Brexit, for once some facts.

vfr400

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There are definitely possibilities for two stroke, but I fear that it's too late to turn the tide for anything other than racing. With all the impending e-car releases and many more planned, electric is already firmly sealed for future road car use and will become commonplace within five years.
 
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flecc

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I suspect that their advantages over pure petrol in stop-go traffic and lots of very short hops might give them a bit more life yet.
The trouble is the way most have implemented PHEV hybrid. something buyers often don't realise until they've bought. Their electric side is very low powered, falling far short of true e-cars so losing most of the attraction. Put your foot down to join a traffic stream and the petrol engine joins in, even though you've selected e-power only. And the PHEV's small battery short range is a bind, circa 25 miles means plugging in and unplugging every time you've used it. I'm not even plugging my Leaf in at all some weeks.
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vfr400

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One for flecc.
I, ve been saying this for years. Mercury developed a 2 stroke years ago that could meet and surpass emissions, but in their infinite wisdom 2 stroke outboards were banned.
Hope MotoGP do same... Return to 2 strokes??? Or at least a mix
85kg and 85HP makes 1.0HP per kg. It should go (and stop) pretty well.
 
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flecc

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Very nice indeed. Sadly I doubt the authorities will bend now they've chosen their path, type approval rules can easily be used to kill off two stroke, no matter how clean it's made. Exhaust gases are only one pollutant, exhaust noise is another, particularly in urban areas.
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Barry Shittpeas

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I used to be the same (pottered around in a fiat 500). Then I noticed low mileage four year old tesla s's goes for under 30k. It not speed, it's torque/acceleration that's addictive
I want to be tempted by an electric car, but battery life concerns me. Battery replacement costs are huge and I can't make any economic case for owning such a car. My annual car mileage is quite low, so I shall monitor developments in the coming years.
 
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Danidl

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Hybrid is just not worth pursuing any more. The large new lineup of e-cars about to enter the market include many models that can be bought with genuine ranges from over 300 miles to 500 miles on some.

Add to that the ultra rapid charging adding another 200 miles in a 25 minute coffee break, which will be needed after 300 to 500 miles driving, and paying much more for a complex less reliable hybrid becomes pointless. In any case, just like plain ic cars, hybrids will be banned in most countries in a few years time.

Meanwhile BMW have stopped making their hybrid range extender I3 model, battery power only from now on.
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Electric cars are just not there for me yet..I wish it were otherwise. My trips to France typically require 350 miles journey through Ireland and then Western France,. Once there the electric car would be fine. Unless there was access on the boat ,..the number of chargers there are very limited, it just does not yet work.
 

Danidl

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I want to be tempted by an electric car, but battery life concerns me. Battery replacement costs are huge and I can't make any economic case for owning such a car. My annual car mileage is quite low, so I shall monitor developments in the coming years.
I suspect the economic case will come pretty soon. The current models, including the Leaf are very snazzy devices ,but soon there will be the equivalent of the Dacia Duster .. economy not style
 
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vfr400

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I ran 1278 miles, walked over 2100 miles and cycled 5798 miles last year. What did you do?
Hmmm!

An adult human gives out about 1.27kg of CO2 per day. Let's round it to 0.05kg per hour. Air breathed in has so little CO2 in it that as far as these calculations are concerned it's negligible.

When exercising, breathing increases to about 3 to 4 times the frequency but CO2 proportion stays the same. That means that you make, lets say, 0.125kg per hour extra CO2 per hour when exercising.

1278 miles running divided by say 10 mph = 128 hrs
2100 miles walking divided by say 3.5mph = 600hrs
5798 miles cycling divided by say 14mph = 414 hrs

That's 1142 hrs total x .125 = 142kg extra CO2 in the atmosphere because of your exercising.

In order to stop your body from wasting away, you have to eat a lot of extra food. In many cases extra CO2 is produced in the processing, manufacture and transport of that food as well.
 
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Danidl

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Electric cars are just not there for me yet..I wish it were otherwise. My trips to France typically require 350 miles journey through Ireland and then Western France,. Once there the electric car would be fine. Unless there was access on the boat ,..the number of chargers there are very limited, it just does not yet work.
It makes more sense both economically and environmentally to retain my 9 year old 130,000 mile Diesel indefinitely,until sometime major happens ,like a gearbox, and use the ebike for local use and the bus & trains for intercity
 

vfr400

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Very nice indeed. Sadly I doubt the authorities will bend now they've chosen their path, type approval rules can easily be used to kill off two stroke, no matter how clean it's made. Exhaust gases are only one pollutant, exhaust noise is another, particularly in urban areas.
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Presumably, it has passed all present EU regulations to be able to sell it in UK and the rest of EU.
 

Danidl

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Hmmm!

An adult human gives out about 1.27kg of CO2 per day. Let's round it to 0.05kg per hour.

When exercising, breathing increases to about 3 to 4 times the frequency but CO2 proportion stays the same. That means that you make, lets say, 0.125kg per hour extra CO2 per hour when exercising.

1278 miles running divided by say 10 mph = 128 hrs
2100 miles walking divided by say 3.5mph = 600hrs
5798 miles cycling divided by say 14mph = 414 hrs

That's 1142 hrs total x .125 = 142kg extra CO2 in the atmosphere because of your exercising.

In order to stop your body from wasting away, you have to eat a lot of extra food. In many cases extra CO2 is produced in the processing, manufacture and transport of that food as well.
Good on you.. this is the kind detailed information,you were famous for back in the day.
 

Barry Shittpeas

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Jan 1, 2020
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Hmmm!

An adult human gives out about 1.27kg of CO2 per day. Let's round it to 0.05kg per hour.

When exercising, breathing increases to about 3 to 4 times the frequency but CO2 proportion stays the same. That means that you make, lets say, 0.125kg per hour extra CO2 per hour when exercising.

1278 miles running divided by say 10 mph = 128 hrs
2100 miles walking divided by say 3.5mph = 600hrs
5798 miles cycling divided by say 14mph = 414 hrs

That's 1142 hrs total x .125 = 142kg extra CO2 in the atmosphere because of your exercising.

In order to stop your body from wasting away, you have to eat a lot of extra food. In many cases extra CO2 is produced in the processing, manufacture and transport of that food as well.
Running at 10 mph! I wish. More like 8 mph on a good day.

But think of the saving the NHS and Fire Brigade are making because they don't have to use specialist equipment to get me out of the house when I'm being taken to hospital have my legs sawn off due to obesity & diabetes related complications.
 

vfr400

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It makes more sense both economically and environmentally to retain my 9 year old 130,000 mile Diesel indefinitely,until sometime major happens ,like a gearbox,
or until your local council decides to ban its use, like what is proposed in Birmingham and Bristol.
 

flecc

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I want to be tempted by an electric car, but battery life concerns me. Battery replacement costs are huge and I can't make any economic case for owning such a car. My annual car mileage is quite low, so I shall monitor developments in the coming years.
Batteries have proved to be not a problem, lasting far longer than initially expected. They use large lower density cells that dont suffer the stresses that the high density cells we have in our e-bikes do. I confidently expect to be driving on my original battery in ten years time if I'm still driving then.

I'm also a low mileage driver with no economic case for buying an e-car, but the case for it in many other ways is overwhelming. It's only when using one all the time that the sheer superiority in heavy traffic conditions is realised. The tractability and control together with very rapid acceleration when needed, and all in relaxing silence with the motor doing all the routine braking when lifting off is very addictive.

And 200 mpg equivalent running cost on night rate electricity is not to be sniffed at, nor the miniscule servicing costs and far superior reliability,

I've been wanting a e-car since before they existed, knowing the potential, but finally in 2018 one affordable one reached the potential to satisfy my needs. And like most e-car drivers, I never want to own an ic car again.
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vfr400

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Running at 10 mph! I wish. More like 8 mph on a good day.

But think of the saving the NHS and Fire Brigade are making because they don't have to use specialist equipment to get me out of the house when I'm being taken to hospital have my legs sawn off due to obesity & diabetes related complications.
Feel free to adjust any of the figures so that we can get a more accurate estimate. When we have a figure that we agree on, I can report you to Greta Thunberg to see what countermeasure or punishment she reccomends.

A fully grown leafy tree absorbs about 100kg of CO2 per year, so I reckon you need to plant at least 4 in your garden to make a reasonable countermeasure, but its going to be 10 years before you get to par. The trouble is, according to Extinction Rebellion, that's too late.
 
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flecc

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Electric cars are just not there for me yet..I wish it were otherwise. My trips to France typically require 350 miles journey through Ireland and then Western France,. Once there the electric car would be fine. Unless there was access on the boat ,..the number of chargers there are very limited, it just does not yet work.
True for Andy-mat too, and Woosh who needs to drive to France. But you are part of minority groups. Most drivers don't have such needs or do these longer journeys. Average male mileage in the UK is some 9000 miles, average female mileage under 6000 miles. Clearly half covering less than those rarely if ever do a really long trip.

I'd say over a half of all UK drivers could go electric now with a home charging point and without any inconvenience. Certainly I've found it far easier than I expected, even with the odd 140 mile each way runs to my brother's home in Dorset.
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flecc

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Presumably, it has passed all present EU regulations to be able to sell it in UK and the rest of EU.
At present yes, and the future for motorbikes isn't settled yet.

But the national bans on new ic sales begin with Norway in 2025, followed at intervals by other countries. Norway is already at over 50% of all new registrations being electric. That will be the problem from some date, not being able to register for use when buying new.
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Zlatan

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True for Andy-mat too, and Woosh who needs to drive to France. But you are part of minority groups. Most drivers don't have such needs or do these longer journeys. Average male mileage in the UK is some 9000 miles, average female mileage under 6000 miles. Clearly half covering less than those rarely if ever do a really long trip.

I'd say over a half of all UK drivers could go electric now with a home charging point and without any inconvenience. Certainly I've found it far easier than I expected, even with the odd 140 mile each way runs to my brother's home in Dorset.
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Its not just range flecc its lugging abilty. How many folk tow vans, boats, need vans for storage of motorbikes, windsurf kit, campervans etc etc.
I cant envisage any current electric vehicle that would replicate our camper van, full of windsurf kit and often doing 200mile plus journeys???(and annual France trip)
Got a mate who has tried towing a ski boat with a Tesla S.... Doesnt really work and I dont think his vehicle has passed matruculation for towing. I know a few have but cant see any having a workable range with 1.5 tonnes behind them.???
Yes, tow vehicles are available (Tesla model X, Porsche Cayenne Hybrid) but cant ever see electric large camper vans anytime soon.
 
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flecc

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Its not just range flecc its lugging abilty. How many folk tow vans, boats, need vans for storage of motorbikes, windsurf kit, campervans etc etc.
I cant envisage any current electric vehicle that would replicate our camper van, full of windsurf kit and often doing 200mile plus journeys???

But still a small minority though, the vast majority of cars aren't even equipped with a tow bar so never tow anything. We don't need everyone to dash into buying a e-car and couldn't supply them if they did. As long as enough are there to buy every one we can make, that's enough for the present.

But towing is coming anyway and will be here before we run out of e-car buyers. As you know Tesla's model X already does tow, and their new Cybertruck pickup just announced tows better than any car I know of. In three different versions it can be chosen to tow from 2.5 tons up to over 6 tons on the top model, all available with a 500 mile range option. Towing 6 tons for 500 miles with 2.9 seconds to 60 (when not towing hopefully) should satisfy just about anyone!
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mike killay

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Its not just range flecc its lugging abilty. How many folk tow vans, boats, need vans for storage of motorbikes, windsurf kit, campervans etc etc.
I cant envisage any current electric vehicle that would replicate our camper van, full of windsurf kit and often doing 200mile plus journeys???(and annual France trip)
Got a mate who has tried towing a ski boat with a Tesla S.... Doesnt really work and I dont think his vehicle has passed matruculation for towing. I know a few have but cant see any having a workable range with 1.5 tonnes behind them.???
Yes, tow vehicles are available (Tesla model X, Porsche Cayenne Hybrid) but cant ever see electric large camper vans anytime soon.
But, I suspect that camper-vans etc. are only a small proportion of the vehicles on the roads and could be exempted. Most vehicles are cars and changing all of them to electric will achieve the requirements for clean air etc.
 
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