BH Emotion City Plus

[Vennwood]

Hi,
This is my first post on here however I have scrolled through this site on several occasions and I wonder if anyone can help me?

We are both retired (unfit) long time walkers who have had pedal cycles for years. More recently we use them with our camper van to travel around looking at various sites when on holiday. We travel less now and have resorted to cycling along the local cycle tracks but discovered that there are "too many hills" in Devon and would like to convert to "assisted cycling". We have painfully discovered the minefield of electric bikes and been seriously burned through our own stupidity so now wish to get it right this time.

Having read advice and reviews a great deal on this and other sites we are thinking of buying a couple of Woosh bikes (Sant Ana and Krieger) however have seen a BH Emotion City Plus secondhand for around £700. I notice that new they retail for over £2000 but can be bought for around £1500. Does anyone have any experience on the BH and how does it compare with the Woosh? Would this be a good buy?

Many thanks in advance for your help

 

[trex]

is it this one?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BH-Emotion-City-Plus-Electric-Bike-Panasonic-eBike-/281663234747

bike is excellent, battery not good, price fair. Does not have a throttle.

Excellent buy if you are relatively fit and want to do shortish rides, 15-20 miles. If you want 30+ miles, you'd have to buy a new and bigger battery, then the Krieger/Santana are better buys.

 

[Emo Rider]

Hi,
This is my first post on here however I have scrolled through this site on several occasions and I wonder if anyone can help me?

We are both retired (unfit) long time walkers who have had pedal cycles for years. More recently we use them with our camper van to travel around looking at various sites when on holiday. We travel less now and have resorted to cycling along the local cycle tracks but discovered that there are "too many hills" in Devon and would like to convert to "assisted cycling". We have painfully discovered the minefield of electric bikes and been seriously burned through our own stupidity so now wish to get it right this time.

Having read advice and reviews a great deal on this and other sites we are thinking of buying a couple of Woosh bikes (Sant Ana and Krieger) however have seen a BH Emotion City Plus secondhand for around £700. I notice that new they retail for over £2000 but can be bought for around £1500. Does anyone have any experience on the BH and how does it compare with the Woosh? Would this be a good buy?

Many thanks in advance for your help

I have had a BH Emotion City 700 crossbar for almost two years now. I commute putting an averate of 60 miles a week on it. After 4,000 plus miles the battery and bike are still in very good condition. It is a crank drive, 8ah system that is rated for 60 miles range. In the real world I get between 30 and 40 miles and I weigh over 15 stone. In the winter you can expect the range to drop a bit but this is true for any lithium powered bike. It works very well on hills being a torque sensor type of drive and is a pleasure to ride with no power as it has a great gearset.

£700 pounds sounds fair as that is what I would sell mine for if I were to sell it. It has been such a good bike that I will drive it into the ground. Would I buy another new? Probably not as the new bosh and yamaha powered crank drives work so much better. You nor I are not going to get one for £700 anytime soon

If you do consider the BH there are some things to look for. Firstly the overall condition of the bike. If it is in good nick both in appearance and mechanicly this is no guarantee that the battery is in good condition. However they are the newer cobalt magnesium type that are pretty robust. If the seller is willing to write a guarantee of battery performance on the reciept you are covered.

Another is to ride it and listen for drive train noise. It will make a smooth drive noise when engaged but if you hear clicking or snapping noises, especially on gear changes, then the drive gear needs to be replaced or reversed. Both jobs take about 15 to 30 miutes to do. A new drive gear will be about £16 for a 9 or 11 tooth.

I can not speak for the Woosh bikes as I have never driven one.

 

[Vennwood]

Thanks for the info trex and Emo Rider. Yes that is the one. I've asked them about the battery as its two years old and I see from the BH web site that they have upgraded the battery from 8AH to 13.2AH

We won't be doing particularly long rides probably no more than 15 to 20 miles a time. One of the reasons for considering this particular BH is that its within viewing distance so can go and try it out. I gather that BH are a good make so thought it may last longer I would like the bigger/better battery as after two years it will not be producing full output and presumably won't last that much longer. I have asked for the price of a replacement battery but not yet had a reply and that may be the decider. The Giant Twist Freedom CS looks very similar - are they comparable?

 

[Emo Rider]

Thanks for the info trex and Emo Rider. Yes that is the one. I've asked them about the battery as its two years old and I see from the BH web site that they have upgraded the battery from 8AH to 13.2AH

We won't be doing particularly long rides probably no more than 15 to 20 miles a time. One of the reasons for considering this particular BH is that its within viewing distance so can go and try it out. I gather that BH are a good make so thought it may last longer I would like the bigger/better battery as after two years it will not be producing full output and presumably won't last that much longer. I have asked for the price of a replacement battery but not yet had a reply and that may be the decider. The Giant Twist Freedom CS looks very similar - are they comparable?

I had a look at the ad and I see it is being sold by a shop with a 14 days return policy. This a good thing

 

[Vennwood]

The dealer just got back to me with a price of £430 to £470 for a replacement battery so that would make it an expensive deal if I needed to replace it in the next few months. They also said it is possible to upgrade the battery if needed but I guess if 30 - 40 miles is available then probably no need to go to the extra expense.

Is there anyone else with experience or advice on the BH brand?

 

[mfj197]

If you look through the site you'll see quite a bit of ire aimed at BH. EddiePJ had one which if I recall correctly was off the road more often than it was on. Do a bit of searching and you'll find the reports.

Michael

 

[JohnCade]

If you look through the site you'll see quite a bit of ire aimed at BH. EddiePJ had one which if I recall correctly was off the road more often than it was on. Do a bit of searching and you'll find the reports.

Michael

Didn’t reflect well on their service but I think he hammers his bikes off road and some are not really meant for it. They just have the looks.

 

[mfj197]

Indeed, but he's not the only report. Kudos and LEBC have stopped selling them because of their poor service.

 

[D8ve]

Two BH Panasonic drives. Both batteries were running well one at 5 years old with over 75% battery life left the other at 3 years no noticeable loss. The Panasonic batteries go on and on. The bike will climb anything with a little effort.
One sold on and second destroyed by a 4*4 otherwise I would still be riding them.
Just go and try it out. You should be pleasantly surprised by the range and assist available. It's not a speed machine but a steady crusher. Expect silly long range on the flat if you use low power.

 

[Vennwood]

Thanks guys,

It certainly won't hurt to go and look but I really don't want to spend all my time fixing things (or paying out to get things fixed). I'll certainly troll through the posts to try and get a feel for things.

I'm not out for speed so a steady cruiser would work well especially if there is a good range. What about pedaling when the battery is flat?

 

[Emo Rider]

Thanks guys,

It certainly won't hurt to go and look but I really don't want to spend all my time fixing things (or paying out to get things fixed). I'll certainly troll through the posts to try and get a feel for things.

I'm not out for speed so a steady cruiser would work well especially if there is a good range. What about pedaling when the battery is flat?

They have an 8 speed mech and good original (continentals) quality tyres that make for an excellent unpowered ride. The riding position is very comfortable and adjustable. A test ride will tell the tale.

 

[Vennwood]

I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that its too risky buying a secondhand electric bike for a number of reasons. (unless you are sure of its pedigree) First of all the replacement batteries are very expensive that could easily turn a "good deal" into an expensive one. Another reason appears to be that the technology is changing all the time making 3 or 4 year old bikes pretty much obsolete in terms of weight, motors, controllers etc. New generations of batteries are getting better and better and (thankfully) prices of these new bikes are slowly coming down. What does this mean for me - well it does appear to make a £600 new bike with a reasonable spec a viable option so I'm back to the Woosh bikes. I've read good reports on here about them - can anyone add to these?

 

[trex]

...
Another reason appears to be that the technology is changing all the time making 3 or 4 year old bikes pretty much obsolete in terms of weight, motors, controllers etc. New generations of batteries are getting better and better and (thankfully) prices of these new bikes are slowly coming down.
...

agreed. The Haibike sDuro with Yamaha CD motor is a good example.
The Krieger is another.

 

[RobF]

I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that its too risky buying a secondhand electric bike for a number of reasons. (unless you are sure of its pedigree) First of all the replacement batteries are very expensive that could easily turn a "good deal" into an expensive one. Another reason appears to be that the technology is changing all the time making 3 or 4 year old bikes pretty much obsolete in terms of weight, motors, controllers etc. New generations of batteries are getting better and better and (thankfully) prices of these new bikes are slowly coming down. What does this mean for me - well it does appear to make a £600 new bike with a reasonable spec a viable option so I'm back to the Woosh bikes. I've read good reports on here about them - can anyone add to these?

You are correct that battery life - as in how many years it provides usable service - makes a second hand ebike a risky purchase.

But your assessment of the pace of change is way off the mark.

A three or four year old quality ebike, such as a Kalkhoff or most Bosch motored bikes, is not particularly inferior to a new one.

A bike of that age could be a good buy if the total price, including a new battery, was reasonable to you.

 

[Vennwood]

You are correct that battery life - as in how many years it provides usable service - makes a second hand ebike a risky purchase.

But your assessment of the pace of change is way off the mark.

A three or four year old quality ebike, such as a Kalkhoff or most Bosch motored bikes, is not particularly inferior to a new one.

A bike of that age could be a good buy if the total price, including a new battery, was reasonable to you.

Absolutely if the price with a new battery was reasonable. But from what I'm reading even the Kalkhoff is perhaps out of date just maybe not as much as some others and realistically they are not in my price range to start with. I checked up on the Krieger but discovered that their next batch, not due in until 5th May, is all sold out and there won't be any available until July. I thought this was going to be a minefield I just didn't realise how big a minefield. If the Krieger is out until July what would be a comparable bike?

 

[trex]

for your budget, there is no comparable bike to the krieger. This is because it has a bigger and more powerful motor than their other CD bikes, only their step through Santana-CD is fitted with the same motor and controller.

 

[flecc]

But from what I'm reading even the Kalkhoff is perhaps out of date

That's right, they have changed very substantially over that three or four years. At first with the Panasonic unit, then the earlier Kalkhoff Impulse crank unit, since then the latter has had a couple of substantial upgrades in that time making it now very different in both performance and gear changing facility.

And some of the Kalkhoff models were not crank drive, mostly using instead a rear hub direct drive motor or in one case a front wheel lower power hub motor.
.

 

[EddiePJ]

Indeed, but he's not the only report. Kudos and LEBC have stopped selling them because of their poor service.

It would appear that their poor attitude knows no bounds.

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/discounts-on-bikes-at-the-cycle-show.20067/#post-250942

.

 

[Vennwood]

for your budget, there is no comparable bike to the krieger. This is because it has a bigger and more powerful motor than their other CD bikes, only their step through Santana-CD is fitted with the same motor and controller.

Does anyone have any experience on reliability?