall sensors to adding new controllers to completely bypassing the swytch intermediate cable harness. Gen 3 looks like a realization that their market is for people that need a simpler install and that the connection harness was a design flaw they can't overcome with more rubber and conformal coatings. If feels like they are running out the clock on Gen 1 and 2 owners with their warranties as out of stock is the norm for those replacement parts. Support costs must be killing them which is a lengthy proposition with an email per day style of correspondence. I have been watching my wife deal with tech support and they don't appear to read the tickets and offer conflicting advice from previous Sywtch tech support. Whatever the problem, they can not sustain that model it would appear. By increasing the costs, adding less capability at the lower price point where the product existed they are now competing directly with more capable higher end kits from either their LBS, online stores or the inexpensive e-bike market. For many people, buying a $600-$900 ebike from Costco could be an easier decision than a $500-$900 kit + S/H if they are not tied to an existing bike. Even in Canada, we have seen folding e-bikes in the $400 CAD (igo) and we pay dearly for stuff here. ;-)

I haven't done enough reading on Cycle Analyst at this point but the swytch controller does support a throttle which I installed last week to allow my wife to have access to the motor in a more predictable fashion. They did swap the signal and ground with their cabling coming out of the connector so off the shelf can be a problem unless you do this: ref: https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/2-swytch-conversions-and-a-kit-from-amazon.43224/page-2#post-650669 Thank you, Those are excellent options also and I will look into that further. That would be an excellent method to unwind any proprietary decisions that Swytch may have created. Currently the hub motor is working perfectly with the throttle so the PAS/harness seems to be the best guess of it's random behavior. Adding additional dampening to the mount makes it happen less often in addition to switching the angle the pack is mounted. Not enough data to recommend this yet. We did a 22 mile trip on Friday and it behaved very well.

If you have a throttle or something fancier and it doesn't work with your Swytch (eco) this might help. I ordered what I thought was a compatible FT-21X female WP (water proof) throttle cable last night and it arrived this morning. It fit but it didn't work. Brought out the MM and found Swytch has swapped the signal and ground from what Bafang expected. The solution was to update the throttle cable and swap it back. So any of the BaFang model BBS01/BBS02/BBSHD will work which is what I had. Another solution might be to order an extender cable and fix it there which would allow you to use any throttle in the future or from your parts bin should the Swytch specific one fail.

I have read a lot of good things too but I would guess when something doesn't work, the owners frustration can generate more noise in contrast. I have had a lot of that recently! ;-) ;-) What I didn't say is this: The instructions are super clear (colour pictures in 65 page instruction booklet, how to videos, a large user community, packed really well (Apple would be proud), and there is Sywtch support to help should you run into any problems during your install + it's warranted for a year (they will ship you parts at no cost). So very high probability that any bike will be an e-bike with the kit once your package arrives. I don't know enough what is good or bad quality out there other than the stuff I read from Grin Technologies but my wife's use is different from some of their customers that use there ebikes for 5000mile treks over the Rocky Mountains without having the motor burn upon climbs. My wife wanted some assist but not at the expense of adding too much weight to her bike as exercise is still her primary reason for riding. We tend to ride around 15-17 mph on level ground and she keeps it at level 1 assist... but that extra boost does make a big difference for her. She gets to keep her own bike and its gearing and picking a solution for her was fairly easy given the marketing done by Swytch. I am no expert but it appears they took some off the shelf parts and packaged them so that most if not all bikes can be converted with a universal kit. Added great instructions, how to videos, and support to make sure everyone that buys has success. For example, not having to pull the crank to install the PAS eliminated any specialty tools some bikes might require. One of the things I am toying with is purchasing something like Cycle Analyst V3 from Grin, plugging all the devices into that and have it manage the motor controller. That should allow us to add features like cruise control, better assist modes for her cadence, keep parts and eventually bypass and replace things that are out of warranty or update when our needs change. Still in the research phase on this. That would allow us to work around the weaknesses of the product like the harness should it fail and put the pieces where it makes the most sense for her bike. Once you open that battery bag, you can unconnect all the parts and use them how or where you want with cable extenders, racks, bags, etc.

Thanks for your reply. Those are excellent points. It doesn't seem like the new connector solution will last if they are shipping the same part without some sort of major structural modification. We got 18 miles on a recent 2022 build; how many miles for the next/same connector? I have read about similar problems as far back as 2018 so it isn't something new. We have also found similar reports of the bike just starting on it's own at rest. The reported work around is to power off the unit especially at more dangerous rest scenarios such as being stopped at intersections. That the PAS could send some random voltage at rest (having been stopped for 30-45 seconds) or a controller thought it observed/registered voltage/spurious noise or even some other fault anomaly gives me a lot to think about on how to isolate this further. I tried grease that others found was a fix for but it didn't help here. We got 1/2 block down the road and it cut out briefly and we came back. I cleaned again with isopropyl to get back to pristine clean surfaces. I believe the PAS signal line is on blade/pin 10, blade/pin 2 (hot) and blade/pin 11(ground). Still thinking on how to isolate and find a way to test whether it could be a controller problem vs a PAS problem vs other. I pulled the battery pack apart to look for any loose connectors that might be unseated. Also verified the controller which which was built 10/2021 but otherwise identical to the picture I posted from someone that received a replacement controller for similar motor cut off problem. A casual observation looked like everything is firmly attached and they use plenty of conforming glue/coating or re-enforced the ends of tehir wires to hold things in place and provide additional mechanical stress relief. I have not looked too closely at the part they plan on replacing - only from the outside. The few pictures I could take of it and magnify any external wires showed no evidence of stress on wires. Seems to be common enough that everyone has a few workarounds that sort of help for some. As for being at rest and motor starting, It also plausible that something has triggered the controllers walk assist mode which doesn't require PAS signalling and only needs a signal or spurious signal to initiate? Update: We queried Swytch support again Apr 25, 2025 and they have stated that the new connector will fix both types of faults (motor cutting on/off and suddenly starting at rest without PAS on a kickstand). A few more pictures from our kit (eco) to help others identify parts/cables that might be needed in the future.

I have started to document this kit. Might be helpful to others. This is the eco kit. See pictures of controllers and pin outs. Believe the motor could be a AKM 85sx (current guess). Note: these are not my pictures but found them in other forums, etc.

Hello everyone, I am really enjoying reading and learning about e-bikes from these forums. I certainly feel that I could buy any kit and do it myself now including building a battery pack thanks to some really great posted video's from here on how to safely do this. I already maintain my own bikes so have most of the specific bike tools and do fix electronics at the component level so not afraid of a multi meter and a soldering iron. I am a retired systems programmer by trade. My wife received her swytch kit a few weeks ago after 7 months waiting for it. It worked perfectly for 1 and 1/2 rides (approx 18 miles). She has been working with Swytch over the past 10 days to find resolution and I am not sure I buy their conclusion as I see multiple unexplained failure modes. They will ship a new handle bar battery pack assembly (see picture) but don't have it in stock and then it will be 2-4 weeks after that. We are in Victoria, BC Canada so double that time it always feels like. ;--) The problem I have is that her bike was on its kickstand for about 30-45 seconds with her off of the bike and behind it. The front wheel motor suddenly lurched forward throws the bike on the ground with enough force (wrestling pile driver comes to mind) to skew her handbars sideways. We were discussing the motor cutting in/out so I witnessed this first hand. Prior to that we saw this behavior when moving the crank by hand with no result only to see it happen 10-15 seconds later or during coasting at times when she is on it. Normally there is a small delay about 1-2 seconds which is normal for this controller which she likes. The other symptoms are that she isn't able to keep the motor running for more than 5 mins with the average about 10-20 seconds as the motor cuts off. Sometimes it cuts back in fairly soon which is ok but a lot of time she can't get it to start again for minutes. The only thing that is reliable is that the motor will only operate when you don't need it. :-) ;-) ;-) That means almost never completely up a hill. It works almost always down hill but can fail there too. I estimate her cadence is around 50-60 but I have tested her PAS by turning the peddle with my hand and observed the sensor picking each and every pass of the magnets. Another odd thing which we only saw once was a fully charged battery mysteriously lost 2 bars of charge in 1.5 miles on flat roads??? Fortunately, we ride mostly flat roads or 1-2 degrees gradients here and bought the swytch so she could ride with me. She loves her bike and was hesitant to go electric so it seemed like a good solution and now is hooked on the concept of a front wheel hub motor. I am not sold on her kit but her small hub motor is more than good enough for her style of riding. She never has it past assist level 1. We generally go about 22 miles per ride so her swytch eco kit could be perfect if it would function as advertised. I have completely done and redone the PAS. I have strapped her battery + controller + BMS + display in that swytch bag so that there is no vertical play with the handle bar connector. I have cleaned the contacts. I have reset the battery pack and re-inserted it into the connector after it begins to fail and she still can't get the hub motor to engage at times. We will pull over, I will verify the PAS and then pull and re-insert the battery+controller+etc and off we go. Motor will not engage at times even after that doing that. We get better results during the first 1-2 miles of our ride where it works more often than it doesn't but can still cut out. The longer she rides during the trip, the more frequent the motor cutting in/out she says. She has also experienced what felt like riding over a washboard as the front hub motor/wheel started to vibrate is the best way to describe it. It only happened once (very short duration) and we have probably tested this conversion kit about 7 rides now. Every day with a full charge on the battery. She hasn't had the battery below 50%. Sounds very quiet to me and I generally can't tell if the motor is operating when I ride beside her. Short of pulling everything inside her battery case (all the components) which is where I am almost at and beginning over, I have 2 questions. 1) Do you think that replacing the handle bar connector will fix the problems as Swytch has concluded? 2) Should we cut our losses, keep the front hub wheel and order replacement parts? She has a rear rack on her bike that is empty. Recommendation for similar lightweight low range kits appreciated too. Wouldn't mind BT for the BMS for example. I don't really care about the money (we still have 1 year warranty) but waiting for a company that took 7 months to ship the kit and have it only work for 18 miles has me thinking, enough of our time and lets make this work reliably and get back to doing what the purpose of this kit - to assist in riding a bike. Although I do enjoy the diagnostic and problem solving like the next guy, it is not as fulfilling if we are playing SWAP-A-MOLE for months and months until something eventually works. Why can't we verify it versus guess and ship one part at a time slowly over the next year. Feels like we are following some flow chart of solutions. I'll put some dialectic grease on it next and probably do a stress test of the lateral/vertical movements of the connector assemble while in walk mode on my bike stand. I guess I could also put some cardboard shims to tightened the seating should lateral movement be causing the motor to stop/start. The big question is why doesn't it start again if it stop so readily based on the connector movement premise unless it's a wire component in the harness? Really an odd system. If anyone has some swytch work around ideas, I am eager to learn. Thanks for any advice Jim

Joined a Swytch facebook page today and one of the posts there said that the Swytch provided throttle has FT-21X stamped on theirs. A search on google, ebay can find many that appear to be match. Example: EBike Electric Bicycle Thumb Throttle, FT-21X Finger Throttle Accelerator, S NU3 - $10.49 USD + $1.59USD S/H on ebay.ca for example.

Thanks. It looks like we should be able to figure this out. The name brand throttles appear to be well documented. I found this: https://electricbike.com/forum/filedata/fetch?id=77041&d=1540926770 showing some pin-outs. So we should be able to back probe the connector from the switch to figure out which one has voltage and which one is ground. I am leaning toward cutting the throttle cable in half when/if it doesn't work, swapping pin 6 and 7 and then use that self fusing waterproof tape to put it back together. My wife is dealing with swytch directly but I would rather figure this out what they are doing and what products they are using so that we can keep this thing rolling in the future. Another reference: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/thumb-throttle.27436/page-2#post-191173