MonVal Electra

Hi David, the following statement, is from the 'Dept for Transports' own fact sheet found here: Department for Transport - Electrically assisted pedal cycles in Great Britain Electrically assisted pedal cycles in Great Britain Fact sheet: Electrically assisted pedal cycles (EAPCs) in Great Britain Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycle (an "EAPC") In GB, the EAPC Regulations[1]; apply to certain bicycles, tandem bicycles or tricycles fitted with pedals by means of which they are capable of being propelled. For the regulations to apply, the motor assistance must be provided by an electric motor and not by an internal combustion engine. The electric motor must not be able to propel the machine when it is travelling at more than 15mph. ... Now to me, reading the above statement, it seems pretty clear cut that: if riding on a public highway, and all you have to do to go faster than 15mph is press a button, then the machine is illegal, because the electric motor IS clearly propelling the machine faster than the 15mph on road limit. If the DOT really do let this bike hit the roads legality unchallenged, then they must realise that quite a few of us suppliers will follow suit with similar buttons on various models because the precedent will have been set. ...Of course, our 'off road buttons', really will be for 'off road usage'

Hi Clarkey The EN 15194 standard is not a mandatory requirement in GB, it is voluntary. Currently, the legislation that manufacturers must comply with in the UK, is the GB EAPC Regulation 1983 and the Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1983. This info confirmed via Email to me from Claire Rees, Senior Engineer, Primary & eSafety Branch, Transport Technology and Standards Division, Department for Transport. Also, from what I have been told by various individuals at the above department, it will remain this way in GB for at least another year. The big fuss for manufacturers, is that some countries in Europe ARE planning to make it mandatory via law, so for those of us who want to trade in them, we need to get our products tested

Hello, the following info might be of use to this poor unfortunate individual to get the Insurance company to pay up... It is copied directly from the Dept of Transport EAPC regulations sheet :- Department for Transport - Electrically assisted pedal cycles in Great Britain The only way around this for the Insurance company, is for them to actually state in their writtten policy, specifically, that they DO NOT insure electric assist bicycles or, any form of motorised vehicle - The above information will be of use, should this person decide that they wish to pursue the matter. Sorry, my input crossed with Maestro's which has mentioned an Insurance company get out clause that I have also stated

...Yes, totally, the electric bike modelled on the website is 35kgs and that includes the two 5.3kg Heinzmann batteries and 5kg Heinzmann motor in the front wheel. ...Feel free to come down and weigh it for yourself The Uk law states that an electric bike must not weigh more than 40kgs to still be classed as a bicycle - there is no stipulation as to how heavy the panniers or bins are, that you fit to it. As regards the website - the reason the information is not there yet, is because we are still deciding on how best to display it and how much detail to go into and what options to list as standard, standard alternatives or as optional extras: For example, there are 3 different makes of centre stands that we can choose from and, at the moment, 3 different styles of pannier racks and mudguards and hard pannier bins, and tyres, rear as well as front. All of these groups of items, like for example the 3 different centre stands are of similar quality and price to each other. So, we have to decide on which one will be the default choice - and, anything that we list as alternatives or optional extras, we then have to make sure that we carry stock of. ... So, this then throws down another dilemma as to whether to list the weight of the bike by itself or together with the different options /alternatives mentioned above, or list the items weights seperately. And, whether we display the dimensions and weights in feet, inches, pounds and stones or in metres, centimetres and kilogrammes, or both. Etc, etc, etc... you get the picture.

....Spoke to the brewery and they told me that they'll stand you for 'salt and vinegar'crisps but the 'cheese and onion' will cost extra

Pedro62 - If you are talking about the MonVal, then please see page one of THIS thread. All your questions will be answered there.

Bode, you are incorrect. If the main reason for me being on this forum was to 'plug my bike,' then I would have stayed well away from a lot of / perceived controversial topics - which I clearly haven't . I am here because I genuinely believe that electric bikes can and will make a difference to society and will happily partake in discussion about them. had you read my previous posts, like you suggested I did with PED-AL, this would have been obvious. I particularly like this forum because most claims that are made on here are, or can be substantiated and the claims that cannot, are often shot down, leading to greater accuracy and less spin by those inclined to do so. For example: Try claiming that a 'Panansonic crank drive' bike can't climb a hill and that you are so staunch in your belief that you wouldn't even bother trying it - then see how many people on here who own or have ridden one and know otherwise, will jump on you. Remember, alot of people who joined have stated that they did so because of the valuable and ACCURATE information that they were able to gleen because of other members actual experiences with various products or manufacturers, or existing members technical prominence in certain fields. back to the topic - in my view, what he did was stupid, no question about that and he should be punished. A 6 month custodial though, on the face of it, to me seems a little harsh when you consider that far worse crimes have been perpetrated wherein the offenders received a very much lighter sentence.

Again, NOT attacking you but, PED-AL made it quite clear, that he had no intention of being a 'Potential customer' - As to a valid point - please remind me of exactly what his views had to do with my company winning the 'carbon reduction award'? - also, as I have said before, anyone is welcome to try it for themselves to see if my claims are true or not. But as we are going way off tangent to the subject of this thread, I suggest we start a new one to answer this. I actually understand your frustation and the need to express it. The difference is that I withdrew my statement when I realised that I should not have called him that (despite what I thought), will you be big enough to do the same? - as you have called a lot of people ar*sh*les. Back on topic, some of us, HAVE been / WERE trained to drive vehicles quickly because of the jobs / functions we performed. But we were ONLY sanctioned to do so during the execution of that job/function. (You will find that these people are connected with the MOD or other specialist government agencies )... so some people can judge what is safe or isn't. ...And because I know that you are going to say 'PROVE IT' - I will. My mate Frank, is the Team Leader of Driver Training for West Mercia Constabulary. That means that he (a civilian) teaches police officers to become Class 'A' drivers - you know, the ones who pose around in their shiny Volvo V70 T5s on the motorways.

LOL ... Like it! :D

OOOOOh, if I could... I would

.... or an ar*eh*le I know that you probably won't believe this but, I am NOT having a dig at YOU. I have posted the above quotes because I think I can see where this is going next and am only using YOUR words to prevent an escalation. Please heed your own quotes about presenting facts and remember Mussels quote - I did.

Apparently it is, I cannot go into the technicalities because I do not know too much about how it all works. What I can tell you, is that it was originally destined to go into bike projects like the Velib system in Paris to counteract theft but as someone has pointed out on this forum ( I think it was Flecc but not sure ) their main problem seems to be vandalism. I will tell you alot more about the system if we are lucky enough to get chosen.

Thanks guys, the bins in the picture are 87 litre capacity ones and as regards theft, yes the unusual styling helps to discourage this. There is also a company developing an RFID (radio frequency identifiers) system that is small enough and cheap enough to fit/ hide onto bicycles for fleet use. We are hoping to be one of the companies that they will use to trial it. This win has put us in a stronger position for being a candidate, simply for the publicity alone that they will get. Sorry, for those who don't know, basically a company has developed a tracking system that can be installed / hidden on a bicycle and that works in a similar way to the system used for cars. If it really does work as they claim, you can just imagine the benefits.

Back to the Original topic of this thread Right, now that the dust has settled, we can go back to the original topic of this thread - which was to share the news of my company's good fortune and to show that the wider community are getting more accepting of E bikes as alternative transport albeit for short journies. Please see the attached pictures of the bikes that were entered for the competition.

Hello Mussels - We will be travelling up and down the country shortly - PM me your details and lets see what we can arrange. Hello Swinnerton - I would absolutely LOVE to do Prestigne but unfortunately it clashes with other commitments around that time Just posted this before seeing tiberious's post. Again, I would have loved to attend it. Because, as you say for the 2009 event there is now a hill climb and a throttle only section (correct me if I'm wrong) We are aiming to try and do the Bike Europe gig in Friedrikshine (thats how it sounds to me) Germany. Although this is a lot of money, it is very good exposure and lot of the trade will be there.

Flecc - The head angle on the MonVal is 70 degrees precisely to stop that tiller effect. The steering is akin to a cruiser style motor bike only not as slow turning. Regarding hill climbing of recumbents over diamonds - ordinarily they would be slower but not when you've got THE most powerful road legal hub motor as I have to aid you. Somebody from this forum, please, please, please come down and try it - this way, I will get independant review of its' abilities and it will put all these doubts to bed.

Mussels you are correct and I retract that statement. As for endearing myself to the forum - to be honest I've never tried. Flecc - I cannot be bothered to have the whole recumbent / diamond frame debate all over again . This is Cyberspace and the proof of the pudding is in the eating - As mentioned before, you and anyone else who would care to try it in the flesh are welcome. Just PM me and I will arrange it - although give me 4 weeks - this way you can see how efficient / 'inificient' it is or isn't . Bode - See, I grew up

Bode - THIS - I DO NOT have problem with, because looks are subjective and you've laid down reasoned facts eg aesthetic factors and you are just stating your opinion. What PED-Al did was to make a scurrilous accusation with no basis in fact and despite evidence to the contrary. But you are correct, I do have better things to do than to descend to this level of pettiness with him - I've got go and spend 40k

[ It was more than that pal, YOU made insinuations without a shred of evidence to back you up where as I have actual and factual evidence which you clearly cannot be bothered to read about. LOL. You are arguing with a guy who works with a cycle organisation that specialises in assisting people with BACK TROUBLE and other disabilities to ride. I know well of the different types of back pains that people endure. If you'd bothered to read any of my earlier posts or seen my pictures, this would have been evident! - In fact, why do you think the MonVal was developed in the first place? - Also, you are not sat bolt upright, you are sat slightly at an angle to relieve pressure off the back - hence the term semi - recumbent!! - again read the posts and the website!! Me - 20 years BT engineer, 20 years mechanical engineer, lifelong cycling enthusiast, in all its forms. If the design of the bike is so 'inificient' as you claim and you are SOOOOO well qualified and a mould toolmaker at that, WHY DIDN'T YOU DESIGN SOMETHING BETTER!!!? - All I had to help me was an organisation that specialises in cycling for the disabled and a University that is a leader in transport design and the review of the machine was by someone who is very pro-bicycle and not overly keen on Ebikes, because he is young and very fit!!!!!

Hmmmm... I get it, this only applies to me and not PED-Al who threw the first stone and did not apply any of the above

Hello Bode - Sadly, I do not think that PED-AL has any intention of engaging in reasoned debate as was evidenced by his opening statement despite all the evidence that was easily accessible around / to him .

First of all, thank you to all the people who have congratulated me/us - it is really appreciated . I naively posted the win up here to show the doubters that people outside 'our little world of this forum' were starting to take electric bikes more seriously. And, apart from the increasing sales that are slowly but surely getting better documented, what better way to prove this than for an electric bike company (regardless of who they are) to win accolades :o . I personally love it when the bike manufacturers let us know about their successes outside the bubble, such as Powerbike celebrating 10 years, or the fact that Cytronex are attracting fitter riders to the world of E-bikes or that outdoor leisure centres are starting to use Kalkoffs, etc etc etc. ...Because for me, each success opens the door a little wider for the general public to be aware of the wonderful world of Ebikes (so long as they are good quality and value for money)....Strewth, I sound almost Evangelical ... Back to your original question about folding the bike, it is possible to seperate it ala 'moulton bike' style using S&S couplings but todate, no one has ever seriously enquired about this.

Hello Eddieo - I believe that they are doing what any big business in todays climate (pardon the pun) should be doing - looking at diversifying to protect their interests. They realise that the commodity that they've built their business on will not last for ever and are looking at getting in early on any new technology / innovation.

Hello all - The following quote taken from this link is to remind everyone that this bike is designed for heavy utility and touring. VeloVision Online At 8ft long, you can see it was never designed to be used in confined spaces, there are other bikes for that. Its size however, is ideal for the attributes mentioned above. PED-Al, your stupidity amazes me!! You say the bike looks inefficient with no factual proof to back up your statement and despite ALL THE EVIDENCE to the contrary!!!. I'll give you some BIG clues as to the evidence : - 1) CYCLEMAGIC.ORG - 'the not for profit organisation', are based in HILLY Leicester and they assemble and store the bike. They also helped to test it during its development and guess what they specialise in - making cycling accessable for the disabled!!! - which is quite ironic, given your bad back situation - 2) COVENTRY UNIVERSITY is a leading centre in the field of 'Transport Design' - so have a BIG guess who helped to iron out any bugs - if you still can't work it out, check out the contacts page of my website Andrew Walters Next Generation Bicycles 3) The following quote is from the PDF of the 'Velovision Online' link above and was written about the MANUAL PEDAL bicycle version of the MonVal - The editor of that magazine, lives in York which is for the most part, pretty flat. He rode the bike (manual pedal version) so HIS comments about efficiency are valid. AND REMEMBER, THIS WAS WRITTEN ABOUT THE MANUAL PEDAL VERSION - SO WITH THE EXTRA ASSIST OF A HIGH TORQUE HEINZMANN ELECTRIC MOTOR, JUST IMAGINE HOW GOOD IT IS NOW!!!

The following extract from this link News - A Leicester based business with a big idea for tackling climate change has won a Shell Springboard award of £40,000, giving their business a valuable boost in a programme designed to promote the growth of the low carbon economy in the UK. Walters Innovations Ltd received the award for its work in developing the MonVal Bicycle, a comfortable, electrically-assisted bike with a generous luggage capacity that might just be the answer for a low-carbon, low perspiration commute! As well as being comfortable to ride, MonVal is also economical. Think of a 100 watt electric light bulb burning for an evening: that's enough energy to propel the MonVal for twenty to forty miles, and it costs just five to eight pence per mile to run, compared to fifty to eighty pence per mile for a car. Andrew Walters, Managing Director of Walters Innovations Ltd, hopes that the MonVal will not only encourage more people to swap their cars for bikes, as they’ll be able to cycle for longer, but will also be used as a green transport alternative for businesses. Shell Springboard gives a financial boost to innovative, commercially viable business ideas that tackle climate change. The programme encourages a positive business response to the challenge of climate change by providing a no-strings financial boost to small ideas with innovative products and services that could help reduce greenhouse gas emissions and really make a difference. Andrew Walters, Director of Walters Innovations Ltd, said: “This award means I can ramp up production and finally get our bike out there into the business community. I can actually make a difference now, it's actually going to happen." Paul Snaith, Vice President Downstream Marketing, Shell Global Solutions said: “Congratulations to Andrew and Walters Innovations. The MonVal Bicycle not only has huge commercial potential but could have a significant impact on the UK’s carbon emissions. It’s this kind of cutting-edge innovation that has made the UK a world leader in low carbon technology investment. In a difficult economic climate, it has become more important than ever that we continue to foster such independent entrepreneurialism which is so crucial to the UK economy in the long term.” According to Shell Springboard’s Race Against the Carbon Pound report* the UK’s ‘green’ companies attracted over £1billion of venture capital and private equity investment in 2007: 41% of the EU total. This makes the UK the European leader when it comes to attracting venture capital and private equity investment in low carbon technologies, second only to the United States worldwide.