cyclotricity stealth 1000w will not de-restrict

[denedw6]

Hi new to this so you may have to go slow,
I have a cyclotricity stealth 1000w. The problem is i like to take my bike through the woods and along woodland paths.
I have the de-restrict codes and they were working fine, now i seem to have a problem that when i try to change the codes back (for road use) the code goes in but it then puts out a max speed of 24.2MPH. that would not be a problem in its self i could live with what but when i de-restrict back to trail use it is still going 24.2MPH (when it should go 30ish). This is on a stand when turning the peddles and the thumb throttle(so no weight or road grip).
The worrying bit is i can put the bike on the ground use the thumb throttle and can hold the bike stationary cutting out the motor (could never do that before).
a little worried the motor on the wheel is giving up.
If anyone has some suggestions of what to try (please remember i am quite new to this)
I did change the battery and carrier (for the same spec)
brakes are good and new(ish)
and i put on a new thumb throttle
apart for new handle bar grips and a bell these are the only modifications.

Thanks

 

[sjpt]

The problem is people illegally using woodland paths on a motorbike.

 

[saneagle]

Hi new to this so you may have to go slow,
I have a cyclotricity stealth 1000w. The problem is i like to take my bike through the woods and along woodland paths.
I have the de-restrict codes and they were working fine, now i seem to have a problem that when i try to change the codes back (for road use) the code goes in but it then puts out a max speed of 24.2MPH. that would not be a problem in its self i could live with what but when i de-restrict back to trail use it is still going 24.2MPH (when it should go 30ish). This is on a stand when turning the peddles and the thumb throttle(so no weight or road grip).
The worrying bit is i can put the bike on the ground use the thumb throttle and can hold the bike stationary cutting out the motor (could never do that before).
a little worried the motor on the wheel is giving up.
If anyone has some suggestions of what to try (please remember i am quite new to this)
I did change the battery and carrier (for the same spec)
brakes are good and new(ish)
and i put on a new thumb throttle
apart for new handle bar grips and a bell these are the only modifications.

Thanks

The code gives access to the settings. Did you actually change the speed limit to 15 mph and save it?

It's all a bit moot anyway because your motor is illegal. The police look mainly for 3 things to seize your bike. 1. Independent throttle. 2. Speed displayed over 15.5 mph. 3. Motor power. If you're good at blagging, you might get away with it if 1 & 2 are OK.

 

[denedw6]

Wow
If you really need me to explain.
sjpt
The woodland is private so it is not a public path and I use the bike in my work.
sanegle
Thank you yes I did change the speed to 15mph But that is the point. It does not matter what I change it too it still goes the same speed.
As for the police stopping bikes that is why I (try) to change it if I need to go on any roads.
Also go to any large town or built up area and watch Deliveroo etc. riders, no way there bikes are standard and not once have i seen them stopped by the police, not even when they are weaving through traffic/jumping lights/riding on footpaths or going the wrong way through traffic.

Thought I may get some genuine help but all I get is criticism and people telling me laws I all ready know and because of those laws why I wanted the help.

 

[saneagle]

Wow
If you really need me to explain.
sjpt
The woodland is private so it is not a public path and I use the bike in my work.
sanegle
Thank you yes I did change the speed to 15mph But that is the point. It does not matter what I change it too it still goes the same speed.
As for the police stopping bikes that is why I (try) to change it if I need to go on any roads.
Also go to any large town or built up area and watch Deliveroo etc. riders, no way there bikes are standard and not once have i seen them stopped by the police, not even when they are weaving through traffic/jumping lights/riding on footpaths or going the wrong way through traffic.

Thought I may get some genuine help but all I get is criticism and people telling me laws I all ready know and because of those laws why I wanted the help.

Do you know which controller and LCD you have?

Is this what you set to re-restrict?

To restrict the motor back to the 250W mode, please set the parameters to the following:

P1=46
P2=0
P3=1
P4=0
P5=15
P6= anything other than 99

 

[denedw6]

saneagle
That`s the one I have, but if I change P6 from 99 to any other number the it does not change, stays at 24.4 MPH. not matter how many times i try.
Again i can use the thumb throttle stand at the side of the bike and i can stop the bike from moving with not much effort (not trying to pull a wheely).
I got this horrible feeling the rear motor is on its way out. But that should not make a problem to the controller. If the controller is breaking down then why can i hold the motor back. that`s why i posted on here to see if there was an easy fix or anyone else has come across the same problem.

controller and lcd are standard from cylotricity never been changed.

I have contacted them and all they said was put the old parts that I changed back on (like i kept them)
Thanks anyway

 

[matthewslack]

Not many private woodlands have paths good enough for bike riding unless those paths are publicly accessible, and even fewer are large enough to ride at speed for more than a few seconds!

If you are above board, fine. Most are not.

 

[denedw6]

What you think I do or don`t do through my own private woods (is that what you wanted)
not really the point of the thread.

 

[StuartsProjects]

Thought I may get some genuine help but all I get is criticism and people telling me laws I all ready know and because of those laws why I wanted the help

Well because of the laws, riding the 1000W bike on the road, in the UK, is illegal, 'restricting' the power output or speed will not make it road legal.

If you want it road legal then change the motor for one that is rated at 250W.

 

[denedw6]

Again I know what the law is.
Under the guide on this page at the bottom it states in the first paragraph
electric bikes that have powered assistance to a maximum of 25 km/h (15.5 mph) using a motor of no more than 250 Watts (maximum continuous rated power)
I am trying to get it turned down so it is at 250watts now if I can turn it up or down that is not maximum continuous rated power.
but again not the point of the thread.
I have a genuine problem with my bike if i take it on the road or not.
thought i may get some help here.

 

[sjpt]

It's the work 'rated' that makes a bit of a nonsense of the law, but which you may fall foul of.

In many cases motors could safely generate much more than 250w continuous, and with suitable controller settings do, but if the manufacturer has rated them 250w that is OK.

However, on the other side, if a motor is rated over 250w it is outside the EAPC law, however much you change the controller or other aspects to ensure it never gives even 251w output.

Sorry that none of us has been able to help with your original question, though.

 

[Cadence]

The maximum continuous rating is determined by the manufacturer and should be marked on the motor. It isn't legal for the user to somehow "derate" a 1000w. motor and claim that it is in a "250w. road legal" mode, regardless of what speed limit or amperage is set. You might not like people telling you, but you have a 1000w. rated motor that is illegal to use on the road.

 

[saneagle]

saneagle
That`s the one I have, but if I change P6 from 99 to any other number the it does not change, stays at 24.4 MPH. not matter how many times i try.
Again i can use the thumb throttle stand at the side of the bike and i can stop the bike from moving with not much effort (not trying to pull a wheely).
I got this horrible feeling the rear motor is on its way out. But that should not make a problem to the controller. If the controller is breaking down then why can i hold the motor back. that`s why i posted on here to see if there was an easy fix or anyone else has come across the same problem.

controller and lcd are standard from cylotricity never been changed.

I have contacted them and all they said was put the old parts that I changed back on (like i kept them)
Thanks anyway

It must be 10 years since I fixed one of those bikes. IIRC, I put a new controller in one. Nobody cared about illegal bikes at that time, so it was fully de-restricted. I can't really help any further with your issue.

Police are now clamping down heavily on illegal bikes, so I'd advise everyone to make sure that their bike is legal now. The motor in yours is a big givaway. I'm sure any police out to find illegal bikes have been briefed to look for dinner plate sized motors, which is going to be tricky for you if you're stopped. To make your bike legal, you'd need a new motor wheel and a new controller. You can often find used motor wheels on Ebay for around £100 and a cheap controller is about £25 new, or nice controller is around £70. That's what I'd do if I was in your position, or maybe think about a new definite 250w bike, which is about £600 for a 36v one on Amazon or £700 for a 48v one. I'm not here to judge anyone. I just give the best advice I can. Only you know what you want to do.

An alternative would be to get a new controller that can be restricted. That can be done for around £30 to £40. You need one at least 20A for that motor. The amount of power you give any motor isn't illegal. It's the motor itself, which makes the bike de facto illegal or not, so a new controller would probably be a futile effort.

 

[Tony1951]

Again I know what the law is.
Under the guide on this page at the bottom it states in the first paragraph
electric bikes that have powered assistance to a maximum of 25 km/h (15.5 mph) using a motor of no more than 250 Watts (maximum continuous rated power)
I am trying to get it turned down so it is at 250watts now if I can turn it up or down that is not maximum continuous rated power.
but again not the point of the thread.
I have a genuine problem with my bike if i take it on the road or not.
thought i may get some help here.

The issue is the power RATED by THE MANUFACTURER when it was made and sold, not what you have done to lower its actual power output.

Your motor can never be made legal because it was rated at 1000 watts.

Sorry to disappoint.

EDIT:

If you have a driving license, you will likely collect a large number of penalty points if they decide to report the offences you commit by riding it in a public place or on roads. It is classed as a motor vehicle and subject to all the motor vehicle regulations:

Driving a motor vehicle without a licence plate.
Driving without insurance
Driving without an MOT
Driving a motor cycle without a helmet
Probably several construction and use regulations regarding brake levers, lights and other matters.

I think all or most of these probably carry three penalty points.

If you don't have a driving license, you can add:

Driving a motor vehicle without a license
Driving without L plates.

I doubt you'd think it was worth riding it if you got caught.

Like Saneagle said - they are coming down on illegal bikes now. It isn't as it was before.

 

[Sparksandbangs]

Here's the website.

Stealth 1000W 29er

Ride the Stealth 1000W 29er electric mountain bike with dual power system. Ideal for off-road adventures in the UK with bold design, speed, and trail performance.

cyclotricity.com

If you look at the pictures the motor is etched with 250W. They then add the following disclaimer that makes little sense

Disclaimer

In the spirit of responsible riding, all our bikes are restricted to 250W by default. Customers wishing to unlock the full power can do so by contacting us to obtain the de-restriction codes after reviewing the safety precautions and regulatory requirements.

They don't really seem to have a grasp of the law which is worrying.

 

[Nealh]

They may not have grasp of the law but if the motor is marked 250w , one can't argue that. It would be for plod to prove not so.

 

[saneagle]

Despite what we said, the motor is completely legal if marked 250w by the manufacturer. I didn't know that it was. Check it anyway to make sure. Without the marking, you're out.

Assuming that it is marked 250w, you can run it with any controller as long as you can fix the max speed to 15.5 mph (any LCD can do that), it doesn't have an independent throttle, and the power stops when you stop pedalling. As I said, you need 20 or 22A to stop the motor performing like a wet blanket and not have so much power that pedalling is impossible.

 

[Nealh]

The marking say's 250w restricted.
Forget the derestriction nonsense and use a std KT 9 fet 25a controller kit.

 

[saneagle]

The marking say's 250w restricted.
Forget the derestriction nonsense and use a std KT 9 fet 25a controller kit.

I'm not sure but I think Cyclotricity used KT controllers that had a special version of the software in them. It's been a long time. I think the restriction might also reduce the current to a useless level. I was going to suggest doing a reset to default parameters, which you normally do with C10. If it is a KT controller, try it, then, if necessary, increase the current back to maximum - C5=10.

 

[Sparksandbangs]

The marking say's 250w restricted.
Forget the derestriction nonsense and use a std KT 9 fet 25a controller kit.

I raise you to 12FET 30A. You'd probably need a bigger enclosure on the belly pod though. You can always turn it down. You can't turn the 25A up.