Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
Yes he did, as Nev conforms in this link.
Vallance concurred with the politicians on Herd Immunity for a while when that was expedient, but changed his mind later in the face of evidence.
They all bend with the wind.
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No he didn't. He said it was a consequence... Not a goal. And like I said before it's got nothing to do with vaccine roll out.
Besides, last week you were agreeing with sound wave and saying all deaths are exaggerated and infection is nothing to worry about. Make your mind up flecc.
Simple fact is government and all concerned have done a great job with vaccine, you fail to accept that. No idea why.
Talk about non sequiters, you really are a champion. What Valance said on herd immunity has no relationship to the data mechanisms of Covid death exaggeration. Or vaccine rollout.
The government has achieved a remarkably rapid and utterly chaotic rollout of vaccines.
Only time will tell whether that was wise or foolish in comparison to what others do.
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This comment had to be made the following evening of the radio 4 programme because so many were taking what he said totally out of context.
Herd Immunity isn't, wasn't and never was a goal during initial stages of pandemic. With the vaccine it might become so..
PV explained the situation in the first briefing post radio programme. He did so clearly and without ambiguity. You must have missed that briefing.
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It has not been chaotic in the slightest. It's been well organised and effective, especially so in comparison to the EU, whose vaccine roll out has been utterly shambolic.
But you are right, what PV said months ago has nothing to do at all with vaccine rollout, so why did you bring it up.
It's hardly surprising if the most common racism is imaginary.
Although it's much less common now, almost every black person will have experienced the odd rare example of racism. The trouble is that it really deeply hurts and scars when it's an attack on something they can do nothing about, their colour and possibly other innate characteristics.
It follows that whenever they experience opposition or confrontation, that deep hurt surfaces, bringing the suspicion that it is racism again rearing its ugly head.
How deep and lasting that hurt is I know from personal experience in my early years.
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Yes it has been chaotic, three different vaccines being shuffled randomly around in quantities to where they are often not needed, people in much lower age groups being vaccinated long before the high priority groups had even reached 50% or even 15% in one huge area. And don't once again give the codswallop about using odd leftovers, I'm speaking of large scale programming of younger groups for vaccination in the North, even before it was permitted and even with second doses when the target for first doses elsewhere fell so woefully short.
And we are not discussing the EU.
Because you commented on it !!!!!!!!!
Last paragraph, here's the link.
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Your link actually shows you commented first. 
ie saying folk mentioned are subject to political influence???
So such as you and whoever are somehow in a better position than CW, JVT, PV etc to give independent assessment. Absolute rubbish but your link proves you brought them into it.
There are two people I, ve heard with any criticisms of UK roll out. You being one of those.
I suspect you want to put vaccine efforts down because they have shown your beloved EU up, whose efforts you plainly don't want to discuss because if ours are chaotic what are theirs.
Criticising our efforts when we have vaccinated 17 million folk is crazy. We should be grateful and thankful we aren't in Brazil or Belgium.
Sour grapes I think flecc. Showing the EU up?
ie saying folk mentioned are subject to political influence???So such as you and whoever are somehow in a better position than CW, JVT, PV etc to give independent assessment. Absolute rubbish but your link proves you brought them into it.
There are two people I, ve heard with any criticisms of UK roll out. You being one of those.
I suspect you want to put vaccine efforts down because they have shown your beloved EU up, whose efforts you plainly don't want to discuss because if ours are chaotic what are theirs.
Criticising our efforts when we have vaccinated 17 million folk is crazy. We should be grateful and thankful we aren't in Brazil or Belgium.
Sour grapes I think flecc. Showing the EU up?
The EUs rollout is not in anyway shambolic. We started a full month behind the UK for two reasons ..more like 3.
1. The EU decided not to short circuit the protocols
2. The idea of having stockpiles and the entire Community , not just the rich countries having supplies.
3. The death rates in November December were a fraction of the UKs.
What was a shambles was when the EU went to collect the AZ vaccines, in Belgium, they discovered the cupboard was bare. What was a disappointment was that when they examined the AZ data ,they discovered a paucity of data for the over 65 s. ,So they made a hurried decision ,in January, to prioritize the mRNA types for the older cohort, and restrict the AZ ,to younger groups until the data built up.
Zlatan, as I read that comment, the STRATEGY is herd immunity. The TACTIC was to prevent the number dieing unnecessarily because the NHS was overwhelmed. The death rate from Cov19 remains stubbornly at 3% when the Health services are within capacity, but rises to perhaps 10% when it crashes. At the time, there was no viable vaccine on the horizon, so the two options available were Herd Immunity or virus elimination by quarantine. Such refinements as chronic heart problems , or Pulmonary COP, or Long Covid were not on the agenda.
Yes of course Danidl, this chap knows nothing, he, s under political influence and obviously wrong.
So did I if I hadn't used all the ones I took on site for testing the pan, they went down very well with my sandwiches
Careful now. I actually listened to UVDL address to the EU Parliament and it was a lot more nuanced than your headlines would suggest. Moreover the selection of Quotes you have taken from a German MEP , nearly 3 weeks ago , reflected his annoyance with delays in Germany..
On the contrary, I suspect that at the time he was petrified that a potential mutation of the virus would produce more virulence and fatalities. .. And if he wasn't, he was in a minority of medical personnel. At that time, the UK was following a fatally flawed strategy of Herd Immunity.. and as I previously posted, I know exactly the time and place I was when I heard it..and my immediate reaction of bonkers . Nobody knew about Long Covid then..and for very good reason.
He was trying to "flatten the curve". ,And was selling that idea
Actually having looked over his CV,it is very possible that he was not sufficiently familiar with virology to be sufficiently worried about mutations.
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We had Patrick Valance around 10th March making statement linked earlier, then Hancock on 14th saying above.
The rumour govt were seeking herd immunity all stemmed from the mis quoting of PV on R4..
All folk involved at every briefing made the point quite clearly. Herd Immunity was never a goal, regardless what all the media quoted.
Yes, I accept mistakes were made that gave impression herd Immunity was a policy (Eg Cheltenham going ahead amongst others) but it is simply not true herd Immunity was ever a goal or policy.
I, ll bet in the investigation in a few years time this will be one of specific points examined. We, ll have to wait and see what that throws up.
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