50 CYCLES A WARNING no quibble guarentee

JohnCade

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 16, 2014
1,486
736
I think it was pushing £40 if I remember right. Which I swallowed until it also broke after about 2 weeks and got the feeling the bike frame and mech were great but the rest was rubbish. Including the display - back of the plastic clamp broke on that, no spares and told about £250 for a new display (when the old one still works perfectly OK. Fittings were just not fit for purpose - low quality plastic rubbish both with a design flaw where they screwed to the frame - couldn't even take the stress of the Gloucestershire potholes ! Sorry but £250 to replace a display due lack of a clamp which couldn't be fixed and no reliable chainguard (which was very unusual shape and hard to substitute) = cheap junk in my eyes. However good the system and mech were if the rest of the bike can't handle a few 25-mile trips without falling apart there's no hope for the product as a "high-end item" overall !

Re the Chinese batteries, I bought the one for my Trek from BMS Battery. Spent a few months building it a couple of years ago and it's still going strong despite having been ridden very infrequently over the last year as haven't really had the chance. Was a 36V 20Ah one - still delivers loads of power although it drops a bit faster now than when I bought it - but not much. Was under £250. I think it's the luck of the draw to some extent to be honest. The chinese hub kit isn't like riding a crank drive - but it's so much more versatile for getting around and covering distance, and I have to be honest, far more fun. For some "light" exercise, I like my new pedal bike far more than I ever liked the Kalkhoff, including the Endeavour when I tried that ;).
I remember reading about your problems with the axle pulling foward in the dropouts, and that same thing happened with my Agutta. I fixed it with a Batavus chain pull from Holland Cycles costing a couple of quid. They’ve changed the design on the later ones which are now belt drive. But the problem I think began with the upgrade to the more powerful Impulse motor which combined with rider input, and particularity when used in very hilly terrain, meant the hub nuts could not hold the axle back, and it pulled forward on the drive side in the near horizontal drop outs.

It was an example of a design working fine as a pedal cycle, and fine with the less powerful Panasonic motor, but which was not changed when other parts of the bike were upgraded and the new motors were an upgrade too far.

As regards price I asked you about your bike when you were selling it and was put off because it was a step through. But if you had put it on eBay you would have got a good price. More than double the £500 you mentioned at eighteen months old. In fact Kalkhoffs hold their price very well compared to some other makes.
 

selrahc1992

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 10, 2014
559
218
I remember reading about your problems with the axle pulling foward in the dropouts, and that same thing happened with my Agutta. I fixed it with a Batavus chain pull from Holland Cycles costing a couple of quid. They’ve changed the design on the later ones which are now belt drive. But the problem I think began with the upgrade to the more powerful Impulse motor which combined with rider input, and particularity when used in very hilly terrain, meant the hub nuts could not hold the axle back, and it pulled forward on the drive side in the near horizontal drop outs.

It was an example of a design working fine as a pedal cycle, and fine with the less powerful Panasonic motor, but which was not changed when other parts of the bike were upgraded and the new motors were an upgrade too far.

As regards price I asked you about your bike when you were selling it and was put off because it was a step through. But if you had put it on eBay you would have got a good price. More than double the £500 you mentioned at eighteen months old. In fact Kalkhoffs hold their price very well compared to some other makes.
incidentally and accidentally thank you - i have sa fiend with a kalkhof tasman, i helped her adjust the gears this weekend (it's simple i know, put in "4" and line up teh little lines, but she didnt know), afterwrads, to test things out i took it for an inspired ride, while doing a corner i had the weirdest sensation - it wobbled, it felt as ifthe wheel had buckled, but i checked the spokes and all was fine. i will advise her to get a batavus chain pull. call me naive though(and apologies if this post repeats, puter swallowed it a moment go), but if we can realise all of this on a public forum as amateurs, why couldnt kalkhoff, supposedly a company specialising in pedelecs with a bunch of engineers and quality inspectors realise this before - for all of teh circa £2k oine is expected to pay fo one of their bikes i'd expect more.
 
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mick2444

Finding my (electric) wheels
Jun 5, 2015
19
21
65
the managing director co owner scott rang me sunday afternoon. after an apology then a LOT of questions about battery care etc he told me to box the batterys and TNT will pick them up today he said he HOPES to have a new battery in my hands by friday he said they have plenty in stock i said dave got me 2 batterys next day delivery he said they want them back first, fair enough..if the NEW battery doesnt turn up by friday teatime i will post on here the first solution he offerd me and why !! i was going to go away camping this week got some time off theres more to life than electric bikes but not at the moment
 
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103Alex1

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 29, 2012
2,228
67
It was an example of a design working fine as a pedal cycle, and fine with the less powerful Panasonic motor, but which was not changed when other parts of the bike were upgraded and the new motors were an upgrade too far.

As regards price I asked you about your bike when you were selling it and was put off because it was a step through. But if you had put it on eBay you would have got a good price. More than double the £500 you mentioned at eighteen months old. In fact Kalkhoffs hold their price very well compared to some other makes.
Yes I agree with your analysis on the wheel nuts. 50 Cycles never did admit the bike had a design flaw and whilst they were happy to send out replacement wheel nuts that was never going to solve the problem.

I don't know about £1,000 being a good price for an 18 month old Kalkhoff costing £2,700 when new. Wasn't worth selling for that to be honest as I couldn't have got anything better for the money without throwing a grand retailer markup at a replacement. By then I wasn't needing it for daily transport any more ! All in all the whole thing was just a hugely disappointing experience for a great deal of money and cost me a great deal of time I could have been spent riding instead. A lesson I learned early enough to build a bike I rode all Summer in 2013 without a single hitch and is still going strong today - without a taped up display or a rattling chainguard anywhere in sight !
 

SteveRuss

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 12, 2015
566
263
57
Bristol, Uk
Harsh but fair.

Speaking of not fit for purpose, we have had quite a few posts about dodgy Kalkhoff batteries.

Difficult to draw accurate statistical conclusions, but it does seem Kalkhoff batteries are less reliable than other premium brands.
I was one of those with a dodgy 17ah battery for my Kalkhoff. My experience was better though. I had a full replacement within three days after I took the battery/bike to their Bristol store.

The only quibble was that when the bad battery was being assessed in store with one of their plug in machines, a very nice chap (that for whatever reason doesn't work there any more) noticed a cable unplugged that he hadn't expected. When I phoned to ask if my new battery was available to collect, they said yes but were concerned that i had tampered with the wiring in order to de-restrict the bike, which I totally did not.

I had to phone Matt and offered to take my bike to the shop for a full appraisal to prove that no tampering had occurred. It was decided by the chap and Matt on the phone together, that the connector was supposed to be unplugged and that the chap in the Bristol shop was getting the wiring confused with another model.

No bones broken and an otherwise quibble free battery replacement after and though I'm still of the opinion that 50 cycles aren't perfect, they were there to support me with a brand new replacement part within a very reasonable time frame. Great bikes too.

Oh. And I recommend DPD over any UK courier on this date. Excellent service with the best customer based online parcel tracking service of the lot.
 
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rsscott

Administrator
Staff member
Aug 17, 2006
1,398
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A number of posts have been moved to a new thread to continue discussion there. Please only post to this thread if it is related to the original query.
 

4bound

Pedelecer
May 1, 2014
172
86
Neston
www.facebook.com
I think its worth pointing out that this problem with horizontal drop outs does not apply to at least some of the current Kalkhoff range which have chain drive. I know John talks about the Belt drive models, but mine has chain drive, but does not have horizontal dropouts. I have therefore found no problems when using on 20% gradients in North Wales.

I remember reading about your problems with the axle pulling foward in the dropouts, and that same thing happened with my Agutta. I fixed it with a Batavus chain pull from Holland Cycles costing a couple of quid. They’ve changed the design on the later ones which are now belt drive. But the problem I think began with the upgrade to the more powerful Impulse motor which combined with rider input, and particularity when used in very hilly terrain, meant the hub nuts could not hold the axle back, and it pulled forward on the drive side in the near horizontal drop outs.

It was an example of a design working fine as a pedal cycle, and fine with the less powerful Panasonic motor, but which was not changed when other parts of the bike were upgraded and the new motors were an upgrade too far.

.
 

JohnCade

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 16, 2014
1,486
736
What kind of drop outs does yours have? Are they not the forward facing about 30 degree downwards inclined kind? I was only talking about hub gear models of course. The derailleur ones have vertical drop outs obviously.
 
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4bound

Pedelecer
May 1, 2014
172
86
Neston
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What kind of drop outs does yours have? Are they not the forward facing about 30 degree downwards inclined kind? I was only talking about hub gear models of course. The derailleur ones have vertical drop outs obviously.
John, my wife's belt drive model has vertical drop outs. As for mine - well I don't have access to it to check at the moment, will check the detail next time I do. I did look at the time of the original post and am sure they are not horizontal......to be continued!
Not the issue I know but my Thorn (Rohloff hub) also has vertical drop outs - tensioning via an epicyclic hub.
 

JohnCade

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 16, 2014
1,486
736
Looks like they’ve changed to the same kind of dropouts as the belt drive models with an Alfine tensioner fitted as standard. They must have recognised the problem belatedly. I wonder if they still sell a Nexus 8 with a chain though? Probably not.
 
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oriteroom

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 13, 2008
297
110
Looks like they’ve changed to the same kind of dropouts as the belt drive models with an Alfine tensioner fitted as standard. They must have recognised the problem belatedly. I wonder if they still sell a Nexus 8 with a chain though? Probably not.
Probably only on the Tasman, John. Which has nexus 8 andva chain
 

oriteroom

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jul 13, 2008
297
110
I remember reading about your problems with the axle pulling foward in the dropouts, and that same thing happened with my Agutta. I fixed it with a Batavus chain pull from Holland Cycles costing a couple of quid.
Hi John, should i need one, is this the item, and how does it fit in the dropout?. Any piccy of your Agattu fitted with 'em?

Thanks

Sorry meant to add the pictureimage.jpg
 
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103Alex1

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 29, 2012
2,228
67
Looks like they’ve changed to the same kind of dropouts as the belt drive models with an Alfine tensioner fitted as standard.
Which is what they should have offered to fit on the previous defective design, rather than constant denial that it's down to selling something that's basically not fit for purpose out of the showroom !