Are there any 'non-shopping' styled bikes...?

[DDmouse]

Hi. I'd love to get an ebike but am looking for one that looks like a modern MTB and not my Grandads shopping bike from 1952!
I've checked the links on this site and Google but would like to avoid an aftermarket bolt-on kit.

I appreciate most of the designs are Chinese and aimed for their own market (I spend lots of time in China and am always amazed by how these bikes are used to move everything around - washing machines, generators etc) but my own bikes are currently carbon fibre, expensive bits- with no mudguards etc.

Anyone know of designs like this? I appreciate the benefits of ULTRA lightweight bits are negated by strapping a great lump of motor and battery on, but surely some more modern looking bikes exist.....?

Many thanks

 

[Miles]

I'm not that keen on the design but it's certainly not your grandad's shopper:
Optibike - Optibike Models

 

[Beeping-Sleauty]

not for shopping...hhmmm

how about this...

Brand New Ebiko Electric Bicycle - Body Trainner

or maybe one of these,

TidalForce iO

probably illegal.
beeps

 

[Ian_Fearn]

I'm in a similar position. Have you considered one of the Heinzmann kits to convert your swish MTB?

I've got no experience at the moment but the Kinetics website is very good and i'm very seriously considering my options.

 

[giguana]

I just got one of these for 150 but it is incredibly heavy and cheap
Electric Bikes & Vehicles

and I've noticed this
Find SYNERGIE MISTRAL LITHIUM E-Bike Electric Bike Bicycle on eBay within, Bikes, Cycling, Sporting Goods (end time 29-Nov-07 14:00:49 GMT)

probably the same as this
Sustain Cycles - E-bikes, Electric Bikes, Folding electric bicycles, Sustainable transport, Environmental transport, cycles, in Harrow, London, Middlesex, UK, HA1 3TP

I have got a kit because it enables me to choose any bike and change around from one bike to another, and it's more discreet because the batteries are on top or sides of rankmount.

 

[Ian]

Many of the shopper style bikes are inspired by Dutch and other continental designs where function has always been more important than styling, and contemporary mtb styling is not ideally functional for road use. There are a number of broadly mtb styled bikes around such as the Ezee Torq and F series along with the Wisper 905 and others although in reality they are hybrids, the sloping top tube giving them an mtb look. There's no mainstream road racing styled bikes though, the lightweight construction with thin frame tubes and wheels not really being suited to motorisation.

 

[Canadian Cadence]

Since you already have the bike or bikes I would recommend one of the great kits that are out there. I made the mistake of buying a new bike and adding the Bionx kit thinking I would still use my road bike and mountain bike because I thought nothing would be able to replace them. The reality is I have not used my road bike and have only used the mountain bike twice when my wife went off roading with me and HAD to use the Bionx.
Check this site out for some variations using the Bionx kit. JV Bike Electric Bikes -- the Best Selection of Electric Bicycles in Canada ...

This also shows the new OHM bike using the Bionx motor and console with a new battery company.

 

[flecc]

Of course Grandad's 1952 shopping bike happens to be a lot more efficient than most MTBs, which are often a triumph of style over function and common sense.

To make the most of the limited bike motor power, those experienced e-bike producers, the Chinese, naturally prefer a more efficient bike, giving higher speeds and longer range.
.

 

[DDmouse]

Many thanks for the quick replies and info. I'll certainly look at the ideas suggested.

I also understand the comments about current bikes being practical - but when was practical ever desirable (my girlfriend doesn't wear walking boots to a party..)?!! I like my toys to make me smile when I open the garage.

Or as another analogy it is definitely more practical and sensible to be stuck on a desert island with Ray Mears and his survival expert chums - but I'd much rather be stuck there with Girls Aloud!

I looked at fleccs other posts. I think we share a love of things two wheeled but from opposite ends of the spectrum.

 

[flecc]

I looked at fleccs other posts. I think we share a love of things two wheeled but from opposite ends of the spectrum.

Not altogether opposite ends though, I appreciate mountain bikes etc where they were originally intended and spent years riding in motorbike off road competition. I also agree with you about the beguiling nature of good MTB styling, but on the road I prefer the enhanced riding pleasure from more efficient bikes.
.

 

[coops]

In line with the theme for re-education about bike styling and purpose, are you referring to better efficiency due to no suspension and narrower, slicker tyres, flecc, or does the frame geometry, construction and material make a big difference too? I recall the geometry being mentioned in passing lately, but I've never really understood how that affects performance & handling, for example?

Stuart.

 

[flecc]

It's the whole package Stuart.

Narrower road tyres roll easier than the wider and often knobbly treaded tyres on MTBs.

Any suspension saps pedal power, particularly at times of greatest need when pedalling hard, since the springs absorb energy and dissipate it uselessly to the road and harmfully back up to the rider, opposing their effort. Of the two, rear suspension is the worst. The ideal is for the connection from all points of the rider to the bike and road to be as rigid as possible, commensurate with enough comfort for the riding purpose.

Frames for mountain bikes/MTBs are more often designed with style in mind rather than correct geometry, and the provision of suspension can prevent best geometry. Our bodies physiology dictate a best possible relationship between all the contact points of person with bike, pedals, saddle, handlebars, and this sets the geometry. The best is illustrated by the sort of bikes seen in top cycle racing, and is ideally fine tuned to each individual, in the retail market done with a range of frame sizes sometimes. I'm sure you'll agree there's very little in common between a Tour de France race bike and the average fully sprung MTB, showing how far the latter has strayed from the ideal in the name of fashion.

Here's an illustration of one way in which off road requirements compromise frame geometry. Off road bikes need extra ground clearance so have high bottom bracket and pedals. But the saddle needs to be low enough for the rider to be able to get a foot down, so the saddle to bottom bracket distance is immediately compromised by those conflicting requirements. In competition off road, the rider compensates by standing on the pedals and therefore corrects the relationship, but if such a bike is used on road journeys with the rider sitting on the saddle, they are stuck with legs being too bent all the time to exert maximum thrust power, so their performance is reduced.
.

 

[DDmouse]

To make my ultimate 'urban machine' I suppose what I now need to do is get a kit (Bionx/Heinzmann/other - yet to decide) fitted onto something along the lines of a Cannondale Bad Boy Ultra. This would hopefully look suitably modern but incorporate the features for a good town bike. Just need to suss out wheelsizes, disc brakes, 8/9 speeds etc etc

I agree about suspension sapping power (which is why my carbon MTB has remote lockout levers for front and rear shocks) but the cobbled Yorkshire road shortcuts I often use cause my eyeballs to shake out on ultra stiff aluminium frames. Chassis design/suspension -it's all about compromises......

 

[flecc]

That sounds good DDmouse, and yes, it is about good compromise of course.

As I posted above: "commensurate with enough comfort for the riding purpose", and on those cobbles you do need some defence.

I just think it daft when I see someone on smooth roads, squatting on a soggy suspension cheap MTB, legs bent at around 90 degrees all the time and struggling along slowly as I pass them on the more sensible setup of unpowered as well as e-bikes.

You'd be better off with V brakes though, discs being more about fashion than good braking. The biggest diameter disc brake, and therefore the most effective, is a rim brake.
.

 

[DDmouse]

V-brakes - ohh, hurts just to think about it!!!!
Of course good brake setup is the key but v-brakes means I can't get a custom disc made up with my own name and logo CNC'd into the disc rotor.....

 

[flecc]

True!

In fact I think there's a bit of a case for a disc brake on a motor wheel, since building on a new rim after rim brakes have worn it would be a pain.

And the monograms etc are a great anti theft defence.
.

 

[Canadian Cadence]

Another advantage of the Bionx system that should be mentioned here is that the regenerative braking really enhances braking power and saves the brakes. The magnetic sensor is set up on the rear brake lever so that the motor goes into regen mode when the brake lever is used. Mine is set so that it turns on this feature by just barely squeezing the lever before the brakes begin to grab.
I like this feature just as much for the enhanced braking as the recharging of the battery.

 

[Branwen]

I seem to remember having the choice of mtb style or shopping style when I bought my lafree, but went for the shopping type style as being less cool and therefore less desirable to the thief. I made a cover for the battery which slings over both sides a bit like a pannier, and this means it is not immediately obvious it is an electric bike when it is parked up too.

 

[coops]

Off road bikes need extra ground clearance so have high bottom bracket and pedals. But the saddle needs to be low enough for the rider to be able to get a foot down, so the saddle to bottom bracket distance is immediately compromised by those conflicting requirements... if such a bike is used on road journeys with the rider sitting on the saddle, they are stuck with legs being too bent all the time to exert maximum thrust power, so their performance is reduced.

Thanks for the explanation flecc - now I finally understand why, when I adjust the saddle height 'correctly' for the pedals on my MTB, my feet barely reach the ground! duh! I guess I was a bit slow to work that out! - I'd always assumed the 'frame size' was a bit too big for me; however, the Torq 'handlebar reach' feels far more roomy and comfortable in comparison now, and my feet reach the ground better too with the saddle height properly adjusted for the pedals, so I guess its just that the MTB geometry is all out of balance, like you say. The penny has dropped on this one .

Stuart.

 

[Ian]

Don't see many MTBs in the Tour-de-France, even on the mountain stages. Look to the pro's to see what makes an efficient bike.