Cycle Insurance from Bikesure

[flecc]

How interesting is this? Even more so the fact that none of this was mentioned when I bought it...... Or in fact in the many posts regarding the dongle issue...

The subject has been done to death many times Phill. It's all results from a mess created in 2003 when a new type approval law appeared to legalise 250 watts, while the e-bike law remained unchanged. The DfT failed to act to clear things up for years, but this is finally happening now that e-bikes are becoming a larger issue. Meanwhile you are safe from prosecution.
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[JohnCade]

Hi John,

We can cover Pedelecs, ebikes,- Almost all bicycles, electric or not.

If you would like any help regarding insuring yours then don't hesitate to get in touch.

Kind regards,
Jordan

So my suspicion that it wouldn’t cover pedelecs is correct. Almost all of them are more powerful than the old regs which you are using, and even the recovery policy I’ve got from Lexham covers normal 250w bikes. Chocolate teapots come to mind.

 

[SteveRuss]

Bikesure have teamed up with Pedelecs in order to offer competitive insurance for bicycles!


At Bikesure, one of our biggest strengths is that we aim to say yes to everyone; whatever you ride or drive, we will try to help.

So basically. What you posted here to get our attention isn't actually something you can offer at all? Wow. Stunning..

Maybe you should work for these guys.

https://www.eta.co.uk/insurance/cycle/insurance-for-electric-bicycles-and-ebikes/

 

[flecc]

So basically. What you posted here to get our attention isn't actually something you can offer at all? Wow. Stunning..

Maybe you should work for these guys.

https://www.eta.co.uk/insurance/cycle/insurance-for-electric-bicycles-and-ebikes/

Don't be too quick to condemn Steve, ETA are not bomb proof either, see this statement from them:

When you compare cycle insurance for your electric bicycle, it is vitally important to check the small print. Almost every single pedelec or electric bicycle sold and in use in Britain today is rated at 250 W. However, some cycle insurers do not cover bikes over 200 W. Cycle insurance from the ETA extends its definition of a cycle to include any mechanically or electronically-assisted bicycle weighing less than 60 kg and with an output not exceeding 250 W /15.5 mph.

The new regulations remove all pedelec weight limits, so their 60 kg limit will be an unnecessary restriction!
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[SteveRuss]

Don't be too quick to condemn Steve, ETA are not bomb proof either, see this statement from them:

When you compare cycle insurance for your electric bicycle, it is vitally important to check the small print. Almost every single pedelec or electric bicycle sold and in use in Britain today is rated at 250 W. However, some cycle insurers do not cover bikes over 200 W. Cycle insurance from the ETA extends its definition of a cycle to include any mechanically or electronically-assisted bicycle weighing less than 60 kg and with an output not exceeding 250 W /15.5 mph.

The new regulations remove all pedelec weight limits, so their 60 kg limit will be an unnecessary restriction!
.

Sure I read that. I was really just surprised that a company would come on here selling insurance that they are not actually willing or able to fulfil.

It sounded like Phill got his quote application turned down and more to the point, that almost everyone on here would as well.

60kgs is a lot. My Kalkhoff is just shy of 25kgs and it's blinking heavy

 

[flecc]

True, but they can hardly be blamed for using the law as it stands, it's ETA who could come unstuck in a civil court action.

The 60 kilos was derived from the e-trike category of the old EAPC law. It's now become very relevant since the new law permits quad bikes as well for the first time. Therefore the advertising quad bikes with large rear hoardings that trundle some city streets as in London will now for the first time be able to have assistance, and they weigh well over 60 kilos. Also trike pedicabs generally weigh around 125 to 150 kilos.
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[Bikesure]

Hi guys,

Our policy wording is as below

The Bicycle must be driven only by human pedal power or electric battery and must not be powered in such a way that it is subject to the provisions of the Road Traffic Act(s).

As I posted previously, the current ruling is Here

As an Insurance Broker, we are not in a position to tell you what you can and cannot do. Upon calling us we will recommend a road use policy due to the current ruling. If you wish to take a cycle policy out then that is fine but bear in mind the insurers terms I posted above.

If the law is due to be changed then that is fantastic and will dispel any confusion or uncertainty, however in the mean time we have to comply with current ruling and recommend a road policy where to meet with the rulings of the EAPC you would need to register the bike.

If your cycle is 200W or less then we can certainly cover it on a cycle policy, if it doesn't comply with the current rulings then we can offer a road policy but to comply with this you would need to register the cycle.

So to summarise: We can certainly help either way, but until the ruling is changed you would need to register the cycle to comply with the EAPC ruling.

Kind regards,
Jordan

 

[JohnCade]

Hi guys,

Our policy wording is as below

The Bicycle must be driven only by human pedal power or electric battery and must not be powered in such a way that it is subject to the provisions of the Road Traffic Act(s).

As I posted previously, the current ruling is Here

As an Insurance Broker, we are not in a position to tell you what you can and cannot do. Upon calling us we will recommend a road use policy due to the current ruling. If you wish to take a cycle policy out then that is fine but bear in mind the insurers terms I posted above.

If the law is due to be changed then that is fantastic and will dispel any confusion or uncertainty, however in the mean time we have to comply with current ruling and recommend a road policy where to meet with the rulings of the EAPC you would need to register the bike.

If your cycle is 200W or less then we can certainly cover it on a cycle policy, if it doesn't comply with the current rulings then we can offer a road policy but to comply with this you would need to register the cycle.

So to summarise: We can certainly help either way, but until the ruling is changed you would need to register the cycle to comply with the EAPC ruling.

Kind regards,
Jordan

A tiny bit of research before you posted would have told you that there are probably a handful of 200w e bikes on British roads, and I doubt that anyone reading this site has one. So basically it was a waste of time. Perhaps it would have been better to wait until the law change is fully ratified?

I might even get a quote from you then ...

 

[Bikesure]

A tiny bit of research before you posted would have told you that there are probably a handful of 200w e bikes on British roads, and I doubt that anyone reading this site has one. So basically it was a waste of time. Perhaps it would have been better to wait until the law change is fully ratified?

I might even get a quote from you then ...

Hi John,

As I previously posted, we can certainly help now although you would need to adhere to the EAPC government ruling if your cycle is over 200W.

If you don't adhere to it then we would still recommend a road policy however you are welcome to take a cycle policy out as long as you bear the insurers terms in mind that I posted in post #27.

Kind regards,
Jordan

 

[Deleted member 4366]

As a person who doesn't really understand a lot of the legal speak... does that mean my bike is illegal, or not? And, would I have this issue if I made a claim on my house insurance, who never asked the wattage question

Simple answer. It's illegal.The waiver isn't actually a waiver. It doesn't make your illegal bike legal.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Hi John,

As I previously posted, we can certainly help now although you would need to adhere to the EAPC government ruling if your cycle is over 200W.

If you don't adhere to it then we would still recommend a road policy however you are welcome to take a cycle policy out as long as you bear the insurers terms in mind that I posted in post #27.

Kind regards,
Jordan

You can't offer anything, because it's almost impossible to register a 250w electric bicycle. As others have said, what you've written is a complete waste of time because nobody can actually insure their bikes with you except for the one guy I know that managed to register his bike and a handful of people throughout the country that still have the old 200w bikes.

 

[Bikesure]

Hi d8veh,

What I can confirm is we can offer an insurance product that will cover manual cycles, and electric cycles up to 200W (Now, I'm sure some of you will have manual pedal cycles too.)

We can also cover electric cycles that are over 200W on a 'Road' policy as long as they are registered, which as you have mentioned some are.

As I'm sure you can appreciate we are new to the cycle insurance market and I'm disappointed to hear of the ongoing legality issues so I genuinely appreciate the feedback on this matter.

Currently my view on it is If the cycle is legally a cycle, the Road Traffic Act doesn't apply - so we can help you guys out with an insurance product to cover them, we don't decide the law but hopefully from what you guys have said is that the law will be altered soon to the benefit of everyone!

Kind regards,
Jordan

 

[flecc]

Simple answer. It's illegal.The waiver isn't actually a waiver. It doesn't make your illegal bike legal.

It is a waiver against police prosecution as posted a number of times. The government no longer claimed the right to prosecute as a breach of the law, thereby effectively nullifying the law on 250 watts.

OED: Waive verb refrain from using or insisting on one's right, claim or privilege.

Civil law practice relating to claims and insurance is a different matter in which lower burdens of liability exist.
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[Gubbins]

Quite a can of worms opened. ...

 

[oldtom]

Ah well.....no messiah then!

Tom

 

[JohnCade]

Ah well.....no messiah then!

Tom

I think he was a just a very naughty boy.

Should have done his homework.

 

[mfj197]

Not naughty, just wasn't aware of the daft legal situation we've had for years which is about to be resolved. Homework might have helped, yes.

Michael

 

[flecc]

Actually Bikesure could insure a 250 watt pedelec (no throttle) if they were prepared to tough it out in the event of a dispute, since EU law trumps UK law in any such event. Here is the relevant document extract, I've highlighted in bold the relevant parts:

The EU Directive 2002/24/EC comes into effect on
May 9, 2003 and will replace the current Directive
92/61/EEC.

Until May 9, 2003 the current national regulations concerning the status of pedelecs will remain unchanged.
After May 9, 2003, the EU Member States have the choice of either keeping their current regulations for another 6 months or changing over to the EU-directive.

By November 9, 2003 all Members of the EU are required to integrate this Directive into their national legislation and abolish their previous regulations.

Example:
In Great Britain pedelecs with a top speed of 15 mph (22.5 km/h) and 200 Watt motor are classified as bicycles. Pedelecs with a higher top speed or a stronger motor require a type approval.

No later than November 9, 2003, Great Britain must conform to the EU-directive: Pedelecs may have a 250 watt motor and be able to reach a top speed of 16 mph, and still be classified as a bicycle.

This 2002/24/EC regulation was passed into law by the UK parliament on 10th November 2003, but the old 1983 EAPC regulation was not rescinded, replaced or amended, thereby breaching the EU order.
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[JohnCade]

Not naughty, just wasn't aware of the daft legal situation we've had for years which is about to be resolved. Homework might have helped, yes.

Michael

“Always look on the bright side of life..."

 

[shemozzle999]

Anyone asked for a quote now the laws have changed?