Student Interested in Electric Vehicles

[Sparky12]

Hello everybody, I will keep this short but sweet; I am a student from the Netherlands who's interested in all sorts of electric vehicles. But primarily in creating an electric moped as of the moment, due to it being a realistic project with very promising potential results. Wanted to see if I could share information with the people here who are experienced with pedelecs, to learn from you guys and learn more about pedelecs as well which should further assist me in getting familiar and experienced in this field. Well, that's basically it, not much more to tell! Or simply ask me what's on your mind!

 

[D8ve]

Welcome There are a number of electric bikes about already. What are you going to do to make yours different?
And why?

 

[Sparky12]

Welcome There are a number of electric bikes about already. What are you going to do to make yours different?
And why?

Thank you! While I am a student I don't study anything fancy, just automotive engineering slightly above entry level, but hey I figured I'd start somewhere and seeing as I didn't want to be at school 24/7 for the time being it worked out just well since it allowed for only one day of school a week while working through the other workdays. And that's basically what I do, I work at a customshop, where all sorts of unique and old-school labour is performed.. although being somewhat of a geek or at least rather interested in and fancied by electronics at heart I always seek to intergrate electronics in things in my mind.

Most people who are into working with cars would like their stuff to be as simple as possible, like having a preferance for carburated engines rather than fuel injection systems or disliking computers and electronics in cars in general.. but not me! There's a bloody good reason there's an increasing amount of electronics and computers being built in cars, and I want to get my piece of the pie in the wonderous and also often infuriating world of (vehicle) electronics. Despite (possibly severely) added difficulty, the rewards can make it well worth it. I have a number of ongoing projects, especially regarding one car from the 80's that I am not only bringing back from the dead but also well into the 21st century! Turbo boosting it right into the future! (That should give you a clue roughly as to what kind of a car I'm talking about ) Or in the long run at least.. instead of stomping it back to the stone age by for example slapping a 'carb' on it like so many people would suggest me to do. I work on mopeds too, have started most of my tinkering with them, even still have one in the shed as of now that I've built myself.

I have been toying with the idea of an eletric moped for quite a while now, but hated the fact how they are always so expensive in purchase (far too expensive for me) and only available as scooters, as there is simply no motorized vehicle that I despise more than the scooter.. by a shot as far as from here to Tokyo.. First I wanted to develop one entirely for myself, I am naturally extremely interested in the concept to begin with, but unfortunately the car's got my hands tied financially-speaking for a good 3 years, at least.

Hence I came with the idea to develop one for other folks, the styling being entirely up to them as I would completely take care of that, and with a starting budget of only 1000 euro's. I'm basically giving away a lot in terms of labour with this offer but what's in it for me is the opportunity and the fact I can not only develop something like it but also actually establish something byt it. Currently working on creating a website to showcase my projects and announce possible new ones, but I am still in the midst of that and it could still take a few days before it is even presentable.

 

[flecc]

Whatever you set out to create Sparky12, make sure it fits into an EU legal two wheeler classification. We've seen a number of projects expensively brought to fruition which have been unusable simply because they are illegal on the roads.

Best of luck with your ambitions.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Sparky....you mention that you are interested in building an electric moped,do you mean a moped or do you mean an electric bicycle.
If you decide on a moped then you will need SVA,single vehicle approval to use on the road....I think this is easier to achieve in the UK than in Holland.you will also need tax,insurance etc....I suspect that such details are similar in Holland to the UK.
If you intend to build an electric bicycle then you need to build to the specification of EN15194,my knowledge of Dutch police is 'if you do us no harm we will leave you alone,type attitude' so,you should try to build to EN15194 ...if you google the spec I am sure it would be easy to comply.
KudosDave

 

[Sparky12]

Thank you for bringing this up, as I've built my own moped without license before I had to go through this stuff before. Here's a link, although it might provide a tad hard to read for most here: http://www.rdw.nl/sites/igk/Paginas/Brommer-toelatingskeuring.aspx
Basically what it comes down to is that the moped has to be restricted at a top speed of 25mph, needs functioning brakes, and functioning lights..
A mirror and a braking light too for mopeds with later frames, I'd translate the whole page but it's pretty long so I'd be at it for a while, and basically all else it says is that things should be "properly fitted" and not be rusted through or in a certain kind of bad condition.. it's all pretty logical stuff, having it put on a new license will cost less than 200 euro (about 160 I think it was, but don't pin me down on it).

There are also no taxes for mopeds here, only insurance which is like 15 euro a month tops.

 

[trex]

google translate does a very good job.
The good thing about having an electric moped in Holland is you can get it insured easily.

Admission Testing of a previously registered in Europe moped or a homemade vehicle
If you purchased in a country outside the moped European Union (EU) or European Free Trade Association EFTA or you have built yourself a moped and therefore you want to ride in the Netherlands, you must apply for a Dutch license. RDW moped must approve for riding on the Dutch way.
Does your moped a European type approval or have your moped a first registration date prior to January 1, 1998, will apply to the information in the article. requests Dutch license plate for vehicles from the EU , you can check with the manufacturer or your moped European approval has.
Identity at DIY
As part of the licensing inspection of a homemade vehicle RDW must first determine the identity. Before you start to build a homemade vehicle you must have to identify the main parts and VIN to strike by the RDW. For this, you create by calling the Customer RDW. Upon an inspection of the RDW an appointment
Requirements for admission test
This article is about the vehicle category moped. In Chapter 1 of the Vehicle can be based on the definition, find out which vehicles fall into this category.
The moped must meet ongoing and individual approval requirements. The permanent requirements can be found in Chapter 5 of the Vehicle Regulations . The individual approval requirements and information about the test can be found in the methods I accept L1-L7 .
RDW approves your vehicle on the points mentioned in the legislation.
Driving the moped to the inspection site
If you want to drive in the Netherlands with the moped to the RDW will prompt you in advance a one-day registration for that day. Without registration number of the vehicle in the Netherlands can not drive on public roads. Before driving the vehicle from abroad to the Netherlands, the RDW no registration off. Please get in contact with foreign bodies.
Request Admission Test
Applying for an admission test is as follows:

1. You fill out the online order form in and choose the right service.
2. You will receive an e-mail with attached application form.
3. The completed application form, send back with the required documents.
4. RDW employee shall, after review of the application and the documents, contact you for a test at home or at the RDW test center in Lelystad (TCL) .
5. You go on the day of the appointment by motorbike to the CTA and will, if applicable, the entire foreign registration certificate and your identification. Do you have any additional documents for your DIY vehicle, take it too.
6. The technical employee assesses whether your moped to the relevant requirements.
7. If everything is OK, the RDW within 5 working days, send the registration credit card size (also called registration card) with the correct information by post. You will also receive a letter with an ascription code. This is a code that you need, for example the sale of the vehicle. The code consists of 9 digits. It is important to preserve. Ascription the code properly and separately from the registration
8. If you have not received the registration certificate of the RDW, you need to create a license plate number plate authorized manufacturer and vehicle third-party liability insurance (WA).

Documents to bring:

• a valid ID ;
• the complete original foreign registration certificate, if applicable.

Cost
The cost of an admission test consists of the following items:

• Assessment fees and inspection fees based on time spent and the hourly rate applicable;
• Travel expenses (adoption at home;
• Registration fee;
• Costs for equipment use, if applicable;
• With a homemade vehicle, the cost impact of a vehicle identification number (VIN)

The rates of 2014 can be found in the price list of TTV RDW .
Prior to the inspection, you can request a price quote at the Department of Product Assessment of the RDW .

Rates in 2014
Admission & Supervision
Vehicles
Annex II Inspections and investigations of individual vehicles
Definition
Unit
Rate 2014 €
ADR vehicles
ADR certificate
STK
133.00
Issue CEOC declaration of ADR tank (vehicle)
STK
133.00
Preliminary ADR inspection document
STK
15,00
Issuing individual ADR inspection of periodic tightness testing at an
approved company
STK
108.00
Issue individual replacement document in connection with missing, illegible
or a full document
STK
15,00
Application for each tank (vehicle) in accordance with a series of TGK
STK
89.00
Annex III Type Approvals and Individual approvals including supervision
General
Unit
Rate 2014 €
Hourly administrative staff
HOURS
92,00
Hourly technical
HOURS
125.00
Hourly consulting / project management
HOURS
138.00
Travel expenses if by car to 225 km
STK
135.00
Travel expenses transport other than cars to 225 km, or a distance
of 225 km or more, regardless of the means of transport
STK
296.00
Travel Hours
HOURS
63.00
Subsistence
Actual
cost
Administration costs
STK
62,00
Updating national approval trailer subscription by type
STK
148.00
Updating national approval trailer subscription per variant
STK
36,00
Updating national approval trailer subscription by type
discount
STK
49,00
Updating national approval trailer subscription per variant
discount
STK
16,00

 

[Sparky12]

Yeah, it does, actually! Surprisingly enough, good thing though

Here's a model of what I've been working on in sketch-up, based on a 2006 Kawasaki ZX 5R, althought my project will a lot more likely be based on something like an Aprilia RS50 with a bust engine or anything akin to that (or perhaps something completely different, like an old-school or actual classic moped or an off-road moped, depends entirely on the investor of course):

 

[D8ve]

The looks are one thing but the real killer is power, it's realitivley easy to buy a KW motor it getting batteries to supply the juice and keep doing it all day or even 4 hours at 25mph your range is limited. This is mostly the killer.
In holland you should see some velomobile,s the best way to maximise you're watt mile.

 

[Sparky12]

The looks are one thing but the real killer is power, it's realitivley easy to buy a KW motor it getting batteries to supply the juice and keep doing it all day or even 4 hours at 25mph your range is limited. This is mostly the killer.
In holland you should see some velomobile,s the best way to maximise you're watt mile.

Haha, if anyone would want it to be a velomobile then that'd be pretty interesting too, although I figure it takes a special kind of people to (want to) operate those..

Like one of those bikes from Tron but with a cabine over them!

Haha, that'd be pretty futuristic and I'm not going to lie actually rather cool as well, for that ultimate mile per ---err--- electron(?) I suppose.. ;P As a matter of fact, I will call it the 'ElecTron'!! (Get it, get it? )

So yeah, if anyone would be interested in that and I can find a good body to work with, despite the problem that immediately comes to mind being the strength of such a cabine.. yet this can of course be reinforced by a special frame, a sort of rollcage if you will.

Going to need a good battery regardless though, to provide enough range as you speak of, will add extra weight and costs but should be doable I suppose.

Edit: Very good thing to hear about this from those who have experience with electric bikes by the way, this helps to further shape my idea about them, like providing power (which can be somewhat of a weakness) for a decent range.

And while a velomobile variant probably won't be anything like this:

I can see a bunch of people being really interested in having something more like this being built for them, with a moped license:

Ecofriendly as they are, it's also supposed to say "Human Powered" on the side, and potentially still providing the good workout that cycling can do.

Edit: And besides, you'll never get wet again during a ride, plus you could have a solar panel on the top to provide the battery with that extra bit of free solar power! Could even have it under a motorcycle license, and then of course built like one, for extra speed if desired.. and usage of main roads, of course.

 

[ReyesRay]

Haha, if anyone would want it to be a velomobile then that'd be pretty interesting too, although I figure it takes a special kind of people to (want to) operate those..

Like one of those bikes from Tron but with a cabine over them!

Haha, that'd be pretty futuristic and I'm not going to lie actually rather cool as well, for that ultimate mile per ---err--- electron(?) I suppose.. ;P As a matter of fact, I will call it the 'ElecTron'!! (Get it, get it? )

So yeah, if anyone would be interested in that and I can find a good body to work with, despite the problem that immediately comes to mind being the strength of such a cabine.. yet this can of course be reinforced by a special frame, a sort of rollcage if you will.

Going to need a good battery regardless though, to provide enough range as you speak of, will add extra weight and costs but should be doable I suppose.

Edit: Very good thing to hear about this from those who have experience with electric bikes by the way, this helps to further shape my idea about them, like providing power (which can be somewhat of a weakness) for a decent range.

And while a velomobile variant probably won't be anything like this:

I can see a bunch of people being really interested in having something more like this being built for them, with a moped license:

Ecofriendly as they are, it's also supposed to say "Human Powered" on the side, and potentially still providing the good workout that cycling can do.

Edit: And besides, you'll never get wet again during a ride, plus you could have a solar panel on the top to provide the battery with that extra bit of free solar energy! Could even have it under a motorcycle license, and then of course built like one, for extra speed if desired.. and usage of main roads, of course.

Well it looks like amazing bike.. i am still not sure when these bike will get economical..I hope these bikes will solve power issue..