Dillenger 1000W, 48V 10Ah, Rear wheel kit /build thread.

[Will]

I decided to go for one of those Dillenger rear wheel kits and the kit arrived today (a little slower to arrive than I expected, 3 days)

Picked up a cheapo bike locally for a tenner , bought a new pedal and crank for it at the local shop because it needed them, then went about installing the wheel. Thought I better put up a thread today while it is fresh in my mind. The bike is a steel frame which I figured was better for mounting the wheel (the frame can easily be stretched wider to the 140mm required )

I got the local bike shop to undo the gear cassette from my old wheel as a special tool is required. I installed the plastic protector disc off the old wheel but later discovered this was a mistake as the Dillenger wheel doesn't like it and it causes the freewheel to stick on.

Fitted my tyre and tube and also used the rim tape off my old wheel as although there are no spoke heads in contact with the tube on the new wheel, the access holes have quite rough edges.

Wheel went in okay after widening the mount area with a scissor jack.

The LCD and throttle went on fine, but the pedal sensor didn't seem to want to fit this bike, so I left it off.

The battery rack would not fit my seat post, my post is too narrow for it, I did a workaround by cutting a strip of steel and coiling it round the seatpost to make up the gap. It is not perfect and I plan on making a better adapter.


Couldn't find a decent space for the charge controller bag (which is a rather disappointing generic bike bag) So currently bungeed onto the battery . I charged the battery but after half an hour or so it said it was full so I assume they sent it fully charged.

 

[Will]

The electrical connections seem of high quality. We fired this thing up in no time. First impressions are: Bike is very unweidly, very back heavy. Takes a lot of effort to pedal due to both the extra weight (approx 18kg I believe) but there is noticable drag from the motor which I was surprised about.

Power is just about right. Its not going to reverse the rotation of the earth when you crank the thottle open but its enough to haul my fat 16 stone ass to 23 mph on the flat (motor only) .

When you pedal this bike, the side to side motion sets up a pendulum effect with the battery where it is, and it just highlights how unstable the machine is with no weight on the front . Will investigate alternative mounting place for battery nearer the front to improve handling. The battery has small Anderson type connector plugs so making an extension cable ought to be easy.

The gearing of this bike even in top gear is quite low, making it rather difficult to add any speed to the motor only top speed. Larger crank sprocket would definately help here.

The rear wheel creaks a lot. The spokes seem quite strained where they pass over each other and this may have something to do with all the creaking noises. None seem loose but I will ask Dillenger if they think I should tighten them. I had considered putting something like a slither of rubber in the place where the spokes cross.

I tried the bike on some hills on the farm tracks around here and it is a lovely feeling being almost silently whisked up the hill at 14 or so MPH.

I might change the bike for one with space in the middle frame triangle for the battery. I wanted the full suspension as I figured safer at speed, and I live down a bumpy track and figured the electrical components would get quite a beating on a no suspension bike, particuarly the back, with all the weight there, I'd be worried about overloading the rear wheel or shocking the battery mount and fracturing it, or damaging the controller unit.

Maybe it won't be an issue with some of the weight put at the front.
I'd have been tempted to get a front wheel kit but they were out of stock.

I will try to get a few more pics and update any improvements I make and also give a range test report.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

That looks like an aluminium seat-post rack. They normally break after some time due to metal fatigue when you put a heavy battery on them. You need to brace it with a couple of struts to stop it from going up and down. Fit a clamp to the lower part of the seat tube; get some 12 or 25mm aluminium tube from Wickes; cut to length; bash the ends flat; bolt it between the rack and clamp.

Alternatively, you can get a seatpost rack with a steel beam, which won't suffer from metal fatigue.

 

[Will]

Yes that post rack came in the kit. There were some braces suppled but they would only work on a fixed rear end bike.

 

[atheo]

Yes that post rack came in the kit. There were some braces suppled but they would only work on a fixed rear end bike.

I also have just fitted one of these rear wheel motors to a lightweight bike!

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I also have just fitted one of these rear wheel motors to a lightweight bike!

Please tell us about it.

 

[atheo]

The kit arrived after 3 days,and before I went and bought a suitable bike to fit to,I thought I would trial the kit on a spare all aluminium framed 700c hybrid bike I had doing nothing.All has gone well,filed out rear drop-outs and fitted torque brackets to both sides.The battery on a carrier rack seems a bit rear heavy, but as its only a trial of the kit,I`ll live with it for the moment.I now need to put some miles on the clock to see how far the battery will take me.

 

[Kinninvie]

Your bike is similar to mine and if you look at my pic the controller bag fits on the top tube under the seat nose and the RPAS sensor is then the correct length to reach the crank.
My bike is well balanced with the front wheel kit and as you say its a bit of a pain to pedal without power.
My seat post was like yours but removing the clamp(with a grinder as it was welded on) allows you to fit the rack clamp to the frame tube which is the right size for the rack clamp,this also has the benefit of lowering the battery a bit .

The spokes on my wheel were like yours and they need tightening up,3 of mine were completely loose and the nipples could be turned by hand after 100 miles use!
Tightening them stopped the creaking completely.

I have bought a chainwheel with 48/38/28 teeth to up the gearing a bit but have not got it fitted yet.

 

[Kinninvie]

Do your brakes work ok at speed?

 

[atheo]

I have rim brakes on mine (no placings for hydraulic on this frame) and as long as I don`t go too fast ie above 20 mph, they stop me confidently!

 

[Kinninvie]

Mine had mechanical discs on but they were completely hopeless to the point where I was putting my foot down to stop!

I got a pair of Clark Exo Skeletal hydraulic brakes for under £40 and can now lock both wheels no problem.

 

[Will]

Well a little update, I was actually able to use one of the stays to beef up the rear rack. it JUST fitted round the seat tube and it has made the rack much firmer.


Bike still a handful when getting on and off, IE when you lie it over to get on, the front wheel leaps up in the air due to the heavy high battery. Tightened spokes . Took for nice ride including a long hill.

Quite pleased with the performance. Been using mostly electric not much pedalling to give me a 'worst case scenario' on the range. Started to cut out under load at about 13 miles . Lasts a couple more miles if gentle on the power and pedal a bit. Total time 66 minutes. I'm glad it doesn't just shut off and stay off like my cordless drill does!



I still don't have the pedal sensor installed because the gap between my frame and the crank isn't quite wide enough for the magnet wheel to fit. Removing the crank and grinding the back of it down might help.

So on throttle only, it is a little strange because it seems to regulate the bike according to speed, rather than power. What I mean is, if you hold the throttle at a point that gives you 10mph, if you start pedalling, rather than it making the bike speed up, it reduces the motor assistance. So you end up having to synchronise the throttle movement precisely with your pedal effort. Too much throttle, it goes faster than you want and your pedalling does nothing, too little throttle and your pedalling does most of the work and the motor is doing almost nothing as it is waiting for the speed to fall down to the prescribed figure set by your throttle. The assistance setting on the LCD seems to do nothing so that must only be for the pedal movement sensor.

Overall fairly pleased at choosing this kit, glad I didn't go for anything lower powered or smaller battery as I wouldn't want anything less. This setup will get me around locally with ease.

In other news, I picked up a better bike at my local bike shop that a customer had traded in as it needed a lot of work to the rear end, IE axle etc , its a hard tail ali frame bike. Some say not ideal for Ewheel but I might try it. It has cable disc brakes and as a massive bonus, some Schwalbe road pattern puncture resistant tyres with plenty of life left. Couldn't really say no for ten pounds!

I think I have the electric biking bug!

 

[Sam458]

Nice work Will! I have purchased the same exact kit and looking forward to getting it underway! Your solution for using one of the stays on a dual suspension bike is quite crafty - awesome work!

 

[Deleted member 4366]

So on throttle only, it is a little strange because it seems to regulate the bike according to speed, rather than power. What I mean is, if you hold the throttle at a point that gives you 10mph, if you start pedalling, rather than it making the bike speed up, it reduces the motor assistance. So you end up having to synchronise the throttle movement precisely with your pedal effort. Too much throttle, it goes faster than you want and your pedalling does nothing, too little throttle and your pedalling does most of the work and the motor is doing almost nothing as it is waiting for the speed to fall down to the prescribed figure set by your throttle. The assistance setting on the LCD seems to do nothing so that must only be for the pedal movement sensor.

All throttles work like that. They set a speed target for the controller, and the algorithms in the controller's software decide how to adjust the power to achieve the target. The PAS levels on your display are equivalent to fixed throttle positions, but they're only activated from the pedal sensor. You should be able to fit the pedal sensor on the left side of the bike. You can thin it down a bit, and you can even grind a couple of mm of the inside face of the crank arm. When you fit the sensor on that side, you need a locking ring to hold it in place, and the magnet disc has to be mounted upside down with the arrow pointing the opposite way to pedal rotation.:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/REPLACEMENT-24-TPI-BOTTOM-BRACKET-LOCK-RING-IN-SILVER-/271206943287?pt=UK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item3f25318a37

 

[Kinninvie]

You should be able to fit the pedal sensor on the left side of the bike. You can thin it down a bit, and you can even grind a couple of mm of the inside face of the crank arm. When you fit the sensor on that side, you need a locking ring to hold it in place, and the magnet disc has to be mounted upside down with the arrow pointing the opposite way to pedal rotation.:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/REPLACEMENT-24-TPI-BOTTOM-BRACKET-LOCK-RING-IN-SILVER-/271206943287?pt=UK_sportsleisure_cycling_bikeparts_SR&hash=item3f25318a37

On the Dillenger kit the PAS is meant to be fitted on the left so the magnet disc goes in the direction of the arrows.
The sensor just sticks to the downtube and works fine with a gap of up to 5mm(well mine did till it packed up!!).

 

[Will]

yes my problems is the magnet disc does not fit in the tiny gap between the pedal crank arm and the frame. Quite like the idea of a torque sensor, (replacement pedal shaft thing) I have seen torque sensors for sale on a website (BMS?) unsure if compatible with the rest of my kit though.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

If there's not enough gap, get a longer bottom bracket for £10 from Halfords. The torque sensors need a special controller.

 

[Kinninvie]

A full month after reporting my pedelec failure to Dillenger and they have still not sorted anything.
If this is the level of their customer service then people should think twice about which kit to buy over here.
Trading Standards have advised me to give them another 7 days then if its not sorted the kits going back for a refund.
Shame as it worked well for the first couple of weeks.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Now that you know how to do it, you can make your own kit. A 500W BPM front motor will give similar performance for a lot less weight.

 

[Kinninvie]

Awww,you read my mind
I have just bought a 750 watt BBS002 as well to see if it can manage the steepest hill here which the dillenger cant manage(well,not with the assist available from me at present).