Woosh Gale power cutting out & display issue

MikelBikel

Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
178
84
Ireland
My Woosh Gale has developed a couple of issues over this year. The power suddenly cuts out at a random 1, 2 or 3 times per days use. Display shuts off too, though bike re-starts if I keep pedaling and switch the display back on. Lately, after a re-start there is another momentary cut in power before things settle down.
The other issue is that the display shows full 4 led's regardless of how much charge is left, no 3,2,1 flashing. Gale will just shut down suddenly, completely from 4 leds when battery down to 33.3v from 41.7v fully charged.
Bike bought new Nov 2015, (although controller labelled mid 2014!).
Sounds like Phylion? controller not sensing Phylion battery voltage and operating standalone. Any ideas?
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
when battery down to 33.3v from 41.7v fully charged.
that symptom seems to point to the battery needing to be rebalanced.
Could you try to run down the battery as much as possible then measure the voltage. Put the battery on charge and write down the time it takes to fully recharge the battery.
Your battery is 36V 13AH, you should see the voltage at the output port rising by 1.5V for each hour of charge. Please check now and then while charging.
for example, if the voltage is 33.5V when you start charging, then you expect the voltage to show 35V after 1 hour, 36.5V after 2 etc. Charging should take roughly 5.5 hours from 33.5V to 41.5V to recharge fully.
If it takes less, please contact support@wooshbikes.co.uk
we'll fix it for you.
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
Please also make sure that the copper contacts at the battery output terminal are clean and put a little bit of grease on them to improve contact and keep oxidation away.
Do same to the blades on the controller side.
 

MikelBikel

Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
178
84
Ireland
Charged bike fully and then ran it on various trips for a total of 23miles until it shut down altogether from 4leds on. No 3,2,1,flashing, just suddenly cut out. No success restarting on 6mi trip home but it did restart as soon as i got it in the house! 4led's but not spinning at full speed on throttle.
Voltage 33.3v, now on charge at 4:45pm...
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
Charged bike fully and then ran it on various trips for a total of 23miles until it shut down altogether from 4leds on. No 3,2,1,flashing, just suddenly cut out. No success restarting on 6mi trip home but it did restart as soon as i got it in the house! 4led's but not spinning at full speed on throttle.
Voltage 33.3v, now on charge at 4:45pm...
that seems to confirm that the pack is out of balance.
After 23 miles, the voltage should be roughly about 35V.

You need to leave the charger on for (42-33.3) * 6.5 /10 = 5 hours and 45 minutes.

The charger should go green after about 5h 30 minutes and leave it on for another 15 minutes.
 
D

Deleted member 4366

Guest
If the LEDs didn't go out at 33V, there's something wrong with the display - probably got or had water in it. That would also account for random cut-outs.
 
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Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
let's wait for the battery to get over 30-35 miles then we'll check his 790 LED panel.
 

MikelBikel

Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
178
84
Ireland
From 4:45pm starting charge, charger went green at 11:20pm, 6hr 35m charge to 41.8v final voltage.
Regards cleaning contacts, i removed the suspension seatpost and pushed and turned the 'ignition' key fully anti-clockwise to slide out the battery, but won't budge. Just jiggles around a little (why i jammed inner tube in to stop it rattling and cutting out on bumps), i see lock bolt retract out of slide, but still feels like it is solidly locked in. Pulled handle until bike lifted off ground! Isn't it supposed to slide out? Is it actually held down from inside controller housing underneath? Puzzling, i will open housing tomorrow and investigate.
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
From 4:45pm starting charge, charger went green at 11:20pm, 6hr 35m charge to 41.8v final voltage.
that's good. Your battery should be back to where it was.

Regards cleaning contacts, i removed the suspension seatpost and pushed and turned the 'ignition' key fully anti-clockwise to slide out the battery, but won't budge. Just jiggles around a little (why i jammed inner tube in to stop it rattling and cutting out on bumps), i see lock bolt retract out of slide, but still feels like it is solidly locked in.
You need to remove the battery to grease the contacts.

If you have not removed the battery for a long time, air/rain pollutants will glue the plastic base to the plastic bottom of the battery.
Don't pull the battery by the handle just yet, you may use too much force and break the top of the battery case.
Retract the lock pin first. Clear the lock pin from the battery slide.
Push the unlocked battery from left to right to unstick the battery from the pollutant glue collected at its base to free the battery.
Clean and grease the battery's contacts.
The slide is fixed to the frame with two screws. Make sure they are tightened and give them a bit of grease too.
 

MikelBikel

Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
178
84
Ireland
Well, I opened the controller housing but am still not able to slide out the battery. It shifts upwards 1or 2mm but no further. The Jun2014 controller in this bike purchased Nov2015 shows signs of being affected by water ingress to the housing. I did seal the front cable entry with silicone when the latex fell out previously and informed Woosh. And I did ask then if the open rear cable exit should be sealed too but got no reply. I shall seal it now.
I am not inclined to try and force the battery out of its slide while the bike works. The slide or battery are probably catching somewhere and may break if forced.
Not sure if the controller, etc, has been affected due to water ingress thru the unsealed cable entry, but it seems likely given the 'always 4leds until dead' behaviour.
(Controller says LVC is 31v, so assume BMS is shutting off at 33.3v for 10s at 3.3v per cell.)
Any suggestions?
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
Mike,
Please email support@wooshbikes.co.uk - Andy is much better than me at advising you how to sort out the 790 LED panel and the stuck battery.
If you could attach a picture of the controller box area, that would help us too.

Tony
 
D

Deleted member 4366

Guest
Well, I opened the controller housing but am still not able to slide out the battery. It shifts upwards 1or 2mm but no further. The Jun2014 controller in this bike purchased Nov2015 shows signs of being affected by water ingress to the housing. I did seal the front cable entry with silicone when the latex fell out previously and informed Woosh. And I did ask then if the open rear cable exit should be sealed too but got no reply. I shall seal it now.
I am not inclined to try and force the battery out of its slide while the bike works. The slide or battery are probably catching somewhere and may break if forced.
Not sure if the controller, etc, has been affected due to water ingress thru the unsealed cable entry, but it seems likely given the 'always 4leds until dead' behaviour.
(Controller says LVC is 31v, so assume BMS is shutting off at 33.3v for 10s at 3.3v per cell.)
Any suggestions?
Whatever you do don't seal the bottom of the compartment. Every instance of water damage to the controller and connectors that I've seen is when people try to seal the compartment. the water gets in and fills it up. if you leave it unsealed, the water can get out without doing any damage. if the cable entry is above the bottom, then you should seal it there.
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
the hole for cable entry is not at the bottom of the controller box, but about the middle of the rear face of the box.
His 790 LED panel may need replacing.
 

MikelBikel

Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
178
84
Ireland
.. don't seal the bottom of the compartment.. water damage to the controller and connectors.. is when people try to seal the compartment. the water gets in and fills it up.. leave it unsealed, the water can get out without doing any damage..
Thanks d8veh, that did occur to me. I've sealed the 2nd entry with silicone too (no latex to hand, chewing gum?:)) and had sealed the access plate with grease, but I'll remove it. Maybe this is why I found a piece of plas cable tie caught under the bottom edge of the plate when I removed it. It probably held the bottom of the plate open to let water out. Usually cabling comes out of the bottom of a housing thru a grommet and has a 'drip loop' before rising.
 

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
Maybe this is why I found a piece of plas cable tie caught under the bottom edge of the plate when I removed it. It probably held the bottom of the plate open to let water out.
yes, you are correct.
 

MikelBikel

Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
178
84
Ireland
Here is a picture of the Jun2014 controller showing corrosion from the water ingress to the controller housing. Reassembled with no grease on bottom edge of access plate and a folded piece of inner tube cutting to keep it open a crack when screwed shut
 

Attachments

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
11,137
8,325
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
controller.jpg if you worry about the controller taking in water, you can undo the 4 corroded self tappers on the right side of the pictures and open the controller case to check. Do leave the 6 bolts with red washers alone, they bolt the 6 FETs to the casing.

Lishui controllers are well sealed. I am pretty sure that the inside is well dry.
I would wipe the aluminium controller casing clean and reassemble.

I think that d8veh was right, water got inside the 790 LED panel causing it to display wrong voltage level and to randomly cut out your motor.
Ask Andy for a sale or return 790 panel to swap out yours.

Can you post a picture of the battery?

That will help me to figure out why you cannot pull it out.
 
Last edited:

MikelBikel

Pedelecer
Jun 6, 2017
178
84
Ireland
Forgot to mention that both brake cut-outs on the Gale's Wuxing levers have failed. First was pretty much DOA and i was promised a replacement that never came, and the second failed this year. Power can be stopped by back-pedaling, but on a derailleur bike one must pedal forward to change down gears so one is in low gear for setting off again :-/
With a 2 out of 2, 100% failure rate, is this component up to the job?
 

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