Rim Flare

[Old Timer]

Dave, you've had your tyre's off to repair punture's. What is in the construction of the rim to stop it spreading out?

To be quite honest Tony, I didn`t take an awful lot of notice. Knowing me, I would have definitely picked up on anything that seemed to be under par. I might have perhaps expected it more with my bike coming from a little known maker and I will certainly be checking them out today.
Of course perhaps we tend to forget that anything in contact with our brakes( be it car, motor bike or cycle) will have a certain amount of wear as a matter of course. From memory, wheels have a small web of extra metal down in the corner and these look like they have failed on that joint judging by the straight line. I would doubt it was caused by impact bearing in mind the psi and the riders weight. Even with over inflation and then the weight of a rider the pressure would be spread around the whole rim surely.

Just another point, I recently realised that my tyres were very hard (like solid at times) and i double checked the psi with my electric car pump that I keep on my van and there was a fair discrepancy. I ordered a new decent pressure gauge and sure enough I was actually over inflating with the old gauge.

Winterdog
Is it on both sides of the rim??

 

[NRG]

I suspect the rim will be similar to this:

 

[Old Timer]

I suspect the rim will be similar to this:

Well, looking at that rim and if it is similar I reckon it would take a hell of a lot of psi to distort it or wear it to the point of collapse. You have to think that the tyre would bulge out past the rim before the rim gave way. Maybe it was always faulty? I can`t see impact damage causing the problem without damaging the tyre or even some sort of visible damage on the rim, can you?

 

[Straylight]

That's just what I was thinking, if I were you then my first call/email would be to Wisper, or if you want to go the long way round, to the shop you bought the bike from.

As for disconnecting the motor, it's actually not that hard as it terminates at a single plug at the controller that is held together with a plastic latch that is undone by pressing on the socket side. It's then just a matter of snipping a couple of cable ties (carefully so as not to catch the cable itself). Removing the wheel itself is a bit of a faff, greatly eased if you take the rear mech guard off first, and completely unscrew the wheel nut on the gear side, along with the torque washer so that they are dangling on the cable.

Apologies if I'm teaching my grandmother to suck the proverbial .

 

[winterdog]

Old Timer: My rim is only flared on one side and is the same as the one NGR has very kindly posted.

the was thinking about the fault pump Pressure meeter last night and felt that it would have manifested on both sides of the wheel and on the front to. also i don't feel that im pumping hard or for a long time.

is there a separate rating for rims
Perhaps i should have checked with Doug or Dave before slapping tires that take a higher PSI than the originals that come with the bike.

 

[NRG]

I'm begining to think the rim you have has a manufacturing fault, give Wisper a call...

 

[Old Timer]

Old Timer: My rim is only flared on one side and is the same as the one NGR has very kindly posted.

the was thinking about the fault pump Pressure meeter last night and felt that it would have manifested on both sides of the wheel and on the front to. also i don't feel that im pumping hard or for a long time.

is there a separate rating for rims
Perhaps i should have checked with Doug or Dave before slapping tires that take a higher PSI than the originals that come with the bike.

I think you are still slightly missing the point. My Marathons state Min 45psi-Max 70psi so you don`t in any way shape or form have to inflate to the max.
So, buying a Marathon doesn`t mean you have to inflate your tyres any different from your originals which probably stated a very similar pressure range. So maybe you have been riding with tyres slightly higher in pressure than you needed to for comfort but now you say that it is only on one side of the rim then my money is on a faulty rim. I might be proved wrong but I reckon if you replaced the rim (not from the same batch) you would never see this problem again. Talk to David of Wisper , i`m sure he will give you good advice and accept liability if he thinks the faults lies with them.

 

[Straylight]

I agree, from your picture there is no obvious rim damage, and apart from the flare it's in very good condition. Also considering that racing rims that have walls that are are no thicker often have tyres at 120psi, it should be fine at 85. In fact if this were an issue then the rim itself should have a pressure rating, and AFAIK none do.

When you communicate with Wisper, send them pictures in as much detail as possible, as they're bound to ask for them.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Bent

Good morning guys,

Sorry to read about the problem Winterdog, the cause could be due to a number of factors. Please would you email me with your contact details, dmiall@me.com

This is an unusual case so we would like to become involved from the start. We can then determine if there is a fault, by being fully aware we can do everything in our power to make certain the fault is not replicated.

In the first instance please send me some images to dmiall@me.com and copy Norman at service@WisperBikes.com with as much info as pos.

We will send them on today to Alexrims for comment.

Is the bike rideable?

All the best

David

 

[winterdog]

Thanks for looking at this Dave,
Just so you know i was posting here first as not being a bike expert i just wanted to check i have not been doing something stupid or "yea winter what that thing happens during lent". This is not a moaning post more a Hmm this is a bit odd chaps kind of post . Because as you know my bike is the best in the world

yes the bike is pretty ridable at the moment. the back brake had to be detuned so it has no Effect apart from motor cut out. So im only cycle to the train station now and not in to Edinburgh.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

No problems

Hi David

No problems, this is exactly what the site is supposed to be about!

It's refreshing to be able to stop playing petty politics with would be competitors!

All the best

David

 

[Blew it]

Wonder if any one has seen this before or can recommend a course of action.

yesterday i noticed my rear brakes were sticking on a bit.

i had a look a when i got home and the where the rim meats the tire has stared to flare out over about half the wheel.

is this a new wheel rebuild (ala local wispier dealer) or some magic trick i can do.

i am very nice to my wheels and keep them in good working order and am at a loss as why this would happen.

i have put marathon plus tires a while ago and had no problems till now

is this something that would be covered under a warranty as it only 10 month old

davidk (worried about my poor wheel)

I'm afraid your rims are already stuffed!. The rims fitted to the 905 are not very strong, anything above 60 psi will cause the flaring you described. The weakness in these rims is due to the annular wear indicators being machined far to deep.

This was the same problem I encountered when refurbishing a 2007 905se. At some time both tyres had been grossly over-inflated resulting in the braking surface splaying outward. This angle was so acute it was impossible to find enough movement on the brake block eyeball swivels to accommodate the angle. This doesn't present a problem for the front disc brake, but, because the flaring is not uniform around the rim, it results in an unpleasant snatching of the rear brake.

In an attempt to solve the problem, I managed to purchase a "flames" rim and rebuilt the back wheel, only to find exactly the same flaring. Not giving up, I purchased another Wisper rim and rebuilt the wheel again. I'm sure you will understand my dismay when, at only 40 psi, the rim started splaying unevenly around its braking surface. At this point I gave up and presented the wheels to the wheel building mechanic at my local bike shop.

The wheels were presented "bare", disc rotor removed and the freewheel also removed. The mechanic sourced a pair of "Rigida SafetyLine DP2000's. These rims are very strong and drilled for 13G spokes, so the original stainless steel spokes were re-used. New nipples were used in the assembly. The new rims do not have wear indicators machined into them, which means that flaring is unlikely. The mechanic was very particular, even asking me to take the frame to the shop to ensure the rims were correctly dished to the frame centre line.

I have just collected the wheels today and was pleasantly surprised. The total cost including new Schwalbe rim tapes was a very modest £90.

Many thanks to Mitchells Cycles in Swindon for a suberb rebuilding job.

I hope this is of some help in resolving your problems.

All the best
Bob

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Alexrims

Hi Bob

Obviously I am very interested to hear of your experiences, were the rims Alexrims? We have not really had any problems since we changed from the chinese models and I (19.5 stone) always keep my tyres at 60/70psi and have not experienced any problems.

If it is the Alex type (now on all our bikes) I wonder if you still have the rims and I could have them collected?

If it is the case that the Alexrims are failing I need to know ASAP.

Anyone who is experiencing similar problems please let me know, of course if the rims are failing we will cover under warranty.

All the best

David

EDIT

Just re read your post Bob, the 2007 bikes did not have the rims that are now on our bikes so there is no need to worry. I would be pleased to send you a couple of Alexrims with my complements if you run into trouble again.

 

[onmebike]

Hi Bob

Obviously I am very interested to hear of your experiences, were the rims Alexrims? We have not really had any problems since we changed from the chinese models and I (19.5 stone) always keep my tyres at 60/70psi and have not experienced any problems.

If it is the Alex type (now on all our bikes) I wonder if you still have the rims and I could have them collected?

If it is the case that the Alexrims are failing I need to know ASAP.

Anyone who is experiencing similar problems please let me know, of course if the rims are failing we will cover under warranty.

All the best

David

EDIT

Just re read your post Bob, the 2007 bikes did not have the rims that are now on our bikes so there is no need to worry. I would be pleased to send you a couple of Alexrims with my complements if you run into trouble again.

Can't fault your aftersale's service David, Well done.

 

[Blew it]

Hi Bob

Obviously I am very interested to hear of your experiences, were the rims Alexrims? We have not really had any problems since we changed from the chinese models and I (19.5 stone) always keep my tyres at 60/70psi and have not experienced any problems.

If it is the Alex type (now on all our bikes) I wonder if you still have the rims and I could have them collected?

If it is the case that the Alexrims are failing I need to know ASAP.

Anyone who is experiencing similar problems please let me know, of course if the rims are failing we will cover under warranty.

All the best

David

EDIT

Just re read your post Bob, the 2007 bikes did not have the rims that are now on our bikes so there is no need to worry. I would be pleased to send you a couple of Alexrims with my complements if you run into trouble again.

Hi David,

The 2007 905se which I am refurbishing was fitted with the "flames" rims, both of which have been consigned to the skip. The first indications of flaring is when the black laquer in the wear indicators starts "pinging" out, usually unevenly around the periphery of the rim. On my other 905se, a 2008 model, similar signs of fatigue are beginning to show. The tyres on that machine have never been inflated above 55 psi.

The Wisper 905se is a brilliant machine to ride, and therefore I'm quite happy to give it the rims it deserves, especially as the cost of doing so is quite modest.

"Don't spoil the ship for a hapeth of tar"

All the best David
Bob

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Tar

Hi Bob

I agree with you 100%, that is why we changed to Alexrims from the flame type.

Do you know if the rims on your latest bike were Alex?

All the best

David

 

[Blew it]

David,

No, "Vincent" my 2008 905se is fitted with the rims in use during the interim period between the "flames" rims and the "Alex rims". These rims are currently serviceable, but later this year I will ask the mechanic to fit "Rigida" rims.

I do appreciate your offer of replacement rims, but as Mitchells are just down the road from me I will let the mechanic choose suitable rims. He's a down hill racer and certainly knows his stuff when it comes to rims.

Mark, MD of E-motion Electric Vehicle Company here in Swindon, has invited me to the opening of his new Wisper showroom. I'm looking forward to viewing the latest Wisper models there.

Thanks for the kind offer.

All the best
Bob

 

[eddieo]

Nice to see you around again Bob!

 

[Wisper Bikes]

I do appreciate your offer of replacement rims, but as Mitchells are just down the road from me I will let the mechanic choose suitable rims. He's a down hill racer and certainly knows his stuff when it comes to rims.

No problems, if you change your mind please let me know, enjoy the new showroom!

All the best

David

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Not an Alexrim

Hi David

Thanks for the images, the rim in question is not an Alexrim now used on all Wispers bar the 905eco. We have to date not had an issue with our "Alexrimmed" wheels which do not suffer with this weakness.

We will of course see what we can do to resolve your problem.

Best regards

David