1 hour ago, Sturmey said:

There was a survey done where 47% of respondents seem to support the idea of an increase in power level as below. I would tend to agree with this and with the original poster. I live in a hilly area.

Proposed changes to legislation for electrically assisted pedal cycles – outcome - GOV.UK

Who are these opposing killjoys? I can't believe there's so many of them. This consultation must have been rigged.

Manufacturers of cheapo ebikes want them to outlast the 12 month warranty period, even if it's only by a zeptosecond or two, therefore they select cheap controllers which won't overstress their cheapo and often small capacity batteries composed of cheapo Chinese cells and cheapo BMS incapable of sustained high amperage for long periods of time. Unfortunately, a battery which can output sustained high current is what any motor needs when climbing a steep hill. Larger capacity batteries composed of cheapo Chinese calls can discharge higher current for longer periods of time, but that adds weight and cost. A small powerful controller which fits neatly into a bike's design isn't going to be as cheap as a one of the same size made with higher quality components designed to last operating at higher current. Cheapo ebikes will always be offered for sale, people will keep buying them and being disappointed, and they'll blame the "250W" limit, without knowing that they can choose to replace the controllers and batteries to whatever the current current limit of both working in concert is: there isn't one - they can do so legally because the law doesn't currently limit what current a legal ebike controller draws from the battery for the "250W" rated motor.

When batteries, bikes, and riders are identical, you can climb steeper hills with a mid-drive than you can with a hub motored bike, because you can use the bike's gears. Let the hub vs mid-motor war commence! 🤪

My 20" wheeled BBS01B mid-drive 2006 Dahon Helios P8 folding bike conversion zooms up most hills at 25kph, and it does so without much if any effort from me, but it does have the mightiness of the small wheel torque advantage and a capable 691Wh(19.2Ah) 36V battery composed of decent quality LG MH1 cells. I could zoom up hills faster than in the first video below, the motor disengages at 25kph. I was only using the 18.4A Level 8 because I forgot to change to 20A Level 9. As you can see, the motor starts assisting under 25kph and stops at 25kph, all the way up most hills, because I've limited top speed to 25kph in the controller's firmware. The wobbly handlebar torch on top was temporary, replaced by a larger headlight soldered to the battery to make a usefully bright but not blinding triple headlight cluster. I should point out my UART version of the BBS01B motor has had it's controller's firmware parameters perfectly adjusted, and UART BBS01B motor kits are rather rare now because Bafang has stopped making them. You might get a UART BBS01B from here - if they send you a CAN bus BBS01B, I guess returns may be free because the listing says so.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005010176950145.html

I now weigh less than 70kg, and I need to expend very little effort pedalling, because I can't be sweaty when I arrive at work, so my bike suits me fine. I've towed trailers with an all up weight of 90kg+ up steep hills, I can't say that was easy, but doing the same would be easier now that I have increased the controller limit from 15A to 20A. I expect all but the most grotesquely fattest of disgusting wobbly stinky fatsos would be able to pedal my bike up steep hills, and they might even do so without their thunderous wet farts frightening wildlife to death, if the rider weight limit of my 2006 Dahon Helios P8 wasn't 105kg.

Rapid Fatso would collapse my bike.

Edited 22 hours ago22 hr by guerney

I was looking at hiring a E-mountain bike when I was in southern europe (I think the 250W limit is standard across all of europe).

All the bike shops I asked at said they only hire 500W bikes, most had started with legal 250w bikes but got too many disappointed customers so they soon moved to more powerful bikes.

3 hours ago, Peter.Bridge said:

Up to a point, but there is a reason why all the grimpeurs are very light - see square-cube law

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climbing_specialist

Whoa this grimpeuring dude weighs only 48kg! He must have the legs of a shire horse. He should give them back when he's finished. He could easily lose another kg by having those massive ears trimmed. More aero.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Rujano

Edited 22 hours ago22 hr by guerney

I personally find in London especially round where I live where there’s always lots of traffic and lots of buses in the bus lane that the 48 V 250 W motor is enough set at legal 15 MPH with the ability to ghost pedal on an E throttle up to 15 MPH.

I don’t think 20 MPH is unreasonable or too fast on the right road conditions but that said after two years using E bikes I agree anything more powerful just by an electric motorbike.

I personally do not want numberplates insurance MOT on my bike I want to mount the pavement if I need to for safety reasons and do all the things I can do without my bike being a motor vehicle.

It also gets me out of the van doing a bit.

That said I think the bike that are being bought by good marketing and sells by the likes of Halfords et cetera are poor performance and no ability to really be able to customise.

By the good marketing and sales by Halfords, et cetera the voice typing nearly got it right this time.!!!