New battery conditioning tips please

[kevinfox]

I've got a new battery to condition in an Ezee Quando and would like a few ideas on what to do.

• I could ride the bike until it goes off
• I could ride the bike until it's on red then turn on the lights and leave it stationary until they go off
• I could ride the bike until it's on red, then suspend the back wheel off the ground, wedge the throttle on slow and leave it until it dies
• Any other suggestions

If it was in a laptop I would turn off the power management, change to a blank desktop and leave it until the laptop turned off.
Thanks
Kevin
PS My new battery fitted to a Quando1 results in the green light staying on even up hill with no pedaling. Wonder if this means the battery meter is finally a useful tool...

 

[flecc]

The new batteries are much better at maintaining voltage Kevin, hence staying on the green under high load and virtually never showing red. After about 200 to 250 charges you'll find the amber comes on up hills under load and the red will show a bit easier, and after about 300 to 350 charges it will behave more like your old battery did originally.

There's no real need for a monitoring instrument, the battery meter is good enough, though still non-linear.

To condition it, ride it until the red shows, then fully charge the battery and repeat that once more. The rides do not need to be continuous, they can be done in stages until you get to when the red light shows much of the time.
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[kevinfox]

Thanks for the info - if it ever stops raining I'll give it a try!
Cheers
Kevin

 

[flecc]

Yes, it's car salesmen's weather here too, not so good for bike sales.
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[Conal]

new battery

Flecc

I have just bought a new silver eZee Li-ion Polymer battery (right description?) from CyclePoint and Rhys explained that the visible difference is that the amber light will come on earlier (at rest or when not pedalling) but stay on longer, as will the red light.

I have this to be correct and also found that WHEN ON FULL POWER ASSIST the amber light comes on when starting off, even on a fully charged battery, but quickly reverts to green when cycling on the flat. After a few miles of relatively flat terrain (at full assist) the amber light stays on when pedalling and the red light comes on for any hill and when setting off.

As you have often said, we should not take too much notice of the lights. What I found impressive is that my first charge was after 21 miles at full power assist! It seems that the new generation of batteries is better than the old ones - and it feels much lighter!

Conal

 

[flecc]

They certainly are very much better Conal, more range and noticeably more power for hill climbing due to the voltage holding up under load. My new generation one is not polymer so is the same weight as before, 4.3 kilos, but your polymer one is 3.3 kilos. The difference probably accounts for the way in which your meter behaves, my amber not showing at all even in hill climbing for well over 100 charges. However, there variations in the controller tolerances so that can make some difference between bikes, and even the bike model with different motor gearing affects the meter readout.
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[themutiny]

Flecc

I have just bought a new silver eZee Li-ion Polymer battery (right description?) from CyclePoint and Rhys explained that the visible difference is that the amber light will come on earlier (at rest or when not pedalling) but stay on longer, as will the red light.

I have this to be correct and also found that WHEN ON FULL POWER ASSIST the amber light comes on when starting off, even on a fully charged battery, but quickly reverts to green when cycling on the flat. After a few miles of relatively flat terrain (at full assist) the amber light stays on when pedalling and the red light comes on for any hill and when setting off.

As you have often said, we should not take too much notice of the lights. What I found impressive is that my first charge was after 21 miles at full power assist! It seems that the new generation of batteries is better than the old ones - and it feels much lighter!

Conal

That's exactly what I found with the new polymer batteries. Cyclepoint didn't point this out to me, and I wa rather concerned at first -see here

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/battery-faqs/3834-ezee-li-polymer-advice.html

It was all well in the end though. Funnily enough, although it is only a kilo or so lighter, it feels like it weighs about half what the Phylion does.

Since I use both in tandem for extended range, I still get a bit confused/concerned by the lights on occasion, when ascribing li-po characteristics to Li-ion and vice-versa. In this respect, I much prefer the cytronex. Just the one led to indicate on or off - easy!

 

[flecc]

Since I use both in tandem for extended range, I still get a bit confused/concerned by the lights. In this respect, I much prefer the cytronex. Just the one led to indicate on or off - easy!

I fully agree and have often said that I wish e-bike producers didn't give a handlebar battery meter since these cause so much confusion. Heinzmann never did, and the original Panasonic unit didn't, both relying only on the metering on the battery for checking at a standstill.

I've always used distance on a cycle computer to judge the battery content, supplemented by the way the bike is performing, since they all tend to lose performance as the battery empties.
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[Barnowl]

I fully agree and have often said that I wish e-bike producers didn't give a handlebar battery meter since these cause so much confusion. Heinzmann never did, and the original Panasonic unit didn't, both relying only on the metering on the battery for checking at a standstill.

I've always used distance on a cycle computer to judge the battery content, supplemented by the way the bike is performing, since they all tend to lose performance as the battery empties.
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I remember the many posts last winter when the temperatures dropped and how much concern that caused. Not having a battery meter or any LEDs was a blessing. Distance and feel works for me as well.

 

[kevinfox]

One further question, should I leave the charger on after the green light comes on to allow the battery to finish charging? I read that Lithium Polymer is only 70% charged when the maximum terminal voltage is reached, is this when the green light comes on?
Thanks for the info!
kevin

 

[flecc]

No, when the green light comes on the charge is stopped, so nothing can be gained. eZee recommend the charger is disconnected at that point.
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[kevinfox]

OK, thanks. I'm guessing that putting it on overnight and not disconnecting it until sometime the next day is OK?

 

[flecc]

Yes that's ok, the recommendation is not to just leave it plugged in all the time.
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[kevinfox]

Thanks again, that just leaves the front light to fix that's packed in after 2 weeks and 10 rides

 

[kevinfox]

Found the light fault, combination of misrouted connection and poor contact on the back of the light - total time taken 3 minutes with the assistance of Cyclepoint

 

[kevinfox]

I just noticed that the old Quando 1 charger has 36V on the side of it whereas the new Quando 2 charger has 42V. Does this mean a new charger is needed when replacing the old li-ion battery with the newer li-po type?

 

[flecc]

The older charger may have been marked 36 volts, but if it was a Li-ion charger it would have completed the charge at almost 42 volts. It seems they are showing the charger output now instead of the battery voltage it's intended for, just a labelling change.

However, check the old charger and make sure it says it's for Li-ion batteries, and if it says it's for NiMh, post back.

If it says it's for Li-ion, it's all you need for the new battery as well, since the new battery is also a Li-ion, but of polymer construction.
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[kevinfox]

OK, Thanks. Curiously enough I just stuck a DVM on the 2 of them. The no load output on the newer one was 41.7V and the older one was 41.6V.
Glad it's not more expense