I used a Homeplug (LAN over electric sockets) for running my computer upstairs with router downstairs.

 

Worked a treat and never had any problems with it.

I used a Homeplug (LAN over electric sockets) for running my computer upstairs with router downstairs.

 

Worked a treat and never had any problems with it.

... And these work very well provided you only use 2 or 3 of them. A Master and 2 or 3 slaves. Once the number rises above 4 , depending on the brand and the software revision they can or might exhibit problems. Some can handle 4 and some 16 nodes

Just caught the tail end of this conversation. In my experience there's no doubt that currently, the likes of cat6 cabling is better than wifi, in terms of being able to carry 4k etc etc. However, so is a Linn sondek turntable connected via a flagship amp to B&W speakers, in terms of sound. The compromise with all of this is of course a lot more cables and complexity etc etc.

 

I've completely changed the set up of my home systems, de-cluttering hardware, getting rid of all the cables and selling dvd's and cd's etc. I'm now 50 yrs old, eye's not as good nor hearing so the real detail in picture quality / sound is not something I notice as much.

 

I have the 200mb Virgin broadband. Bearing in mind I have 5 people in house of which three are teenagers and always on internet. This allows me to have one master point on wall with wifi router connected to all devices and without issues. Most people seem to think you can have 20 wifi items connects to a 2mb wifi, really!.

 

Whether we like it or not, even cat6e cabling will become a thing of the past in years to come as the direction is towards simple / easy wireless systems. I use the word easy wireless with caution!.

 

My system involves TV, Projector, Sonos speakers through house, NAS drive (storing all movies, music etc), NEST and LIFX lights. All can be managed from any point in the house using iphone. I don't need an wifi extender, but there are plenty of good ones out there.

 

In summary, and IMHO wireless is easy to install and move, gets rid of all those cables and allows ease of use / flexibility.

 

Each to their own.

http://www.4gon.co.uk/ubiquiti-unifi-ap-ac-hd-indoor-outdoor-access-point-p-6949.html

1733Mbps at 5GHz

Just caught the tail end of this conversation. In my experience there's no doubt that currently, the likes of cat6 cabling is better than wifi, in terms of being able to carry 4k etc etc. However, so is a Linn sondek turntable connected via a flagship amp to B&W speakers, in terms of sound. The compromise with all of this is of course a lot more cables and complexity etc etc.

 

I've completely changed the set up of my home systems, de-cluttering hardware, getting rid of all the cables and selling dvd's and cd's etc. I'm now 50 yrs old, eye's not as good nor hearing so the real detail in picture quality / sound is not something I notice as much.

 

I have the 200mb Virgin broadband. Bearing in mind I have 5 people in house of which three are teenagers and always on internet. This allows me to have one master point on wall with wifi router connected to all devices and without issues. Most people seem to think you can have 20 wifi items connects to a 2mb wifi, really!.

 

Whether we like it or not, even cat6e cabling will become a thing of the past in years to come as the direction is towards simple / easy wireless systems. I use the word easy wireless with caution!.

 

My system involves TV, Projector, Sonos speakers through house, NAS drive (storing all movies, music etc), NEST and LIFX lights. All can be managed from any point in the house using iphone. I don't need an wifi extender, but there are plenty of good ones out there.

 

In summary, and IMHO wireless is easy to install and move, gets rid of all those cables and allows ease of use / flexibility.

 

Each to their own.

... I'll agree with the each to his own. After that we must part company.

 

1. The revival of vinyl records has constantly puzzled me. Why anyone would want to return it a world of rumble, tracking errors , hum, wow and flutter , limited dynamic range, limited stereo separation, limited duration defeats me. The argument touted that there is a wider frequency response than CD is potentially correct but practically irrelevant and CDs could have any frequency range desired. You can record video on CD if desired. There was a TV programme in the 1980 s about computer gaming i think called " bad influence" and there was a technical section in it each week. The compere. Referred to his audience as "techifurtlers" and that is the image I bring to mind when i read of the thousands of pounds spent on trying to get a disc rotating at a fixed speed and get a tiny diamond stylus to vibrate.

2. The geometry of a specific house will dictate whether WiFi is suitable. The practice of using aluminium backed polyurethane foam insulation in walls can play havoc as can thick concrete or rubble walls. In my earlier post I indicated difficulties in these areas and how the different plug in internet adaptors, sometimes got confused. I found in my case that cat6 cabling gave and continues to give the most reliable performance.

In a future there is a proposal to use modulation on the output of led lamps, including those in the ceiling rose to transmit data at high data rates. So we might converge in a future where the data transmission is wireless and optical

Edited March 23, 20179 yr by Danidl

Edited March 23, 20179 yr by soundwave

1. The revival of vinyl records has constantly puzzled me. Why anyone would want to return it a world of rumble, tracking errors , hum, wow and flutter , limited dynamic range, limited stereo separation, limited duration defeats me. The argument touted that there is a wider frequency response than CD is potentially correct but practically irrelevant and CDs could have any frequency range desired. You can record video on CD if desired. There was a TV programme in the 1980 s about computer gaming i think called " bad influence" and there was a technical section in it each week. The compere. Referred to his audience as "techifurtlers" and that is the image I bring to mind when i read of the thousands of pounds spent on trying to get a disc rotating at a fixed speed and get a tiny diamond stylus to vibrate.

 

I can't answer for those who listen to pop music, but I can for my classical listening. No matter how expensive the equipment, what I hear from CDs bears little resemblance to what I hear live in concert halls of all sizes from orchestral, ensemble and solo performances. Vinyl reproduction is very much closer and importantly presents a spatial sound stage that no CD has ever got near to in my experience.

 

Much of this aural superiority of vinyl is due to the intrinsic errors of extracting the information from the groove, the sum of the errors approximating all the acoustical errors of listening venues.. But that doesn't matter, hearing music isnt a technical data reading experience, it's an emotional one.

 

I found in my case that cat6 cabling gave and continues to give the most reliable performance.

 

The same for me.

.

decent 3 way monitors/speakers cost mega bucks and then you need expensive ad da converters for the best result if there active monitors.

 

you also want a super flat frequency response from the monitors and only very hi end ported monitors can do this.

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ATC-SCM-40-Passive-in-an-expensive-satin-piano-finish-/272576230017?hash=item3f76cf3281:g:dd0AAOSwjDZYkgtT

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bryston-4B-SST2-Stereo-power-amplifier-2-x-300-Watt-RMS-17-Black-Used-/371796936572?hash=item5690d3077c:g:sisAAOSwux5YNcNx

Edited March 23, 20179 yr by soundwave

decent 3 way monitors/speakers cost mega bucks and then you need expensive ad da converters for the best result if there active monitors.

 

Done it all, using BC1 monitors which I prefer for my listening, but have also tried very expensive active monitors.

 

Even gone as far as a Meridian digital processor to remove all the flags and extraneous data from the CD before D to A conversion to ensure the converter had the cleanest possible conditions.

 

The end result from CDs never approaches the reality of live music, in general it's an accentuated reality which is very false. It can be exciting, even exhilarating, but that can be very undesirable in classical music where it can destroy the mood intentions of the composer.

 

The blame isn't entirely that of the CD medium, as often as not it's the very precision of CD reproduction that exposes the spatial errors of the multi-track recording process.

.

i run audio at 96 or 192khz when i was recording music so then if you squash that down to cd 44.1 then you loose alot.

 

tho it will never be the same as live music even at that high rate of 192khz as most top end monitors dont have that frq range like the brown note for example

 

the spec for my monitors are here.

https://www.genelec.com/sites/default/files/media/Previous%20models/3-way%20loudspeakers/1038A/ds1038a.pdf

... I'll agree with the each to his own. After that we must part company.

 

1. The revival of vinyl records has constantly puzzled me. Why anyone would want to return it a world of rumble, tracking errors , hum, wow and flutter , limited dynamic range, limited stereo separation, limited duration defeats me. The argument touted that there is a wider frequency response than CD is potentially correct but practically irrelevant and CDs could have any frequency range desired. You can record video on CD if desired. There was a TV programme in the 1980 s about computer gaming i think called " bad influence" and there was a technical section in it each week. The compere. Referred to his audience as "techifurtlers" and that is the image I bring to mind when i read of the thousands of pounds spent on trying to get a disc rotating at a fixed speed and get a tiny diamond stylus to vibrate.

2. The geometry of a specific house will dictate whether WiFi is suitable. The practice of using aluminium backed polyurethane foam insulation in walls can play havoc as can thick concrete or rubble walls. In my earlier post I indicated difficulties in these areas and how the different plug in internet adaptors, sometimes got confused. I found in my case that cat6 cabling gave and continues to give the most reliable performance.

In a future there is a proposal to use modulation on the output of led lamps, including those in the ceiling rose to transmit data at high data rates. So we might converge in a future where the data transmission is wireless and optical

The best quality music i ever heard played was on vinyl, full of life!!!!!. CD and digital is very clinical. Ask any true audiophile over say 40yrs of age and he / she will agree.

 

To qualify this and without being snobby, you have to have decent kit in the first place, an ALBA deck isn't going to do it.

 

I'm speaking as someone who now has spotify and sonos, but as i said i did this fore ease of use and my teenage girls nagging me. I did keep my linn, but the connection to sonos is pathetic.

 

I talk about wifi etc as it's well documented that wireless technology is a big investment for manufacturers and telecoms companies alike. Personally i'll be glad to see the back of cables.

 

I was talking to a guy in the states who is promoting speakers that can fit anywhere in your wall and you plaster over them. These are not speakers in the traditional sense, but he informs me the quality is up their with B&W, again wireless technology.

 

Finally, the wireless tech will take over, as we all know the more physical connections we have the more we degrade the signal i.e. whether speaker cable direct to speaker or degraded by speaker plugs attached to cable and then to speaker etc etc

I can't answer for those who listen to pop music, but I can for my classical listening. No matter how expensive the equipment, what I hear from CDs bears little resemblance to what I hear live in concert halls of all sizes from orchestral, ensemble and solo performances. Vinyl reproduction is very much closer and importantly presents a spatial sound stage that no CD has ever got near to in my experience.

 

Much of this aural superiority of vinyl is due to the intrinsic errors of extracting the information from the groove, the sum of the errors approximating all the acoustical errors of listening venues.. But that doesn't matter, hearing music isnt a technical data reading experience, it's an emotional one.

 

 

 

The same for me.

.

Beautifully put and totally agree!

[ATTACH=full]18331[/ATTACH]

 

Where's the doorbell?

.

they dont make one that is loud enough lol those monitors are from town house studio

Edited March 23, 20179 yr by soundwave

Done it all, using BC1 monitors which I prefer for my listening, but have also tried very expensive active monitors.

 

Even gone as far as a Meridian digital processor to remove all the flags and extraneous data from the CD before D to A conversion to ensure the converter had the cleanest possible conditions.

 

The end result from CDs never approaches the reality of live music, in general it's an accentuated reality which is very false. It can be exciting, even exhilarating, but that can be very undesirable in classical music where it can destroy the mood intentions of the composer.

 

The blame isn't entirely that of the CD medium, as often as not it's the very precision of CD reproduction that exposes the spatial errors of the multi-track recording process.

.

... Wow I knew that I was opening a can of worms. How logical is it to argue that imperfections in a storage and transmission medium yields a superior result than when the majority of these imperfections are removed?. If the words hi fidelity are to mean anything , then fidelity to the original performance is paramount. Peter Walker of QUAD made a statement a long time ago that an amplifier should be a piece of wire with gain. Nothing added nothing lost.

 

I am somewhat reminded of the letter of Paul , of .." looking through a glass darkly" , and suspect that prior conditioning and expectations are what drives that exclusive concept of musicality. .. if I hear a slight hum from a speaker , I am conditioned to think .". wow this is powerful. " I am not decrying your emotional response to the music or to the ritual of removing the record from its sleeve etc, that's your choice.

they dont make one that is loud enough lol

 

I'd guessed that!

.

i just need a force field generator to stop my hut falling to bits also the lcd tv and monitors cant hack it above 120db its like voltage going over the screen.

 

flat out they suck the air out ur lungs like siting in a bass bin pmsl

The best quality music i ever heard played was on vinyl, full of life!!!!!. CD and digital is very clinical. Ask any true audiophile over say 40yrs of age and he / she will agree.

 

To qualify this and without being snobby, you have to have decent kit in the first place, an ALBA deck isn't going to do it.

 

I'm speaking as someone who now has spotify and sonos, but as i said i did this fore ease of use and my teenage girls nagging me. I did keep my linn, but the connection to sonos is pathetic.

 

I talk about wifi etc as it's well documented that wireless technology is a big investment for manufacturers and telecoms companies alike. Personally i'll be glad to see the back of cables.

 

I was talking to a guy in the states who is promoting speakers that can fit anywhere in your wall and you plaster over them. These are not speakers in the traditional sense, but he informs me the quality is up their with B&W, again wireless technology.

 

Finally, the wireless tech will take over, as we all know the more physical connections we have the more we degrade the signal i.e. whether speaker cable direct to speaker or degraded by speaker plugs attached to cable and then to speaker etc etc

... Every communication system has limitations, in analogue ones it is the noise floor, frequency and phase responses , interference from and into cables etc. In digital ones it is jitter, quantisation error and bit rate limitations. Provided interference is below a specific level, the digital systems are strongly immune to interference. This is true whether by wireless or wired transmission or optical.

Wireless and WiFi is wonderful where and when it works. Case in point I recently purchased in two separate transactions , and at low cost remainered wireless speakers . A Samsung M3 and a Panasonic All3. Both with WiFi , both similar to models in the Sonos range. The Samsung responds always to the app whereas it is very much a hit and miss with the Panasonic. Unfortunately because it is slightly nicer to listen to. Both in virtually the same location. With a cable the Panasonic works ...

or to the ritual of removing the record from its sleeve etc, that's your choice.

 

That's no part of it for me, I hate that part and the potential for snap, crackle and pop. It would be wonderful if CD only removed most of the imperfections, but unfortunately its very precision portrays the many failings of our recording methods.

 

As Soundwave commented above, even a high rate like 192kHz won't reproduce the live experience, but the sum of errors of analogue can get closer when all conditions are suitable. That's not easy to achieve though, as with any such overwhelmingly complex situation, experience can count more than science.

.

vinyl to most sounds warmer than digital and less harsh why when i recorded music i used valve comps to record through from a drum machine so say.

 

tho on the other hand with a live drium kit id also use valve comps as well just then you need the super hi end mics to record it and pre amps ect very expensive and the room needs to be proper set up as well acoustic wise.

 

if 1 thing in the recording chain is wrong ie a cable gets to close to a psu then all is lost, i had 1 ensoniq fx unit that drove me crackers as the interference from it was so high i had to either put it in a metal box or out side the room and it drove me crackers trying to find what was doing it.

 

 

laser turn table

http://elpj.com/

 

diy vinyl lath

http://www.proaudioeurope.com/used-vintage/mastering/neumann-vms70-cutting-lathe.html

That's no part of it for me, I hate that part and the potential for snap, crackle and pop. It would be wonderful if CD only removed most of the imperfections, but unfortunately its very precision portrays the many failings of our recording methods.

 

As Soundwave commented above, even a high rate like 192kHz won't reproduce the live experience, but the sum of errors of analogue can get closer when all conditions are suitable. That's not easy to achieve though, as with any such overwhelmingly complex situation, experience can count more than science.

.

... In some of my recent reading another culprit has been identified. .. the mixing desk engineer. The arguement is was that one of the limitations of vinyl is that low frequency high volume sounds have to be attenuated, as the excursions of the stylus will be excessive. The RIAA curve notwithstanding. With CD s the engineer was not constrained as all levels of loudness are just numbers and gave vent to their pent up desires and flood the record with enhanced loudness. If one has grown accustomed to a particular tonal range the other becomes hyper..

when you cut a record you have a space limit as it has to be cut all in one line so if a track has a lot of low end bass in it the sapphire will cut wider grooves in the dub plate.

 

so to make it fit you have to compromise and get the grooves smaller and closer together to get it to all fit on one side and can be a right pita if you dont know what you are doing.

 

it looks easy but its not and if you fook that cutting head its 6-8k to fix one.

vinyl to most sounds warmer than digital and less harsh why when i recorded music i used valve comps to record through from a drum machine so say.

 

tho on the other hand with a live drium kit id also use valve comps as well just then you need the super hi end mics to record it and pre amps ect very expensive and the room needs to be proper set up as well acoustic wise.

 

if 1 thing in the recording chain is wrong ie a cable gets to close to a psu then all is lost, i had 1 ensoniq fx unit that drove me crackers as the interference from it was so high i had to either put it in a metal box or out side the room and it drove me crackers trying to find what was doing it.

 

 

laser turn table

http://elpj.com/

 

diy vinyl lath

http://www.proaudioeurope.com/used-vintage/mastering/neumann-vms70-cutting-lathe.html

.. why should valves sound warmer ,? is it because you like their distortion?. Any amplifier should have no distortion.

As a recording engineer/ artist you have every right to use any instrument , technology to create the sound you want.That would include any distorting devices etc But once mastered, the creative part is done and any playback device should replicate exactly the sound field you created

thats why in most studios you will see yamaha ns10 speakers there sole purpose is to check the mix on that the most will hear it as on there play back device.

 

thats why from any studio monitor you want a flat response as possible from them as not to colour the sound.

 

its like mixing on head phones then the next day play it back on speakers and think wtf went wrong there as now the bass is blowing the windows open.