Cytronex - the first 2000 miles

eTensai

Just Joined
Sep 25, 2008
3
0
I passed 2000 miles tonight on my Cytronex so seems a good time to post a review. I started looking into e-bikes last August looking for something quite specific for my need. I wanted something purely for riding to and from work (a round trip of 20 miles), that rode and looked like a normal bike, that would get me fitter, that would give me some help to get up the hills and that would encourage me to not to use the car every day. Eventually I found Cytronex and am generally delighted with what I got.

My starting point in my research was to read the 30+ page thread started by Chris Bike. Chris gave a very honest appraisal of the bike at a time when few others had tried or owned a Cytronex. I would recommend anyone considering buying a Cytronex to search this thread out.

One of the main myths generated on this forum about the Cytronex is that you have to be fit to ride a Cytronex. When I bought the bike I was slightly overweight and walking the dog was about as far as my exercise went. I’ve ridden bikes all my life but in the last few years this has been limited to gentle 5mile rides with the kids in tow. Once I got on the bike I was amazed that I could cycle 15 miles without having to stop and could get up hills that I wouldn’t have contemplated on a normal bike. So I would say you definitely don’t need to be fit to ride a Cytronex, but because of the design it will definitely help get you fitter.

The controls on the bike are very simple to use, once you’re cycling above 5mph hit the on button on the RH bar end and depending on where you’ve left the LH button this will take you into low or high power, with high power taking you to 15mph, very easily and smoothly. I tend now to ride with the LH button always depressed for high speed, cycle to about 9 mph, hit the on button and I’m away at full speed. I rarely use the low speed function. The slightest of touches on the brakes will stop the motor. In terms of speed I average around 16mph.

In terms of the battery, a lot has been written on this forum about the design and it being for show rather than having any function. I would tend to disagree with this. I think it does serve as a functional aspect of the bike, in that it is easy to install and connect up and should I imagine save on some wiring compared to be stored behind the seat or on the rack. Conditioning the battery was easy and I think I got something like 13, 16 and then 20+ miles out of my first 3 rides. As I only use the bike for my 20 mile round trip I couldn’t say for certain how far I would get out of it. However to charge the battery it takes about an hour, so I’m sure there’s another 5-8 miles if I was cycling on similar terrain. Although I think the battery in the bottle cage is a good idea in principle I have suffered with the battery rattling around in the cage. This caused the casing to become worn. Mark at Cytronex is now using a newer design for the cage, which is far better and tighter. I’ve also added some thin padding to the bottom of the battery to stop it getting worn.

The brakes seem good, although the pads on the bike soon became worn, so had to be replaced sooner than expected. As I said above the brake control to switch off the motor is very sensitive and if the brake lever does not return fully into the housing can result in the motor not switching on when the RH button is depressed. A bit of tweaking on the brakes solves this. Bit annoying to start with, but helps to understand how the bike is set up when it does.

The lights on the bike are excellent, one button to turn on/off and the light for the computer is nice touch. I’ve added a cateye and a lenser P7 to the front and a cateye to the back for extra visibility.

The Trek 7.3fx feels like a nice bike, it suits me perfectly. The frame size is just right, I’m 5’10” and have the 20” frame. Although some others don’t like the saddle I find it fine and importantly for me I don’t suffer back ache from riding it, which I have done with other bikes.

So all in all a great buy, I should think I use the bike 90% of the time to get to work. However there have been a few problems. The first came after about three weeks when the cable to the front brake came away from the brake housing. This meant that I had to rely on the back brake to cut out the motor. How it happened I don’t know, the only thing I can think is that it got caught by another bike when parked at work. Then in November I had a fall, I didn’t think much to it at the time, but my thumb and back told me otherwise in the following weeks. The bike seemed fine and continued to work until just before Christmas when I could get no power from the motor and the lights would just flicker. I sent the battery to Mark for investigation who couldn’t find anything wrong with the battery apart from it being battered about a bit due to the looseness of the cage. So in January I took a trip down to Winchester to see about getting it fixed. To his credit Mark did a fantastic job in analysing where the problem was and getting the bike fixed. It seems like a combination of the fall and the constant pounding on some rough roads with a loose battery led to a failure in one of the connector pins. I’ve had the bike back for a few weeks now and everything is working well again. Mark’s support since I bought the bike has been excellent, always willing to answer emails or discuss problems. Just a shame the only support is in Winchester.

When I was without the battery I still continued to ride the bike to work, which of course leads to the question do I need a Cytronex or just a Trek ? Now I have the bike back I know the answer. Psychologically it’s great to have the comfort of going out on a cold, wet and windy morning knowing you’ve got some assistance at hand when needed. I was struggling to do 5 days on the bike without the battery, with it it’s no problem. Without the battery I could average around 14mph, so the battery gives me about an extra 10%, plus some extra saving in using the car less. The Cytronex has really given me the bug for cycling back again and hopefully in the Spring I can swap between the Cytronex and my road bike (or battery less Cytronex) for going to work, now I have the confidence to know I can do the journey and get over the hills.

Thanks,

Ian
 

Danny-K

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 25, 2008
281
0
South West
Many thanks for the review Ian (eTensai).

20 miles capacity seems extraordinarily good for the meagre low single figure amperage of the battery, and accords with what others have found. My thinking, (if maybe I go for a Cytronex/or maybe the kit), is for a purpose built cage in place of the current one with something like a 12 or 15amp Lipo battery pack for a full day's tour/outing. Sounds like it would exceed the long range capacity the Wisper boasts of. Unless the specially tweaked battery is giving disproportionate performance in relation to it's low amperage output.

Yep, Cytronex owners out there - more reviews please. Thank Q.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,897
30,427
Unless the specially tweaked battery is giving disproportionate performance in relation to it's low amperage output.
Mark at Cytronex has specified the NiMh cells and selected for exceptional discharge performance after trying various lithium types.

Therefore you might not get a pro rata mileage from a lithium battery.
.
 

HarryB

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jan 22, 2007
1,317
3
London
Battery range

In my original review I put in some details of the battery range - here is an update. My journey is 10 miles each way - for the type of cycling I do it won't do the return journey on one charge. The way back to work is more up hill than the way home and the only time I have tested the range I found I ran out of battery fairly early on after the 10 mile mark so for me realistically the range is about 12-15 miles max. In mitigation my journey has a lot of starts in traffic which really kills the battery and I nearly always use high power mode. One of the characteristics of the NiMH batteries is that the voltage tails off so at the end of the charge the bike will only pull about 12-13 mph under its own steam - another reason to keep it fully charged. For reference the Agattu would do this return journey but the Torq would not or should I say I wouldn't let it due to the battery problems. There has been no deterioration in range so far.
 

Danny-K

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 25, 2008
281
0
South West
Thanks Flecc & Harry.

12 to 15 miles from any e-bike is totally unsuitable for me. It would have to have a larger amperage battery (ie., Wisper territory), in addition to the OE NiMH job.

Harry - And how did you find pedalling the Cytronex without power? What's the furthest without power you've found comfortable on the Cytronex?
 

Barnowl

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 18, 2008
954
1
I totally agree about the battery ranges and can understand the variance which is down to rider effort, stop/start riding, hills, rider weight, temperature, wind etc etc etc. I get about 20 miles per charge but it has varied between 17 & 25+. The range fits my requirements perfectly. I certainly put most the effort into riding the bike but the battery always supports me when it counts. I don't thinks this is a bike for someone who wants to use it like a motorbike and not bother with the pedals.

The Cytronex is certainly no moped but I took the old Galaxy tourer out a couple of weeks ago and compared to the Cytronex it was very hard work. It really felt much better when I got back on the Cytronex.

I followed much the same route to the Cytronex as you Ian. I'm the same height and also settled for the 20" frame which I find a perfect fit. Overall I've been pretty much delighted.
 

Barnowl

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 18, 2008
954
1
Danny

Riding the bike is very Ok without power. Depends what the terrain is obviously but not much different to any Hybrid/trail/fitness bike. Put the extra weight of the electrics in a backpack, imagine that, and that sums it up. The basic bike is never going to be as fast as a good road bike which is probably about 20% faster but you get the advantage of comfort, safety and a better ride off road.


PS. Unasisted it's still way faster than any unasisted mountain bike on the road though. I believe this is mostly down to the rolling resistance of the tyres. The Cytronex Trek has 700 X 32 tyres. Thinner tyres would improve performance but reduce comfort. I would say that for the average commuter this bike will probably handle 9 miles (round trip 18 miles with no problem). I do that regularly at weekends on a reasonably hilly route and I only got caught out once about a mile from home. It really was no issue.
 
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HarryB

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jan 22, 2007
1,317
3
London
Danny

Riding the bike is very Ok without power. Depends what the terrain is obviously but not much different to any Hybrid/trail/fitness Bike. Put the extra weight of the electrics in a backpack, imagine that and that sums it up. The basic bike is never going to be as fast as a road bike which is probably about 20% faster.

Way faster than any unasisted mountain bike on the road though
I agree with this. When I first tested the Cytronex I rode it around without the battery to see if it really felt like a normal bike. It really does, compared to a Torq and is certainly a lot lighter than the Agattu - neither of which I would like to cycle unassisted for very long.

I cycled in most of the way into work when the battery failed to charge a month or so ago. I probably did about 8 miles and it wasn't too bad but I certainly prefer it with power. I am sure you would get a much better range if you only used it for the hills. I am not that worried about the range as I charge at work so I think I squander the power a bit.
 

Danny-K

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 25, 2008
281
0
South West
Thanks for the replies lads. Good stuff.

"Unasisted it's still way faster than any unasisted mountain bike on the road though."

And -

"When I first tested the Cytronex I rode it around without the battery to see if it really felt like a normal bike. It really does,"

Now that's what I call an e-bike!!!!!!

Hey, what's that sound?!? I can hear music!
Ahhh . . .that's music to my ears, that is.

Remind me: how does that advert go again?
. . . Someday all e-bikes will be built this way.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
52,897
30,427
Danny, I well remember your reports on riding the Salisbury and the high average speeds and good range you got, and from that it's clear that you are a fairly strong rider. Accordingly I think that after conditioning the Cytronex battery with a couple of uses you'd probably quite easily get the target 20 mile range and possibly a bit more, so long as your riding conditions were not like Hal's.

His use commuting in traffic with use of high power mode and regular stops with acceleration back to speed is bound to produce a shorter range than normal.
.
 

Barnowl

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 18, 2008
954
1
Hey, what's that sound?!? I can hear music!
Ahhh . . .that's music to my ears, that is.

Remind me: how does that advert go again?
. . . Someday all e-bikes will be built this way.
Music to my ears Danny. I'd been looking at e-bikes, off and on, for about 6 yrs. Fits me like a glove (just read one of your old posts on pedalers thread). Actually the motor itself is very quiet. Good luck with your next bike whatever you choose.:)
 

Mark/Cytronex

Pedelecer
May 22, 2008
88
3
Winchester
www.no-hills.com
Repeat of post on Harry's reveiw

Just thought I would repeat my post on Harry's thread bellow because it is also relevent to some of Ian's points.

Additionally, regarding Danny's point about capacity, Cytronex is designed to have a small light battery (2.1Kg) because most journeys are under 20 miles. For those who need more you can of course take a second battery and double your range. But the AtoB reveiw did show the advantage of light weight in speed and efficiency so why sacrifice this for shorter journeys?

His is a repeat of my post on Harry's thread:

"I haven’t had a chance to post on the forum for some time as we have been working very hard on the 2009 Cytronex system. However I think it is important to answer some of the technical questions raised here.

We launched Cytronex last year with just 100 bikes produced for test marketing. The reason for this was two fold: 1. To see how the system would be received in the market, 2. To test reliability of the design and components, and to ascertain what modifications would be necessary before producing on a larger scale.

I am very glad to say that we are now totally convinced of the concept’s appeal and I apologise to all those who have been waiting for some time for our 2009 system to be released. However I am sure you will find it has been worth the wait.

The 2008 Cytronex certainly had the aesthetics I wanted to achieve but each bike was very labour intensive and impossible for a layman to build themselves without a week’s training! The task I set us was to achieve the same level of aesthetics in an easy fit kit that could power a wide variety of bikes. Along the way we have addressed many of the issues raised by Harry here.

So in answer to some of Harry’s points:

1.Battery rattling – your battery should not rattle and after I saw the very extreme example in Ian’s case I meant to do a general email in case there are who are putting up with this. The problem is caused if the battery is pulled out inadvertently at sufficient angle to bend the cage. Ian was obviously a lot more tolerant than me and put up with the noise but in fact it can be very easily solved. Just carefully but firmly grip the extended cradle part of the cage and push it back in towards the down tube until it just starts to bend back a little. Then try the battery again and repeat until tight. Your battery should not rattle at all! It is in fact the rattling the causes the wear marks on the casing. There is very little wear on well used bikes that have tight fitting bottle cages. We are now using a stronger cage but this is only because Trek discontinued the previous one and we had to find another supplier. The old type is on my existing bike which is approaching 3,000 miles without a problem.
2.The brake switches have worked well but we are currently testing a new type which should be more or less bomb proof as well as easy to fit. Harry has mentioned an issue with the existing switches that we have found on two other bikes which have been used throughout the winter. The extreme amount of salt and grit on the roads this winter can make V brakes seize up. Once this happens there is no spring in the brake levers and the controller thinks that the brakes are permanently on. A bit of cleaning, oiling the pivot points and then moving them backwards and forwards will soon free them up again.
3.The scuffing on the fork can be resolved with a cable tie to hold the cable in position at the top of the fork.
4.If your paintwork is looking a bit jaded with all the salt on the roads a clean and wax polish may bring back the shine. Unfortunately salt attacks just about everything and I have seen the evidence on several other brands of bike recently. My own bike has faired rather better but then I use mainly country roads to work and they are rarely salted.
5.Interesting what you say about the buttons being the other way round Harry. We put it on the right because it is the most frequently used button, but I take your point. The 2009 system gets round this because we have some very nice new components which put the buttons right by your thumbs instead of in the bar ends. Therefore you don’t have to move your hand to press the boost button.
6.Harry’s point about modification is also a good one. You can’t change much on the bars with the 2008 Cytronex because wires run though to the bar ends and the brake sensors are installed in the brake lever casing. This is changing in the 2009 Cytronex, with the buttons by your thumbs and the brake sensor in a different position it will be straight forward to replace any components on the handlebar, or the handlebar itself. If you have a look at the kit when it comes out Harry I am sure we could modify yours in the same way if you wish.
7. Just one further tip - every 1,000 miles or so I recommend a deep discharge to optimise the battery capacity and power. To do this use your bike until the power expires then place the front wheel on a stand so that the wheel is free to spin. Then set it on low speed and press the boost button and leave it running until it stops. Don't do this immediately after recharge or it will take all day to stop. Then leave it half an hour before switching on again, once again leaving it until the motor cuts out. Obviously don't leave it running like this if there are children or animals arround. Finally leave the battery an hour or so before fully recharging. This should boost the battery capacity and power."

Regards,

Mark