Bike for MS Sufferer

[Deleted member 4366]

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[Roberto Pirelli]

Hello everyone

My name is Bob from Lincoln. I was diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis five years ago and due to the rapid onset of my condition, had to give up a lot of adrenalin inducing activities (racing quads, motocross, snowboarding). I felt utterly miserable and that the felt that the prospect of being able to do anything fun was no longer possible.

Then I came across ebikes, and made a snap decision to purchase a Haibike 29er hard tail as it looked like a sporty mtb, so was still 'acceptable' looking to an (ex) adrenalin junkie.

I was very pleased I did as it gave me so much back that I thought I would never be able to do again. I love to be able to go out and do a few miles as it maintains functional ability in my legs (which are getting progressively weaker) and makes me feel more "normal"! My energy levels are also declining and fatigue is a problem, meaning that I have to plan my days carefully as my reserve is limited.

I live in a very rural area and nearly all of my riding is done on trails, farm tracks and bridle ways. For this reason I changed the Haibike for another but this time a 27.5 full sus with Yamaha power. The full sus is much better for my eyes, which can get blurry. It also has zero cadence support which has helped a little.

So (sorry to bore you with the background!) but here's the nub;

I am finding it increasingly difficult to set off although I am ok once up to speed AND need to take regular rest stops, which means more of the difficult stop starts. I need a range of 30 miles. Max speed 30mph.

I am therefore thinking that a throttle type Ebike would be a sensible choice. I have looked at kits, conversions already done, and complete ebikes. I am guessing that a 500w max should give me enough 'shove'. I could keep the Haibike and have a converted kit bike too? The options I have narrowed down so far are;


Bionx D500 KIT (expensive, availability?)

Oxydrive KIT

Dillinger KIT


BH emotion evo jumper 27.5 (no throttle)

wheeler e-falcon (bionx D500 motor, full sus) (price? Availability?)
Oxygen eMate mtb

If I went to just one bike it would have to be full sus. I prefer 27.5 wheels too. I'm only 5'6" and 62kg, so neither big nor heavy!
I would really appreciate any suggestions you might have to achieve the above objectives!

Many thanks and sorry for the rambling post!

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Personally, I'd keep away from Bionx. Everything is locked by software, so when things go wrong, which seems to be a lot, it'll be difficult and expensive to sort out.

From what you've said, I think the Oxygen MTB might be a good choice. It has a fair amount of torque and a top speed of about 24 mph (unrestricted) and it has a throttle to help you get started. It's good on the road and for light off-road use. For serious off-road stuff, I'd want a slower motor, but it might not be a problem for you because you don't weigh much.

For a kit, I'd go for the 750w 48v Bafang BBS01. You can always turn down the power if it's too much, but if you had a 250w one and found that the power was not eough, you'd be stuck. You should be able to get 30 mph out of one. For a battery, I'd get a 48v 09 bottle battery with branded cells. You can get them and the motor kit from Eclipsebikes or BMSBattery. For bumpy off road use, I'd add a third rivnut to your frame and strap the battery down with strong cable-ties.

For a donor bike, you can choose any FS MTB that takes your fancy, but it must have a standard 68mm bottom bracket and a triangle big enough for the battery. Hydraulic brakes would also be an advantage.

 

[Roberto Pirelli]

Thanks Dave, I'll have a look at those.

Do you know anything about the ARC electric bikes off road 1000w kits?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Big heavy direct drive motor. Great if you want an electric motorbike.

 

[Cyclezee]

Hi Bob,

An eZee Raptor would fit the bill although it has 26" wheels.
An alternative worth considering would be and eZee kit which you could have in any size wheel you prefer.

 

[shambolic]

Just shows, as I have discovered personally, the government's pronouncement that making the throttle illegal will not impact upon the disabled users is patently untrue.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

While I think about it, you can get a grant from the MS Society for an electric bike. IIRC at least two forum members got one. I think it's about £400.

 

[trex]

If you can't pedal, look for a bike that has '6mph starting aid', quite common if the bike has an LCD. Press and hold the down button about 3 seconds, the bike will start at traffic lights without pedalling - the motor will continue to run at 6mph until you squeeze the brakes.
After 1/1/2016, to comply with regulations, bikes with throttle activate the throttle after you pedal a bit. A quarter turn at the cranks would do on some bikes, others may require half turn to activate. You only have to turn the cranks a little bit every 15-20 seconds if you can't pedal.

 

[Cyclezee]

If you can't pedal, look for a bike that has '6mph starting aid', quite common if the bike has an LCD. Press and hold the down button about 3 seconds, the bike will start at traffic lights without pedalling - the motor will continue to run at 6mph until you squeeze the brakes.
After 1/1/2016, to comply with regulations, bikes with throttle activate the throttle after you pedal a bit. A quarter turn at the cranks would do on some bikes, others may require half turn to activate. You only have to turn the cranks a little bit every 15-20 seconds if you can't pedal.

Walk assist is normally limited to 6 Km/h.

 

[shambolic]

If you can't pedal, look for a bike that has '6mph starting aid', quite common if the bike has an LCD. Press and hold the down button about 3 seconds, the bike will start at traffic lights without pedalling - the motor will continue to run at 6mph until you squeeze the brakes.
After 1/1/2016, to comply with regulations, bikes with throttle activate the throttle after you pedal a bit. A quarter turn at the cranks would do on some bikes, others may require half turn to activate. You only have to turn the cranks a little bit every 15-20 seconds if you can't pedal.

Might help a few but not many with mobility issues. One thing is clear to me, nobody with mobility problems had any part in the decision to make throttles illegal. Most people with mobility issues that ride E-bikes have to stop pedaling from time to time either because of pain, limited muscle movement or tiredness. Often all three. Turning the crank then becomes unviable.

 

[trex]

I don't think the police would seize a bike belonging to an MS sufferrer for having a permanent throttle rather than a compliant one. If the bike comes from Woosh, it's just a matter of asking them to select the right program to load into the J-LCD.

 

[flecc]

One thing is clear to me, nobody with mobility problems had any part in the decision to make throttles illegal.

The DfT had a twelve week long consultation on the proposed law changes starting 5th January 2010 in which a number of us took part. Many of us made the points about the desirability and sometimes necessity of throttles and that included some of our disabled members, so they did have a say.

But there were others not always in the pedelec interest sector who had different views* which had to be considered, and the DfT also had a duty to conform as far as possible with EU vehicle law for the EU Commission to accept any variation.

In a later meeting the DfT expressed sympathy for the throttle lobby views.

However, a further complication came when the proposed EU's new type approval laws for two and three wheeled motor vehicles were announced, since they classed a throttle equipped e-bike as a motor vehicle type needing type approval.

Therefore the DfT's compromise is to accept the EU's pedelec law but at the same time say that they will consider a throttle equipped e-bike as a legal pedelec if it conforms in all other respects to EU pedelec law and has been type approved.

Ideally we need some of the e-bike suppliers to have some throttle equipped models type approved so that they can be legally sold as pedelecs, in the UK at least.

* The DfT's issued Summary of Responses from the consultation contained the following extract about Twist and Go:

EU rules require twist-and-go variants to comply with the same “construction standards” applied to low power mopeds. However, we do not apply the same “Registration or Use” rules that are commonplace for twist-and-go types in many other Member States (meaning they are not subject to registration, road tax, insurance, etc) and allow them to be used in GB as cycles.

Some respondents raised concerns about removing "twist and go" products from the EAPC rules – and treating them as motor vehicles. There were comments about the advantages this type of cycle offered - for example to the elderly who may have difficulty pedalling. There were suggestions to retain a limited twist and go function (e.g. up to 4 or 5 mph) to help riders get going, particularly for a hill start. There were also concerns that sales of EAPCs would fall if "twist and go" was prohibited, with people returning to more polluting forms of powered transport.

Others felt that fully harmonising with EU rules and in effect classifying a twist and go cycle as a moped was essential in order to ensure EAPCs were genuine pedal cycles and not simply electric mopeds fitted with pedals.
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[shambolic]

Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware of E-bikes and their usefulness to the disabled back in 2010 other wise I think I would have tried to stir up a disabled lobby. Sadly many people with mobility issues are unaware of the benefits of E-biking and so this great opportunity has passed by, a deluge of EU red tape rendering electric bikes useless to a large percentage of the disabled population. E-bikes as they were, not only enabled those who still have balance to get out and about but also provided much needed exercise if and when possible. I could go on and on about the benefits of E-biking to the health and mental well being of those with mobility problems. They may have consulted Disabled people but the actual decision was surely not made by someone who understood or cared about Mobility issues.

 

[flecc]

Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware of E-bikes and their usefulness to the disabled back in 2010 other wise I think I would have tried to stir up a disabled lobby.

Many of us were though, including our disabled members, and we raised the issues.

They may have consulted Disabled people

It's important to note that the DfT didn't select who they consulted. This was a pubicised open consultation for anyone to take part in. All respondents were asked to state the nature of their interest. In fact the number taking part wasn't very large, probably once again due to the usual apathy on such issues.

but the actual decision was surely not made by someone who understood or cared about Mobility issues.

I think that's a bit harsh, after all they have uniquely in Europe made provision for the disabled to have full-throttle equipped pedelecs. The need for type approval they could not avoid due to EU law, but that's easily dealt with by makers type approving some throttle equipped models.

So the mobility impaired UK user is not legally disadvantaged since they can have exactly the same bureacracy free e-bike status, with a throttle.

Whether makers supply such machines is not a matter for the DfT, as with all vehicle classes that's a matter for the market. If the demand is as great as you believe, there will be many makers only too willing to supply.
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[shambolic]

Sorry if I sounded a bit harsh but after more than two decades of dealing with half hearted efforts, such as ramps with doors at the top that open outwards or transport systems that claim to be accessible when they patently aren't, it would be nice if the decisions about impact upon disabled persons was actually made by someone with such an experience
I was thinking that the type approval would mean licenses and insurance, so thanks for clearing that up. My concern about the type approval is if it is solely for the disability market, a very large mark up will be placed on it. Look at anything in that market place and it is all overpriced inferior technology. I first went for an E-bike because a mobility buggy to similar although inferior spec would have been 6 times the price!

P.S.
I'm not saying the demand is great. I am saying there is very little knowledge of the benefits such bikes can bring to people with mobility issues. That would also be the reason why there was no great reaction to the consultation. It's a case of people catching on and they haven't yet. So it is too late as far as the straightforward non type approved bikes go.

 

[flecc]

Sorry if I sounded a bit harsh but after more than two decades of dealing with half hearted efforts, such as ramps with doors at the top that open outwards or transport systems that claim to be accessible when they patently aren't, it would be nice if the decisions about impact upon disabled persons was actually made by someone with such an experience

I agree, I've seen some examples of how inadequate disability measures can be, and it's clear that few designers and planners have disability issues in mind. Considering that over 6 million people in the UK are registered disabled, they really are missing a trick, and that's without considering those with minor disabilities that are not registered.

As far as e-bikes are concerned, we only need one maker/supplier to meet the need for a throttle-equipped type-approved model and others will probably follow. As we know in this forum, it's not only the disabled who ask for throttles, many fully fit UK riders want to keep them, so the market might well be rewarding for a supplier.
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[shemozzle999]

Unless the DfT can clearly define the limitations for use of the new "powered cycle class" I don't see how any dealer could commit to going down the type approval route yet.

Roberto, if you need an EAPC with a throttle I believe you have until the end of the year before they will be technically become illegal.

 

[flecc]

Unless the DfT can clearly define the limitations for use of the new "powered cycle class" I don't see how any dealer could commit to going down the type approval route yet.

They can't yet anyway since the new type approval law is beiung phased in in stages, January 2016 and January 2017, the first date being most relevant to us. However, there are promising elements in the draft, type L1e-A not requiring a space for a number plate, indicating registration etc not required.

Also it shouldn't be forgotten that usage is a national matter, unlike the construction and standards testing which is strictly an EU matter. The DfT's ruling on throttles for legal pedelecs may not be acceptable in other EU countries, but it can stand here. We were under a similar situation for two years regarding 250 watts, the law forbidding it but the police instructed not to prosecute.
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[shemozzle999]

Yes, it appears it is still all up in the air at the moment they have not even updated the government website advice on EAPCs.