Brexit, for once some facts.

[Woosh]

morning to you too.
My point is, I did not vote for brexit at the referendum but this thread made me re-examine my view on the EU.The more I dig into the brexit argument, the more I am certain that the the pooling of sovereignty for economic advantages benefits essentially multi-nationals.

 

[oldgroaner]

There's nthing like making a good impression right away
This from the Independent
"
Brexit: Theresa May's Article 50 launch trashed after top EU politicians reject key demands
The Prime Minister's hopes of quick talks on a trade deal and a focus on security were dismissed on the continent
Theresa May’s Brexit launch suffered a series of heavy blows after key planks of her opening strategy were point-blank rejected by Europe’s top politicians.

German chancellor Angela Merkel publically dismissed her plan to begin talks on a lucrative trade deal, saying negotiations on Britain’s EU divorce – including a bill potentially hitting €60bn – must come first.

European Parliament negotiator Guy Verhofstadt then brushed off what was described by others as Ms May’s “blatant threat” to withdraw British terror and crime-fighting co-operation, in order to extract a good trade deal.

 

[oldgroaner]

morning to you too.
My point is, I did not vote for brexit at the referendum but this thread made me re-examine my view on the EU.The more I dig into the brexit argument, the more I am certain that the the pooling of sovereignty for economic advantages benefits essentially multi-nationals.

Indeed it does, but that is only one consideration, effectively Europe is now no longer an area where we can exert any influence, only respond to please it.
And if we want to export there, still obey all their rules and regulations we can no longer oppose, propose or change, so how on earth are we better off being at their beck and call?

 

[Woosh]

some people believe that Mrs Merkel does tit for tat.

 

[Woosh]

And if we want to export there, still obey all their rules and regulations we can no longer oppose, propose or change, so how on earth are we better off being at their beck and call?

sure, our influence will diminish but it already has ever since the EU adopted qualify majority voting thus removing the only defense that members had when a decision hurt their national interest.

 

[oldgroaner]

sure, our influence will diminish but it already has ever since the EU adopted qualify majority voting thus removing the only defense that members had when a decision hurt their national interest.

Which would not have worried us had we involved ourselves in the debating process, why should we have feared that? Now when changes are made that affect us, and they will, we just have to accept them.
How can that be seen as an advantage?

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

 

[oldtom]

Here is the translated version of the Theresa May speech on triggering 'Brexit':



Tom

 

[Croxden]

Here is the translated version of the Theresa May speech on triggering 'Brexit':

View attachment 18424

Tom

Did Brian May really sign this?

 

[Woosh]

Which would not have worried us had we involved ourselves in the debating process, why should we have feared that? Now when changes are made that affect us, and they will, we just have to accept them.
How can that be seen as an advantage?

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

I thought about that and came to the conclusion that the UK is too different from the new accession countries. Even if the EU remained Europe of the 9, we could not have proceeded toward a federal state.
I think we do the right thing. A little pain now will save us a lot more pain later if we hadn't.

 

[oldtom]

Did Brian May really sight this?

Brian May was an important part of Queen - Theresa May thinks she is more important than the Queen.

Tom

 

[oldtom]

The 'Sun', one of the major tory propaganda organs, is in celebratory mood over May's latest negotiating tactic:



Tom

 

[oldtom]

Thomas Jefferson said it; Adolf Hitler understood its value to his cause and utilised it spectacularly well. Now, in the 21st century, the tory party has mastered the art too:



Tom

 

[oldtom]

The manifestation of evil in 2017:



Tom

 

[oldtom]

I just love Frankie Boyle's take on fascist politics:



Tom

 

[oldgroaner]

I thought about that and came to the conclusion that the UK is too different from the new accession countries. Even if the EU remained Europe of the 9, we could not have proceeded toward a federal state.
I think we do the right thing. A little pain now will save us a lot more pain later if we hadn't.

Have you forgotten that we opted of further integration?
Worse still our government pushed for them to join?


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[Woosh]

Worse still our government pushed for them to join?

If they could have seen where we are now, I am sure they would have not pushed them to join.

 

[flecc]

If they could have seen where we are now, I am sure they would have not pushed them to join.

It was John Major who pushed hard for the inclusion of the Eastern Bloc countries. And he obviously hasn't changed his mind now, since he considers Brexit to be a very big mistake.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

Thomas Jefferson said it; Adolf Hitler understood its value to his cause and utilised it spectacularly well. Now, in the 21st century, the tory party has mastered the art too:

View attachment 18426

Tom

And nearer to Home
"I read the newspapers avidly. It is my one form of continuous fiction."
Aneurin Bevan

 

[oldgroaner]

The 'Sun', one of the major tory propaganda organs, is in celebratory mood over May's latest negotiating tactic:

View attachment 18425

Tom

A much better ploy would have been to offer to stop creating more refugees by putting an end to our wars of Agression in the Middle East and Grounding our fleet of Asassin Drones.
What can you expect rom the Sun? as they pointed out once on the "Monty Python Show"

The Times is for the People who actually run the country.
The Telegraph is for the people who think they should be running the country.
The Daily Mail thinks that a Dictator should run the Country.
The Daily Mirror thinks the Working Class should run the Country
The Sun doesn't care who runs the country so long as she has big breasts

 

[Woosh]

It was John Major who pushed hard for the inclusion of the Eastern Bloc countries. And he obviously hasn't changed his mind now, since he considers Brexit to be a very big mistake.
.

if you are an employer, chances are that you would welcome enlargement of the EU. I know someone who works in the NHS. Apparently the majority who work there voted to leave.