My frame has snapped

[Mussels]

And you thought broken spokes were inconvenient.

The seat tube has snapped between the seat clamp and the top tube weld, I took some pics but I need to find a way to transfer them to the PC.
Anyone from Wisper around today?

 

[Rad]

Not good mate. Hopefully Wisper will look into it for you. I'm sure they must guarantee their frames.

 

[frank9755]

Firstly, bad luck, and I hope you get it sorted out.

Fortunately it's not a problem I believe has been reported before on a Wisper so looks like a one-off. The curved crossbar of the Wisper does mean there is more seat tube above the weld than would otherwise be the case. Others with Wispers who ride with the seat high up (which included me when I had mine!) might consider fitting a longer seat-tube, to prevent undue stress on that exposed tube section above the weld.

Frank

 

[eddieo]

I think David of Wisper is on a flight from Singapore? according to the presiegne thread last night....Bad luck by the way, do you think it can be repaired or do you need a new frame? The warranty on frames are normally longer then the 12 month warranty I believe?

 

[flecc]

The current warranty on Wisper frames is six years, and Wisper in any case have shown themselves very supportive on such issues.

As Frank remarked above, I've also never heard of a Wisper frame failure so it's more likely to be a one-off metal defect rather than any design or manufacturing problem.
.

 

[torrent99]

The current warranty on Wisper frames is six years, and Wisper in any case have shown themselves very supportive on such issues.

As Frank remarked above, I've also never heard of a Wisper frame failure so it's more likely to be a one-off metal defect rather than any design or manufacturing problem.
.

Mind you, Mussels has probably put in many more miles than most Wisper owners. Perhaps it's a late onset design issue? In any case I'm confident David will sort it (he's not having a good day is he? )

 

[Mussels]

Firstly, bad luck, and I hope you get it sorted out.

Fortunately it's not a problem I believe has been reported before on a Wisper so looks like a one-off. The curved crossbar of the Wisper does mean there is more seat tube above the weld than would otherwise be the case. Others with Wispers who ride with the seat high up (which included me when I had mine!) might consider fitting a longer seat-tube, to prevent undue stress on that exposed tube section above the weld.

Frank

If anyone is likely to find a fault it's me.
I don't think a longer seat post would help as below the clamp the seat post doesn't come into contact with the seat tube, might be wrong though.

I think David of Wisper is on a flight from Singapore? according to the presiegne thread last night....Bad luck by the way, do you think it can be repaired or do you need a new frame? The warranty on frames are normally longer then the 12 month warranty I believe?

It doesn't look repairable, some jubilee clips may keep me mobile but AFAIK these can't be welded. Shame really as it will be a lot of work transferring the components to another frame and even more work getting the bike to the retailer.
It hasn't snapped right off but it's like the metal has torn most of the way across, I'll ride home on the pedals and may be on the unpowered reserve bike tomorrow if I can't bodge it. I've been meaning to attempt that for a while but never got the nerve.

 

[Mussels]

Any spare carbon frames lying around?

 

[Rad]

Any spare carbon frames lying around?

Worth a try

 

[Barnowl]

Blimey bad luck Mussels. Talking to a chap in the LBS a few weeks ago. His nice new Marin frame had snapped.

Good luck getting back to normal.

 

[Mussels]

I have taken another look and found the cause. Where the seat post kept slipping down I did the clamp up a bit tighter, this has caused a hairline crack from the round hole just below the clamp. This crack spreads along a cm or so and then becomes a tear, there is another matching one on the other side of the hole that is still a hairline crack.
So if your seat post slips down the tube don't do the clamp up tighter to stop it, I don't usually remove the seat post so people who do regularly might want to have a look for the little cracks that would normally go unnoticed.

 

[rog_london]

I suppose a sensible precaution might be to use one of those road bike clamps. They sit on top of the tube and provide the grip without stressing the frame tube like the quick-release bolt does. I was thinking of getting one myself and doing away with the supplied clamp, as it's too easy for someone to pinch the saddle with no tools needed, and then you couldn't ride it home - not unless you like living dangerously.

As a repair for your existing problem if you got one of those you could saw off the top inch of the frame tube along with the existing clamp bolt eyes and then cut another slot at the back (on the battery side) so that your road-bike clamp would work.

Evans do a big selection of seat post clamps starting at £3.....

Rog.

 

[flecc]

As a repair for your existing problem if you got one of those you could saw off the top inch of the frame tube along with the existing clamp bolt eyes and then cut another slot at the back (on the battery side) so that your road-bike clamp would work.

Rog.

This might need a larger seat tube. I think Wisper like many use a stepped clamp section, smaller than the rest of the frame tube. Hopefully the frame tubing internal measure corresponds with a standard seat tube diameter.
.

 

[Mussels]

I suppose a sensible precaution might be to use one of those road bike clamps. They sit on top of the tube and provide the grip without stressing the frame tube like the quick-release bolt does. I was thinking of getting one myself and doing away with the supplied clamp, as it's too easy for someone to pinch the saddle with no tools needed, and then you couldn't ride it home - not unless you like living dangerously.

As a repair for your existing problem if you got one of those you could saw off the top inch of the frame tube along with the existing clamp bolt eyes and then cut another slot at the back (on the battery side) so that your road-bike clamp would work.

Evans do a big selection of seat post clamps starting at £3.....

Rog.

That may just work, I'll need a bigger seat post as well as it was only just long enough. Unfortunately the crack goes down at 45 degrees towards the back, but it might do as a temporary measure. I wonder if I can do that before I go home. Time for another look.
Edit: The seat post clamp may be just the thing to hold the crack together, I was a bit dubious about a jubilee clip doing the job.

 

[rog_london]

This might need a larger seat tube. I think Wisper like many use a stepped clamp section, smaller than the rest of the frame tube. Hopefully the frame tubing internal measure corresponds with a standard seat tube diameter.
.

Errr - no. I did check. The frame tube diameter is the same all the way down. If you cut off the top 5/8" approximately (just under the clamp eyes) you then have about 3/8" of round tube before you get to the weld where the top tube reinforcement meets the seat tube. There would be about 1/4" of the existing (front) clamp slot, but you would need to cut a new slot at the back, of reasonable depth to allow a new clamp to work. With the battery removed a bit of care with a junior hacksaw and a narrow file or two should do the job.

I'm assuming there is some urgency to this! Ideally a few words with the Wisper people beforehand would be adviseable - I suspect they'd be happy if you could fix it sensibly rather than needing a new frame.

Rog.

 

[Mussels]

Errr - no. I did check. The frame tube diameter is the same all the way down. If you cut off the top 5/8" approximately (just under the clamp eyes) you then have about 3/8" of round tube before you get to the weld where the top tube reinforcement meets the seat tube. There would be about 1/4" of the existing (front) clamp slot, but you would need to cut a new slot at the back, of reasonable depth to allow a new clamp to work. With the battery removed a bit of care with a junior hacksaw and a narrow file or two should do the job.

I'm assuming there is some urgency to this! Ideally a few words with the Wisper people beforehand would be adviseable - I suspect they'd be happy if you could fix it sensibly rather than needing a new frame.

Rog.

The post rattles around in the tube a bit, it's still the original post supplied as well. I'm going to take the bike over to the CycleSurgery workshop to see if they can do anything today.
Unfortunately with the way the tear goes I think it will be a weld or a new frame.

 

[torrent99]

The post rattles around in the tube a bit, it's still the original post supplied as well. I'm going to take the bike over to the CycleSurgery workshop to see if they can do anything today.
Unfortunately with the way the tear goes I think it will be a weld or a new frame.

Yea, saw the break on my way past this afternoon. That's naaasty! Maybe a super super long seat post set low down as a temporary measure?
It's a new frame for sure I'd say.

Or...(puts on steel helmet for inevitable rain of correction )... how about JB Weld-ing it (wonderful stuff that JB Weld!)?

 

[Mussels]

The CycleSurgery mechanic took one look, shook his head and said I was too heavy. I think it was his lack of English rather that wanting to be rude, the message was clear however that he couldn't help.
I don't think I can fit a seat clamp as when the battery is mounted it will get in the way.
For the moment I've left the seat at it's lowest setting and it seems OK, fortunately the suspension part sits on the seat tube and holds the saddle fairly high and it is just ridable. A nice advantage of an electric bike is that I don't lose much time even though I can't put as much effort in, that eases the urgency a little.
A long seat tube is attractive but if the clamp can't hold my weight then I worry that the tube pushing down onto the bottom bracket will cause more problems, with the suspension that wont happen. The JB weld is a good idea but will that prevent a proper weld?

 

[Mussels]

A couple of not great photos from my phone.

 

[rog_london]

A couple of not great photos from my phone.

Oh, crikey - I see what you mean. There's not a lot you can do with that short of a 'proper' weld.

I guess if you have been using the seat tube well up and you are on the heavy side, there must be a huge amount of leverage. Mine certainly doesn't rattle around in the tube, so I suppose that the whole upper part of the tube has distorted over time. Aluminium alloy does weaken due to fatigue much more readily than does steel, so you might need to think along the line of the whole frame having been weakened. Bad news indeed.

Rog.