Cycling Industry Bubble Burst

[saneagle]

Cheap bikes can't be that bad. According to this, the migrants choose the cheap ones to cycle all the way form Russia to Norway. Not too many Trek, Cannondale and Specialized here. It's a shame that they can't get hold of that pile of unwanted bikes from China. On a journey that long, surely it wouldn't be too much trouble to make a small diversion through China. Who's going to tell them?

Bike shortage stems flow of migrants using Arctic route to Europe

People seeking asylum in Norway have taken to using bicycles to cross the border from Russia because pedestrian traffic is banned

www.telegraph.co.uk

I just noticed in that picture, they don't even use saddles. I must salute them for that.

Even better, I just noticed in this one that they don't even use brakes. How do they stop when going over the mountains in Norway? They're pretty steep last time I looked.

Taking the Arctic route: migrants cycle from Russia to Norway

Cycling from Russia to Norway is a recently-discovered route asylum seekers are using to reach the border-free Schengen Zone. Taxi drivers say they

www.euronews.com

Is it possible that these two authoritative and trusted sources have just grabbed a load of old bikes from the tip and are telling porkies about them, are these refugees real hard men or is it that cheap bikes are so good that you don't need brakes and saddles? I'm going for the latter. What do you think?

 

[Bonzo Banana]

Good for you.

Best make a start on these then.View attachment 55877

Pretty sure that is Chinese hire bikes for schemes that borrowed huge money and then went bankrupt with bikes left all over cities they were gathered up and dumped as per the image. I suspect hire bikes in China don't need the strength of European and US hire bikes as we are heavier people but generally hire bikes are fantastically long life designs. Reminds me of those old post office bikes by Pashley. Some of those have done phenomenal miles and still got refurbished as Elephant bikes and also shipped off to countries where cycling transforms lives. An example of bike designed for long term use for decades is the Buffalo bike. Also Halford's Re-cycle charity of bikes for Africa are typically simple high tensile steel bikes without suspension. As shown in this image;

The sort of bikes re-cycle can't send to Africa are typically so called quality bikes with weak non durable frames and short life, light weight components or carbon fibre parts as shown below. Bikes easily damaged and expensive or time consuming to maintain. I think performance bikes have always had issues of durability. Even in the past the high quality steel frames had butted tubes which meant some of the tubing was much thinner where as the basic steel frames had plain gauge tubes. The thin sections of butted tubes were far more dangerous after a few years because corrosion would really effect those thin sections of tubes where as plain gauge tubes could still be strong despite surface layer rust. I'm a huge believer in steel as a frame material and some amazing quality robot welded frames which are phosphate dipped for corrosion protection come from the better Chinese factories for only $5 factory door price or perhaps a little more. That $5 price was from around 2013 so could be $6-8 now. That price is because not only very cheap to make with very cheap materials and huge economies of scale as most bike sold in the world are still steel but almost no returns or quality issues at all practically such is the refinement and advancement in steel frame manufacturing. The material is easily recyclable too no need to landfill. Steel has the most advanced manufacturing processes with the greatest degree of automation.

Buy a Bike - Re-Cycle

We often receive bikes that are unsuitable for Africa, but which we can sell to fund our work. Bikes like racing bikes or bikes with complex parts wouldn't

re-cycle.org

 

[Az.]

I just noticed in that picture, they don't even use saddles. I must salute them for that.

Even better, I just noticed in this one that they don't even use brakes. How do they stop when going over the mountains in Norway? They're pretty steep last time I looked.

I didn't read it all, but as I understand the articles, migrants don't use bicycles to travel from China to Norway. They just use cheap bikes to cross the border as pedestrian traffic is banned. They exploit the loophole. Don't need saddle or brakes for that.

 

[flecc]

I didn't read it all, but as I understand the articles, migrants don't use bicycles to travel from China to Norway. They just use cheap bikes to cross the border as pedestrian traffic is banned. They exploit the loophole. Don't need saddle or brakes for that.

China to Norway, almost 7000 kilometres. They'd need saddles and brakes for that, and a whole lot more .

I think you mean Russia to Norway, they have a leaky common border in the far north so no distance at all.
.

 

[Az.]

China to Norway, almost 7000 kilometres. They'd need saddles and brakes for that, and a whole lot more .

I think you mean Russia to Norway, they have a leaky common border in the far north so no distance at all.
.

I meant they don't travel on bikes. They cross the border on bikes.

People seeking asylum in Norway have taken to using bicycles to cross the border from Russia because pedestrian traffic is banned

 

[flecc]

I meant they don't travel on bikes. They cross the border on bikes.

The Russia - Norway border. Thats what the article linked to by Saneagle is speaking of:

Link
.

 

[Az.]

The Russia - Norway border. Thats what the article linked to by Saneagle is speaking of:

Link
.

Point of origin of migrants is irrelevant. The point is bikes on pictures are not used to travel over any long distances. Somebody is selling them on a border to migrants so they could cross the border not as pedestrians.
They are stripped of anything of value

 

[saneagle]

I meant they don't travel on bikes. They cross the border on bikes.

How do they get to Norway? Did they walk or bus?

 

[Az.]

How do they get to Norway? Did they walk or bus?

How would I know? Trains? Busses? But they can't get on foot to Norway as they are unwanted. Norway closed border for all pedestrians and migrants just try to find way around.

 

[flecc]

How would I know? Trains? Busses? But they can't get on foot to Norway as they are unwanted. Norway closed border for all pedestrians and migrants just try to find way around.

If you finished reading the article you'd know it was the Russia - Norway border and how leaky it is with the Norwegian police unable to cope with the number of migrants crossing each year.

No mention of China.
.

 

[AndyBike]

shipped off to countries where cycling transforms lives. An example of bike designed for long term use for decades is the Buffalo bike. Also Halford's Re-cycle charity of bikes for Africa are typically simple high tensile steel bikes without suspension. As shown in this image;

The sort of bikes re-cycle can't send to Africa are typically so called quality bikes with weak non durable frames and short life, light weight components or carbon fibre parts as shown below. Bikes easily damaged and expensive or time consuming to maintain. I think performance bikes have always had issues of durability. Even in the past the high quality steel frames had butted tubes which meant some of the tubing was much thinner where as the basic steel frames had plain gauge tubes. The thin sections of butted tubes were far more dangerous after a few years because corrosion would really effect those thin sections of tubes where as plain gauge tubes could still be strong despite surface layer rust. I'm a huge believer in steel as a frame material and some amazing quality robot welded frames which are phosphate dipped for corrosion protection come from the better Chinese factories for only $5 factory door price or perhaps a little more. That $5 price was from around 2013 so could be $6-8 now. That price is because not only very cheap to make with very cheap materials and huge economies of scale as most bike sold in the world are still steel but almost no returns or quality issues at all practically such is the refinement and advancement in steel frame manufacturing. The material is easily recyclable too no need to landfill. Steel has the most advanced manufacturing processes with the greatest degree of automation.

Buy a Bike - Re-Cycle

We often receive bikes that are unsuitable for Africa, but which we can sell to fund our work. Bikes like racing bikes or bikes with complex parts wouldn't

re-cycle.org

Many of the bikes sent to Africa are recycled in the way of placing them in an ever burning bonfire which strips them of any plastic parts and paint, so the bare frames can be melted down for the valuable metal they contain.

You didn't think they actually ride them did you ?

 

[saneagle]

Many of the bikes sent to Africa are recycled in the way of placing them in an ever burning bonfire which strips them of any plastic parts and paint, so the bare frames can be melted down for the valuable metal they contain.

You didn't think they actually ride them did you ?

EU sends a lot of plastic to Africa too, where it is mainly dumped. It's the stuff you put in your recycling bin. Only now are new plants being set up to burn it in UK.

EU dumps 37 million ‘junk plastic’ clothing items in Kenya every year

The clothing is too dirty or damaged to be reused and immediately becomes plastic waste.

www.euronews.com

 

[FastFreddy2]

Surely the reason the cycle industry is in so much trouble, is the three pronged attack on profits?

Possibly a box shifter (bike shifter) like Evans could make money if it had kept the stock it advertised? Rather like Halfords today, you pretty much buy online and collect in store. Both want/wanted you to buy the bike and then refuse to accept it in store if it didn't fit or you didn't like it.

I'm going back a long time (25 years) and I can remember driving into London to the peruse the two Evans stores by Waterloo station. IIRC road bikes directly opposite the station, offroad stuff a couple of hundred yards around the corner. There were oodles of bikes to look at and try. It was where buyers went, to buy a bike. While there, the range of clothing and accessories so tempting I doubt I ever left without spending money on something.

Move on 25 years years, where do I go to try a bike I might to buy, without first buying it? At the moment, Go Outdoors, which might explain why I have two of their £950+ bikes here. What else has changed? Two important and related aspects of the industry.

Firstly, YouTube will show you, often in great detail, how to do your own maintenance. Keeping a bike "roadworthy", assuming it got used enough to need maintaining (many don't) must have knocked a great hole in the usual income stream of most LBS's. The other side of the same coin forming the second part of this issue, is the availability of cheap parts, fuelled by Ebay and Amazon/Chinazon. It's worse for LBS because they don't have the spending power of the internet box shifters like ChainReaction/Wiggle/Merlin/Tredz, but even the big box shifters can't compete on price when up against Chinese imports. How is that not possible? Why can't UK box shifter compete?

Last year I bought some Chinese made (aren't they all) air forks for £85 delivered. At 1.8kg and that price, there was nothing to compete with it in the UK cycle industry. The next nearest thing I could find was some 10+ year old new/old stock of air forks, but they were £115 and weighed 2.6kg with no rebound control unlike the £85 pair.

I'm looking to buy a set of 3 x 9 STI shifters, and a 9 speed rear derailleur. Both half the price (ish) delivered from an Ebay source, than from a box shifter. I'm also in the market for a 100ml measuring jug. The carriage alone from a UK supplier, is higher than the cost of one delivered from China via Ebay. [Obviously, the Chinese government is buying UK/US/Aus currency.]

With little choice of "affordable" bikes carried in stock for buyers to take home, and accessories/upgrades cheaper from Chinese front ends that look like UK/US retail outlets, what is the incentive to buy local, or for that matter, buy at all? For example....

Almost 20 years ago my partner walked into a bike shop, looked at the colour of a £150 Raleigh, sat on it, and said, "I'll buy it." At the shops suggestion, she spent another £30 on a (ahemm) slightly wider saddle. That bike was bought, because it was there. It was used every working day for 3 years to ride the 5 mile each way journey to work and back. Currently, a neighbour uses the same bike each day for her 2 mile each way journey to work and back. Extraordinary value for money.

Where could I walk into a store now, and walk out with a similar product? If it's not there, how can I buy it? Parts cheaper from China, and how to fit them via YT. What chance has the UK cycle industry got?


Edited for typo.

 

[saneagle]

How would I know? Trains? Busses? But they can't get on foot to Norway as they are unwanted. Norway closed border for all pedestrians and migrants just try to find way around.

One thing I can tell you. they didn't use those bikes that have no saddles and brakes depicted in the links above. That's just fake news.

You don't see streams of thousands of migrants hitch-hiking their way across Europe. Somebody puts them on a bus and drops them at the border. After that, maybe one or two enterprising ones stole some bikes and sneaked across, but most of them are given instructions and dropped off at the points where they can just walk a short distance into Norway and the Norwegian government is too embarassed to admit that they just let them through, so they make up excuses, like our boarder patrols bring them into Dover

 

[AndyBike]

After that, maybe one or two enterprising ones stole some bikes and sneaked across,

A good way of blending in by looking different to the other migrants. Top marks and commendations.

boarder patrols

Were they caught out of bed and roaming the dorms ?

 

[Bonzo Banana]

Many of the bikes sent to Africa are recycled in the way of placing them in an ever burning bonfire which strips them of any plastic parts and paint, so the bare frames can be melted down for the valuable metal they contain.

You didn't think they actually ride them did you ?

Yes of course they use them. Buffalo bikes are huge sellers in Africa although admittedly have some subsidy I think. I've seen bikes in Africa in various reports and you have people on incredibly old bikes sometimes. The value of a bike is far higher obviously than the scrap value of high tensile steel. It's like saying they will melt down a working car or motorcycle to get $10 of high tensile steel scrap value. I guess if any charity is stupid enough to send more premium aluminium bikes which may not be economic to repair or the frame has cracked and can't be welded then they would be scrapped. China still sells huge number of basic steel bikes into Africa. These charity schemes only provide a small percentage of bikes Africa needs.