Hey guys,

 

I really need some help in choosing my first E-Bike!

 

I need something with the following requirements:

1. Suitable for long travel and commutes, as I travel between cities (60-80 km is best).

2. Powerful pushing motor to go up steep hills, as I live in a very hilly area with long steep hills and want to go up them with ease.

3. Rugged and durable frame like a mountain bike, as I tend to like adventuring and going down bumpy and very uneven terrain quite sporty which would rattle any bike.

4. Something comfortable for the bumpy adventure rides and long commutes. Mudguards and Back/Front Rack preferred.

Budget: £2000-3000

 

The current ones I have stopped on after weeks of searching are:

 

Wayfarer H9 Hub-Drive Crossbar | Wisper Electric Bicycles (wisperbikes.com)

with Adventure Tires, Front Rack and 700W motor.

 

Neomouv MOUNTAIN 2 28'' T47 630WH KAKI (neomouv.com)

with 630W motor.

 

ENDURO | Hikobike

with 670W motor.

 

Haibike | SDURO Trekking 3.0 | Trekking eBikes

 

The current one which I really like and want is the Wisper Wayfarer H9.

The only problem with it is that, if possible, I would like to remove the speed restriction on any bike/model I buy while taking full responsibility about that.

 

The first 2 models in my list including the Wayfarer H9 are discouraging me as they have custom motors and I can not find any information about a way to derestrict them.

The latter 2 in my list seem to have options about how to do this but I am not sure which one to choose.

 

Would anyone be able to give me some guidance and advice on which one to get or possibly suggest any other models or bikes in my price range which fit my criteria?

Having said that I fully understand the reproductions of me wanting to derestrict the speed on the bikes and I am willing to take the risks on my own head.

 

Any bike suggestions would be very helpful even if they can not be derestricted. I just want a good choice in this price range!

 

-Bogo

Edited August 25, 20223 yr by BogomilPetrov

well with the haibike if you fit a dongle the range will be about 25-30 miles depending how fit you are with a 500w batt.

 

for the range you want id look at bikes with a 20ah size batt or 1000w+

Fit a dongle to the highbike to derestrict it, the battery will last less so 50km might be ok but not 80km.

If BP sticks to 32km/h then he might be ok for 50km.

well with the haibike if you fit a dongle the range will be about 25-30 miles depending how fit you are with a 500w batt.

 

for the range you want id look at bikes with a 20ah size batt or 1000w+

 

Even if I don't go for the derestricting in the end which one of the 4 do you think would fit more for my criteria? Or maybe some other one?

 

It would be nice to have the option to have full speed but even without id rather have a good choice in my price range.

Fit a dongle to the highbike to derestrict it, the battery will last less so 50km might be ok but not 80km.

If BP sticks to 32km/h then he might be ok for 50km.

 

Fair enough. Is the Haibike a good option then? Regardless of the dongle I'd rather have a good and reliable bike.

 

Which of the 4 options would be best and if none any other suggestions?

For range you need as much battery capacity as possible so the wayfarer with 700wh battery or the 670wh battery bike.

With the wayfarer one will get the best CS should a fault occur and they supply parts for their bikes up to 10 years old, once past this the bikes tend to be nearly obsolete.

Fair enough. Is the Haibike a good option then? Regardless of the dongle I'd rather have a good and reliable bike.

 

Which of the 4 options would be best and if none any other suggestions?

for commuting, you should consider a hub motor and puncture proof tyres.

They require the least maintenance and likely have lower depreciation.

If you want to derestrict your bike, then consider a conversion.

For long distance, cadence sensor has the advantage over torque sensor because you can pedal less whenever you so wish.

the most i got from a 500w batt is 48 miles at normal bike speeds and climbing hills ect.

 

also the batts for these bikes are expensive a new bosch 500w batt is £633

Wasn't georgehenry quoted a lot more for a new yamaha battery ?

i still had the dongle on but with m8s on normal bikes but there super fit so if i did not have a dongle id be left for dust.

 

i get 25-30 miles if i floor it tho at 120rpm i can hit near 40mph but cant have speed and range yet and my hips are fooked at that rpm.

Are you all saying that I should just forget about the derestricting and go with a normal bike? I'm just afraid it will not be future proof.

 

There used to be these electric bikes on a subscription where I am and I i used to ride them all the time and pay a lot of money.

 

Problem with them was that the restriction always triggered at certain point and made me pedal against the motor... It felt horrible.

 

If I go with a bike such as the Wayfarer H9, if I exceed the 15.5 mph limit will it start working against me to keep limiting my speed to 15 5 mph?

 

If I was able to use my own legs to increase the speed last the motor assistance after 15.5 mph then that would all be good. I just don't want it to go against me and try to slow me down to its "normal speed".

I can definitely pedal myself more than 15.5...not if a motor is working against me or whatever ...

no just if you want faster speeds the batt will need to be bigger my bike is 24kg and no point in trying to ride it past the 15mph cut off as like hitting a brick wall just with a dongle the range will suffer depending how fit you are and what mode you use.

My bike is about the same weight (with a bigger battery ), and that brick wall was troubling at first - but now I can maintain a comfy 28km/h on the flat, after the electrical assistance has cut off at 25km/h. I'll need to TRT like Lance Armstrong, obviously...

A car would be best. Allows you to sneer at cyclists caught in the rain.

Are you all saying that I should just forget about the derestricting and go with a normal bike? I'm just afraid it will not be future proof.

no, we are not saying that you should just forget about electrification because you want to derestrict your bike or bikes. The law as it stands let you have a fast electric bike if you so want, you have to wear a helmet, share the road with cars where you ride because you are not allowed on paths where children may walk, get a number plate, pay insurance etc. The process is well explained here:

https://ebiketips.road.cc/content/advice/advice/buying-and-riding-an-s-pedelec-in-the-uk-1637

 

 

Now there is a distinction of breaking that law on a bike you bought from a shop and a bike you convert yourself. Suppose you run over somebody at over 15mph. Their lawyer will look at every angle that they can make a claim on. You can see that the shop owner and the bike manufacturer will try to avoid being sued. That is why doing a conversion yourself if you intend to break the current law.

If I was able to use my own legs to increase the speed last the motor assistance after 15.5 mph then that would all be good. I just don't want it to go against me and try to slow me down to its "normal speed".

yes, you can do that (use your legs at over 15mph) at anytime, like when going downhill. The motor has an internal clutch that eliminates 95%+ of drag or binding. Only the road illegal direct drive motor kits sold on the net have significant magnetic binding when pedalling without power. Not only that, they weigh a ton and they are used essentially to turn bikes into motorbikes with a permanent throttle, you can't realistically pedal them on your own steam. You often see them advertised as 1000W, 1500W, 2000W kits etc, they are worse on climbing hills compared to middle of the road legal bikes because road legal bikes are allowed to release a lot more power for a limited period when climbing hills, typically 500W-750W, you can still fly up the hills at up to 15mph. The direct drive kits don't have internal gearbox so can be slower than legal bikes on hills. If you only want to occasionally go little over 15mph on the flat, it's usually not a problem with legal bikes, they let you get to 15mph, then you can speed up from there.

Thank you all for the replies!

 

I'm thinking more and more of never derestricting and just going with the Wayfarer H9 and the good customer support. (Unless there are other suggestions)

 

As long as the bike doesn't go against me on purpose past the cut off (motor working against me to limit my speed on purpose) and spins freely like a normal bike would then it seems like the best option.

 

Ill just pedal harder if I need to get somewhere. My only worry was "the brick wall" being there on purpose and not allowing me to pedal harder.

From what I understand it just stops the motor and leave the full bike weight for me to carry instead of making pedaling harder.

 

I have no intention in causing harm or breaking the law that badly. I just didn't want to struggle against a motor which was working to stop me on purpose.

I'm fine with a heavy bike.

Also I guess my best choices might be the Wisper Wayfarer H9 or the HaiBike Sduro from what people here seem to have suggested of my choices.

 

One final time I want to ask if anyone has any other good suggestions from something that's not on my list, or some other one from my list?

 

I will make my choice today and buy it all today.

 

Also would the WAU bike that I see advertised everywhere survive a bit of rough handling? I tend to like going down stairs sometimes lol.

 

I will report back after I read a few more posts which will appear here with my choice and go and buy it!

Thank you all again for the amazing support!

I have considered what you all said very carefully and I myself am not sure why I would derestrict when I'd mostly ride it in people areas.

Also would the WAU bike that I see advertised everywhere survive a bit of rough handling? I tend to like going down stairs sometimes lol.

I'd like to go down stairs sometimes too, but I reckon you'd need good full air suspensions for that like Soundwave's bike. Mid range bikes have coil front suspension, OK for normal roads but not offroad.

Maybe he'd sell his to you for much less than you would expect. I have a second hand Sunn Shamann Finest full suspension bike (10.6kgs) that I am converting for quick on/off electric/normal for that kind of use.

Edited August 26, 20223 yr by Woosh

The issue with highbike is warranty, after the two years are up any major repair or replacement part will be costly, where as something like the wayfarer will be much more reasonable.

The issue with highbike is warranty, after the two years are up any major repair or replacement part will be costly, where as something like the wayfarer will be much more reasonable.

 

Thanks Neal, and if I can chip in, we support our bikes for many more years than the bigger brands. And if we dont have the parts a complete upgrade of the electrical system to current specs (not motor as 95% of the time it's not needed) costs about £350.00 including labour and VAT. We have done a lot of these. That's one of the advantages of dealing with an independent family business!

 

All the best, David

Edited August 26, 20223 yr by Wisper Bikes

Pretty much the conclusion seems to be get a Wisper Wayfarer H9 or build a custom conversion if I want the derestricting option?

 

I guess I'd be voiding the warranty on any other brand bike in general if I try to derestrict it.

 

I might pop down to a local E-Bike dealership and ask them to try out a 15.5mph bike anyway to see what I should expect exactly.

 

[mention=11305]soundwave[/mention] What is your bike mate? I'm curious after people mentioned it here.

 

I've narrowed it down to the Wayfarer H9 without ever trying to derestrict, Haibike with a dongle derestriction or a custom conversion build... Not sure if this got easier or harder hah.

I use to ride about as fast as I could when I first had ebikes 20 - 24mph and one soon tires of the extra concentration needed and relises that an accident or an off is going to hurt alot. It's ok going down hill fast with the mass/momentum but out on a ride I find one actaully sees and notices more of the surroundings rather then just going as fast as possible.

It may have been said above, and also may not be as easy now as when I bought my two bikes, one back in 2011, and the other in 2015, but I took the time to seek out the bikes I had short listed and test ride them.

 

As a newbie back then in 2011 I test rode a Panasonic crank drive Kalkhoff that I expected to be a formality before buying it, but was a bit underwhelmed and then tried their sport version that I liked but was too pricey for me. The shop were also selling Oxygen Emate citie bikes, a rear hub Chinese generic electric component bike, and I loved it immediately, and bought that for £1399. I still have it, and still use it a lot, though have had to replace some parts, but that has been relatively easy using generic parts cheaply available off ebay.

 

So I bought a completely different bike to the one I thought I would after test rides, and for me, the test rides were very important and I still love and use that bike a lot.

 

All bikes have their own feel, and every person responds differently according to what they prefer. The difficulty as a newbie is that you don't know what you prefer yet!

 

I did the same when I bought my Haibike hard tail Yamaha, test riding several bikes and systems before buying my Haibike, and again doing that has been very worthwhile as the characteristics of the Yamaha crank drive system are exactly to my preference, after comparing it with the market leading Bosch system of that time, as well as other systems.

 

Also as a newbie I might consider giving the Whoosh Gran-Camino due consideration as a tough well thought out bike from a well regarded supplier with keen pricing.

 

Though I am sure a Wisper Wayfarer H9 is great, it is quite a lot more money than the Woosh that could enable you to buy a second large spar battery for the Woosh and it still be cheaper.

 

For maximum range my crank drive Haibike Yamaha is more efficient and flexible than my old cadence controlled rear hub bikes, as it uses a torque system making you contribute a portion of effort to receive a portion of power from the motor. More by luck than judgement the Yamaha motor has proven to be very tough and adds no drag when you select no motor assistance. If you de restrict it and choose a low assist mode, there is no hitting the wall feeling, and the cruising speed is higher than the legal cut out point but not a silly high speed, and naturally restricted by gradients, wind etc, so in the 19 to 22 mph range with a realistic chance of the best of both worlds with a high average speed approaching 20mph and a long range by saving battery capacity where you can without losing speed. Once you gained experience of riding in this way I would expect the Haibike to be able to achieve 50 miles by selecting low or no assistance where gradients allowed. I have certainly found this.

 

Completely unscientific but I have just come back from a 26 mile ride, mostly off road with 236 metres of vertical difference between my starting point and destination but with plenty of ups and downs in between, and used 37% of my 400Wh original battery now in its eighth year, and only 31% to the base of the last hill to climb home where I upped the assist and used 6% in the last half a mile home. So the way I used the assistance on this ride would equate to a total range of just over 70 miles.

Edited August 27, 20223 yr by georgehenry