Reality check me, please.

[Shane Kelly]

Hi,
Following on from my "Introduction" thread, I would welcome comments on my reasoning and choices below from anybody kind enough to take the time...

I am a 60 year old, 18.5 st (118.5Kg), 5' 10" male with a 27" inside leg measurement. I want to ride for leisure and gentle exercise.

Taking all these things into account, I have come up with a 'style' of bike that I think would suit, and would value comments from owners, non-owners, advocates or commercial members - it all adds to the knowledge mountain!

I like the 'sit up and beg' or Dutch style of riding position for comfort and all round visibility, and I have no problem with riding a "girls" bike (I think of the step-throughs as 'continental style' rather than female gender specific). Given that I would avoid main roads as much as possible (there are quite a few bike paths, parks and very quiet farm roads around here) but would be sticking mainly to paved surfaces with the odd excursion onto gravel, I am thinking tyres of 1.75 to 2.0 (puncture resistant, please!), a suspension seat post, (not too bothered about suspension front or rear ), 26-28" wheels, a comfortable touring saddle, minimum 7 gears ( hub for ease of maintenance, but derailleur are OK too), front hub drive (again for ease of maintenance) and a range of 15-25 miles.

Currently I like the following bikes:

Woosh Big Bear Step-thru
Woosh Sundowner
Kudos Eco
Kudos Liberty
Ezee Sprint LDS

Also, some others may be considered if details become clearer - like the Smarta LX, whose website seems to default to buying a battery for £350 on top of the bike at £1099???.

The main sticking points I think are my weight - most bikes seem to be topped out at 100-110kg, and I am wondering if any bike sellers use this an 'escape clause' for warranty purposes? - and my short legs actually reaching the pedals comfortably for a day in the saddle...

So, how's my thinking? My budget is not more than £1100 total, preferably less

Any comments welcome, and thanks in advance.

 

[trex]

Hello Shane,
you can rule out the Woosh Sundowner, too big frame. The Big Bear LS is highly suitable though.
the weight limit is a function of total bike + rider, maximum gradient and safe climbing speed (8mph). The Big Bear LS can manage about 10mph with 150kg load on 6% gradient (using the ebike simulator a ebike.ca).

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I think you can cut that list down to two bikes. With your weight, you need a high-torque motor, which means the Woosh Big Bear or one of the Ezee bikes. Check with Cyclezee whether the cheaper one can still give the high torque.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Shane,I asked some questions after your intro posting. I think you have answered most on this thread.
I can really only comment on my bikes out of your selection.
The Kudos Eco is too small a bike for you.
Going through your requirements I think the Kudos Liberty would suit.
It is a classic Dutch style bike and in fact is uone of the best selling bikes in Holland under a different name. It has 700c (28") wheels,Bafang front hub motor,Shimano Nexus 8 hub gears,LifePo4 long life battery (our replacement battery cost is about £200,but these LifePo4 batteries are very long life),panniers,comfy seat,strong frame,led lights integral from the battery,price £995.00 incl del and vat.,most think the Liberty an attractive bike.
Range about 30-35 miles,average rider input,average terrain.
Don't worry about your weight,I am 17 stone,the Liberty is a strong bike,not sure how we could enforce max weights as regards warranty,the Liberty is not a rock hopping style of bike.
I have good stocks of the Liberty at present.
Where are you located to suggest a dealer to try the bike.
Out of the others Ezee have a good reputation.
Hope that helps,good luck with your search.
KudosDave

 

[Shane Kelly]

Hello Shane,
you can rule out the Woosh Sundowner, too big frame. The Big Bear LS is highly suitable though.
the weight limit is a function of total bike + rider, maximum gradient and safe climbing speed (8mph). The Big Bear LS can manage about 10mph with 150kg load on 6% gradient (using the ebike simulator a ebike.ca).

Hi trexx,
thanks, informative post and narrows it down
Shane

 

[Shane Kelly]

I think you can cut that list down to two bikes. With your weight, you need a high-torque motor, which means the Woosh Big Bear or one of the Ezee bikes. Check with Cyclezee whether the cheaper one can still give the high torque.

Hi d8veh,
Thanks, narrows it down even further...
Cheers,
Shane

 

[amigafan2003]

Don't worry about your weight - you'll be very unlikely to make anything break as all the critical items will likely be over enginered anyway - like the forks, frames, wheels etc. What you might notice is things like wheel bearings need servicing more often, brake pads wear quickly (and the brakes might take longer and need a harder squeeze of the levers to stop you) and it might eat chains and cassettes (a heavy rider can put way more torque through a drive train than even a pro mtb'er).

 

[Shane Kelly]

Shane,I asked some questions after your intro posting. I think you have answered most on this thread.
I can really only comment on my bikes out of your selection.
The Kudos Eco is too small a bike for you.
Going through your requirements I think the Kudos Liberty would suit.
It is a classic Dutch style bike and in fact is uone of the best selling bikes in Holland under a different name. It has 700c (28") wheels,Bafang front hub motor,Shimano Nexus 8 hub gears,LifePo4 long life battery (our replacement battery cost is about £200,but these LifePo4 batteries are very long life),panniers,comfy seat,strong frame,led lights integral from the battery,price £995.00 incl del and vat.,most think the Liberty an attractive bike.
Range about 30-35 miles,average rider input,average terrain.
Don't worry about your weight,I am 17 stone,the Liberty is a strong bike,not sure how we could enforce max weights as regards warranty,the Liberty is not a rock hopping style of bike.
I have good stocks of the Liberty at present.
Where are you located to suggest a dealer to try the bike.
Out of the others Ezee have a good reputation.
Hope that helps,good luck with your search.
KudosDave

Hi KudosDave,
thanks for the info - I am in Irvine, about 25 miles south of Glasgow, and there doesn't seem to be any e-bike dealers around here (even the local Halfords looked at me funny when I mentioned e-bikes!), so a chance to ride one would be good, if it could be arranged with a dealer not to far from here?

 

[Shane Kelly]

Don't worry about your weight - you'll be very unlikely to make anything break as all the critical items will likely be over enginered anyway - like the forks, frames, wheels etc. What you might notice is things like wheel bearings need servicing more often, brake pads wear quickly (and the brakes might take longer and need a harder squeeze of the levers to stop you) and it might eat chains and cassettes (a heavy rider can put way more torque through a drive train than even a pro mtb'er).

hi Amigafan2003,
Thanks, I did think that might be the case, but it is nice to have it confirmed - especially before you buy

Cheers
Shane
PS - Never owned an Amiga, but I did join the local Amiga club and boy did I get some stick as PC owner

 

[Kudoscycles]

Hi KudosDave,
thanks for the info - I am in Irvine, about 25 miles south of Glasgow, and there doesn't seem to be any e-bike dealers around here (even the local Halfords looked at me funny when I mentioned e-bikes!), so a chance to ride one would be good, if it could be arranged with a dealer not to far from here?

Shane,regrettably I don't have a dealer near to you. What we have done when this problem has arisen in the past is to send your chosen bike up free of carriage charge. You can ride the bike for 7 days to be sure you like it,you must keep the bike in as new condition,if you decide you don't like the bike,then we charge £25.00 to collect.
I assume you have viewed the Liberty on the Kudos website.
KudosDave

 

[Shane Kelly]

Shane,regrettably I don't have a dealer near to you. What we have done when this problem has arisen in the past is to send your chosen bike up free of carriage charge. You can ride the bike for 7 days to be sure you like it,you must keep the bike in as new condition,if you decide you don't like the bike,then we charge £25.00 to collect.
I assume you have viewed the Liberty on the Kudos website.
KudosDave

Hi KudosDave,
Yes, I have checked it out on the web-site, and I included it because of the high spec package, but after the woosh big bear because woosh state that the big bear has the BPM motor, which I understand is better suited to hilly terrain with heavy loads (i.e. me!).
Does the Liberty have the BPM motor? Or is it the lower torque (earlier?) version?

Thanks again for your offer to send a bike for trial, but I am still at the 'data gathering' stage, so i won't be making a commitment just yet.
It has impressed me that you are willing to answer questions in this forum on a regular basis, and always with relevant information - sort of helps to alleviate the 'distance penalty' for mail order buyers in my opinion.

Regards,
Shane.

 

[Kudoscycles]

The Liberty does not have the BPM motor,it uses the SWX motor. Am a bit reluctant to put the BPM motor in the front wheel. If the BPM motor is installed in the rear it is obviously not possible to use the Nexus hub gear,note all our Kudos Performance bikes use the BPM motor in the rear plus derailleur gears.
Remind me why you wanted a step thru bike?
You are right that you are very early in the bike search,it's difficult for you to try bikes locally. There is a good dealer at Linlithgow who specialises in Batribike,I think their step thru also uses the SWX motor,the dealer is a good guy.
Your OP suggested exercise as a primary requirement of your purchase and Dutch style,however the BPM motor was developed to give max grunt up hills,ie less exercise.

Good luck.
Dave

 

[Shane Kelly]

Step-thru means getting on and off the bike is easier (for me), they generally promote the sit up and beg position which to me is more comfortable for touring, and a higher profile when on the main roads is arguably safer for the cyclist...

Thanks for the dealer info, I'll see what I can arrange.

While exercise is a consideration, (I did say gentle exercise in the OP ) the primary reason is for leisure riding, so I won't feel guilty if the motor does most of the work on hills when I can't or don't want to put in the effort. We have many bike paths and reasonable farm roads for leisure cycling around here and while not mountainous, the area has its fair share of hills, so more torque is welcome. The front wheel drive is preferred, so that I can have hub gears (again for ease of maintenance, convenience etc.). The info on the motor types is very helpful.

thanks again for your post(s), you are making me examine my conclusions critically, and that is always a good thing.

Regards,
Shane.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Shane.....buying an e-bike in the UK is not like buying a car....to get a reasonable choice it is necessary to travel. Whatever looks a good bike on paper may not feel right when you ride it.
The reason why there are so many different configurations of e-bike is that so many customers want different features out of their bike....KTM have at the last count 53 different e-bikes,Kudos has 17,Haibike and BH maybe 50 plus more and still we cannot always satisfy exactly what a customer wants at our London shop,we currently have 30-40 sample bikes at that shop.
It may help if other forum members can recommend dealers in the north who have good stocks of test bikes....I have visited dealers who have a massive portfolio of bikes on their website listing but when I visit they may only have 2 bikes to test or even view....can anyone recommend a dealer in the north of England or Scotland who has a good stock of test bikes,that would be very helpful to Shane.
KudosDave

 

[Shane Kelly]

Hi KudosDave,
It is becoming clear that I need to re-evaluate my options, and some of the things I discarded prior to posting here may need to be more fully explored - like buying a (non e-)bike that suits me, then adding a kit option.

I have had a very kind offer from an Edinburgh member to check out their Big Bear, and that's an option I am considering, but travelling outwith Ayrshire is not really doable at the moment, due to commitments here.

I want to thank you KudosDave, and all the other members who have taken the time to add their wisdom to this thread in an effort to help me. I am really appreciative of all your input, and I hope to contribute further to this community once I hit upon a course of action to follow.

Thanks
Shane.

 

[trex]

Shane, the benchmark to beat for your project is the £800 Woosh Big Bear LS. The conversion kit alone costs more than £550, that leaves very little money for the donor bike. Unless you intend to arrive at a much better bike than the Big Bear LS, it's not going to save you any money to go for conversion.

 

[Shane Kelly]

Hi Trex,
The woosh Big Bear LS is a very attractive option, and I can't find any unresolved issues about Woosh or their products on any search of the Internet that I have done. It was the one at the top of my short list.
However, this is a big purchase and it pays to take a step back once in a while along the decision path just to make sure the rose coloured glasses effect is not in evidence

My main concern with the Big Bear (or indeed any sight unseen purchase) is just that - no option to try before you buy. I think the Big Bear is adjustable enough so that I could ride it without problems, but I don't know if I want to risk my hard-earned cash on what I think...

Economics of a kit are not brilliant, e.g. a Giant Sedona (step through, 21 gears plus mudguards and lights at around £400 plus a kit at £500+ is more than the BB (and negates the warranty on the Sedona) and its down to me to fix anything that goes wrong with the kit, but the plus side is that I get a bike I know "fits" me.

Choices, choices!

I'll do the research exercise again and see what conclusions I come to this time round. By the time I am finished maybe woosh will have some more choices for me!

Thanks,
Shane.

 

[trex]

I agree that the Giant Sedona is a well made bike, sensibly price, Tredz have them for £375 new so a slightly second hand could be used as effective donor bike. http://www.tredz.co.uk/.Giant-Sedona-Womens-2014-Comfort-Bike_66504.htm?sku=198295
The Big Bear LS is about the same size as the Sedona size M.

 

[Shane Kelly]

The Big Bear LS is about the same size as the Sedona size M.

That is a handy bit of information - it's fine reading the spec on a website, but the Sedona is an actual bike that I have seen and had a short test ride on, and I know it can adjust to fit me.

Thanks for this - it is this type of information that I (and probably other newbies) value from you experienced e-bikers.

Regards,
Shane.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

If you want a donor bike, find one with disc brakes - or at least one with disc brake forks.