Brexit, for once some facts.

[jonathan.agnew]

Or Death certificate?

Truss' lead has increased since she proposed regional levelling down

Second poll shows Liz Truss extending lead over Rishi Sunak as pair prepare for Sky News' Battle for Number 10

The new survey of Conservative Party members by ConservativeHome found Ms Truss is most likely to become the next prime minister - with 58% of those asked backing her.

news.sky.com

There's something very wrong with conservative party members. Polite version of ' once a mistake twice a decision three times not forgiven' (viz boris brexit then truss) comes to mind. Being dead would probably be an improvement.

 

[Woosh]

Truss' lead has increased since she proposed regional levelling down

Second poll shows Liz Truss extending lead over Rishi Sunak as pair prepare for Sky News' Battle for Number 10

The new survey of Conservative Party members by ConservativeHome found Ms Truss is most likely to become the next prime minister - with 58% of those asked backing her.

news.sky.com

There's something very wrong with conservative party members. Polite version of ' once a mistake twice a decision three times not forgiven' (viz boris brexit then truss) comes to mind. Being dead would probably be an improvement.

most important for tory membership is less taxes. On this, Truss is on message.
If I were to advise Sunak, only a pledge of increasing inheritance tax threshold to 1M in tonight Sky Leaders Debate would improve his chances.
I saw Truss decidedly more careful with words in yesterday's husting (Cardiff).

 

[oyster]

Truss' lead has increased since she proposed regional levelling down

Second poll shows Liz Truss extending lead over Rishi Sunak as pair prepare for Sky News' Battle for Number 10

The new survey of Conservative Party members by ConservativeHome found Ms Truss is most likely to become the next prime minister - with 58% of those asked backing her.

news.sky.com

There's something very wrong with conservative party members. Polite version of ' once a mistake twice a decision three times not forgiven' (viz boris brexit then truss) comes to mind. Being dead would probably be an improvement.

My mother probably always voted tory. Despite having a disdainful opinion of the long-term local tory MP. Never even considering joining any party. Was incensed as some governemnt decisions that affected her. Having a second husband who could be quite forceful about some issues such as striking and appeared almost left-wing.

I think she looked at Labour as fomenting strikes, which were always the fault of the unions. Never seemed to see that at least some were very well-justified. Still less that the tories have a long history of encouraging strikes to excuse whatever it was they intended to do.

Not for one minute am I saying that Labour has always done the right things. Nor, despite current appearances, that tories have absolutely always got everything wrong.

 

[jonathan.agnew]

My mother probably always voted tory. Despite having a disdainful opinion of the long-term local tory MP. Never even considering joining any party. Was incensed as some governemnt decisions that affected her. Having a second husband who could be quite forceful about some issues such as striking and appeared almost left-wing.

I think she looked at Labour as fomenting strikes, which were always the fault of the unions. Never seemed to see that at least some were very well-justified. Still less that the tories have a long history of encouraging strikes to excuse whatever it was they intended to do.

Not for one minute am I saying that Labour has always done the right things. Nor, despite current appearances, that tories have absolutely always got everything wrong.

I blame the first past the post system for creating unnatural dichotomies, polarised views, oppositions. But get where you're coming from, I disagree, fundamentally, with corbyn about ukraine but despair about the harm conservative and neoconservative foreign policy has done over the past 30 years

 

[flecc]

I disagree, fundamentally, with corbyn about ukraine

I totally agree with Corbyn on this subject. It was Western interference, namely the USA, that created the inevitability of this future war two decades ago.

The blame for it lies entirely in the west, as does its prolongation now.
.

 

[oyster]

I blame the first past the post system for creating unnatural dichotomies, polarised views, oppositions. But get where you're coming from, I disagree, fundamentally, with corbyn about ukraine but despair about the harm conservative and neoconservative foreign policy has done over the past 30 years

There is a fundamental misunderstanding about voting, about majorities, about decision making.

We saw so very clearly that the wafer-thin brexit referendum was against the views of so many. But the ones who got slightly more votes acted as if the 48.1% who didn't vote for brexit were worthless and their views entirely to be disregarded.

What should happen is that whoever is in power should seek to minimise the trampling of the views of anyone. Obviously that is in many ways ludicrously optimistic and unrealistic. But sometimes a government has taken good decisions which have later been appreciated across the spectrum.

 

[Woosh]

decisions that are good to everyone are rarer than hen's teeth. People have to choose between lower taxes and bad public services or better public services and higher taxes.
This country's natural instinct is a selfish one whereas in most of Europe, it's more socialist.

 

[flecc]

This country's natural instinct is a selfish one whereas in most of Europe, it's more socialist.

A legacy of Empire, hundreds of years of getting our own way by force, breeding a wholly unjustified superiority complex.

The USA suffers the same from a much shorter period of control.
.

 

[flecc]

Oh goody. The Bank of England forecasts we will be in recession by the end of the year and that will continue thoughout the whole of 2023.
.

 

[Woosh]

I watched the Truss/Sunak show on sky last night. The audience was given a voting device, press 1 for Sunak, 2 for Truss. Sky told the audience that the computer crashed so no electronic result. The audience was then asked to vote by a show of hand.
I reckon about 15% of the audience voted for Truss. Later, various pro Truss commentators, especially Kwasi Kwarteng (for Truss) portrayed Sunak as 'slick' as if it's a fault.
I wondered if Sky tried to help Sunak.

'Nightmare' for Liz Truss as Rishi Sunak mounts fightback in TV leadership clash

Tory leadership hopefuls Liz Truss and Rishi Sunak endured a tough grilling over the plans for Government in a Sky News clash. The Mirror's Ben Glaze looks at how they fared.

www.mirror.co.uk

 

[GLJoe]

What should happen is that whoever is in power should ...

 

[oyster]

How can Sunak be blaming Labour policies for distribution of funding (to inner cities rather than Tunbridge Wells)? Hasn't been a Labour government since 11 May 2010.

Be blaming the Whigs soon.

 

[flecc]

How can Sunak be blaming Labour policies for distribution of funding (to inner cities rather than Tunbridge Wells)? Hasn't been a Labour government since 11 May 2010.

And that was New (pseudo) Labour, often more Tory than Labour.

The last Labour government was replaced by Thatcher's Tories in 1979, some 43 years ago. And that Labour government didn't control funding since the UK was under the economic control of the IMF.
.

 

[wheeler]

How can Sunak be blaming Labour policies for distribution of funding (to inner cities rather than Tunbridge Wells)? Hasn't been a Labour government since 11 May 2010.

Be blaming the Whigs soon.

Surprised it wasn't the SNP given the blame.

 

[Woosh]

How can Sunak be blaming Labour policies for distribution of funding (to inner cities rather than Tunbridge Wells)? Hasn't been a Labour government since 11 May 2010.

Be blaming the Whigs soon.

Sunak was referring to the Treasury Green Book, sort of bible that sets out the rules how money should be divved up to the towns and regions.
The Green Book was issued in 2013 so he is technically correct in saying the rules were made by Labour or Gordon Brown.

 

[oyster]

The Green Book was issued in 2013 so he is technically correct in saying the rules were made by Labour or Gordon Brown.

But that was well into the Cameron–Clegg coalition - and if well over a decade hasn't been enough to decide changes are needed, and make them, it is squarely a tory issue.

 

[oyster]

Surprised it wasn't the SNP given the blame.

Don't worry, they'll blame cyclists next.

Oh! They have:

RECKLESS CYCLISTS FACE JAIL CRACKDOWN

(Daily Mail front page last night - might have changed by now.) Something might need to be done but the number of deaths caused by cyclists is still pretty low (about 2.5 per year according to some sources, 7 from others). Looks like diversionary tactics by Shapps. Again.

He hits out at ‘a selfish minority’ of aggressive riders and says the overhaul is needed to ‘impress on cyclists the real harm they can cause when speed is combined with lack of care’. Under his proposal, a new law of causing death by dangerous cycling would be included in the Transport Bill, due before Parliament in the autumn.

The claim is only that it will have an impact on cyclists' minds. Not that it will reduce the rate of deaths and serious injuries.

And it only makes a real difference when the cyclist is not charged with, or is found not guilty of, manslaughter, and it drops down to furious cycling. The possibility of a manslaughter charge should already be impressed on these cyclists. If it isn't, I don't see this measure having a beneficial effect other than as retributive justice.

 

[Woosh]

But that was well into the Cameron–Clegg coalition - and if well over a decade hasn't been enough to decide changes are needed, and make them, it is squarely a tory issue.

it was revised in 2022. Sunak wants to claim ownership.
The Green Book (2022) - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

 

[Woosh]

Tide may be turning for sunak. Liam Fox was on TV telling tory members that we are paying 85 billion in interest payment this year, twice the defense budget. Is it wise to borrow much more? At the same time, Truss said on TV that inflation is set to drop later this year.
She should change her economic adviser soonest.

 

[flecc]

At the same time, Truss said on TV that inflation is set to drop later this year.
She should change her economic adviser soonest.

I'd rather she didn't, since I'm sure she would be a disastrous PM, so better not elected.
.