andysmee

We will most certainly use every option available to us and that means extracting every last possible drop of oil be it from the Tar Sands or opening up the ANWR. Economic growth is the religion! The human species is a blight on this planet, our greed will ensure we never reach an equilibrium with it.

The big question is what is ultimately sustainable for 6 billion people on this planet? What way of life doesn't take from the land more than what you are putting in and is that achievable?

I'm quite pessimistic about this and I believe the internal combustion engine is going to be the last mass market vehicle we will see. There were 590 million cars on the road globally in 2002; I don't see how we will have the money, energy and raw materials to replace these with electric or hydrogen cars let alone dispose of them. I'm with Mike that we are already at peak oil and are currently on a plateau, we may see a few more 'peaks' in the next decade but the underlying trend will be down. We will have to face the fact that we will have to live with less energy and that means less driving, flying, products from China and so forth. To finally add salt to the wounds, we have an economic system that is based on cheap energy inputs and taking on debt. Debt is usually required to be repaid with interest which again means each year we have to make and earn more to repay what we borrowed the year before. We are faced with a breakdown of the entire economic system. Personally I don't see an orderly transition to a lower energy lifestyle, there is too much imbalance in the haves and have nots. I see resource wars and the key players are already squaring up. I think I need to get out more ;-)

My father rode a camel; I drive a car; My son rides in a jet; His son will ride a camel. The returns on extracting oil from tar sands is approximately 3 barrels of oil for every 2 consumed. This is an EROEI of about 1.5. There are also extreme environmental costs in water pollution and land destruction. And that is only taking current production into account, where the easiest resources are the first mined. This suggests that the Alberta tar sands can fuel the world for less than 5 years, even if you are prepared to pay the vast environmental costs.

I have narrowed down my choice of bike to two (or maybe three). I need a bike for a short commute to the station in Reading (5.6miles by road but should be shorter with use of back streets and bus lanes etc... I have narrowed down my choice to the following: Urbanmover UM-24 folding bike £699 Urbanmover UM-36 £745 eZee Torq £1,195 This is tough because, by all accounts, the Torq is the best bike but the price is high. I am tempted by the folding option on the UM-24 as I may take a taxi home occasionally if the weather forces me (!) So I suppose the real choice is between the Torq and the UM-36. Is the Torq really worth £450 more in your opinion? Thanks in advance for your help... P.S. Hi, my name's Andy, nice forum, look forward to chatting some more...