Pity the proposal doesn't include an increase in speed, as a limit of 20mph would be somewhat more sensible, as discussed earlier. The 500W power rating would make a big difference to people in hilly areas though.
Etra
- Thread starter Bigbee
- Start date
As I said before, it would make sense to increase the max. speed for the lowest moped specification to 32 Km/h. Was this discussed?
Why do categories 2 and 3 each use different criteria for defining the power of the motor? Is that intentional?
Also, the question of helmets needs attention - this is a UK issue, though....
Why do categories 2 and 3 each use different criteria for defining the power of the motor? Is that intentional?
Also, the question of helmets needs attention - this is a UK issue, though....
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I am a bit confused about the speed issue. They seem to be asking for 15mph or 30 mph rather than the optimum speed of 20 mph. Personally 30 mph feels too fast, particularly in town. With the inevitable widespread introduction of 20 mph zones in towns, 20 make sense. If you want speed, get something designed for it like a moped - electric or otherwise.
I agree, 30mph would be too fast for what, even with the battery & motor, is still a comparatively lightweight vehicle. At 30, it could be all too tempting to go into corners too fast and end up losing grip with the enevitable consequences. On my Wisper, in the dry, I can happily take corners at 17/18mph with confidence, and so a top speed of 20 would present no danger.
Bike Europe today confirms that the Las Vegas meeting recommendation for 32 kph has been dropped by ETRA. Here's the extract giving the reason, which is what have always felt is the EU position on higher speeds:
With a view to reaching an agreement on such a proposal, LEVA has called a meeting of industry concerned on Friday 25 September in Las Vegas, whilst ETRA called a meeting in Brussels yesterday. The industry in Las Vegas voted for an increase in power from 250 to 500 W and an increase in maximum unassisted speed from 25 to 32 km/h. After a lengthy and detailed discussion, the industry at the Brussels meeting voted for the option to focus on an increase of power only. Since the current speed limit for low performance mopeds is 25 km/h, the Commission could be reluctant to allow a higher speed for electric bikes.
The 500 watt ambition I hope will go through eventually, since it will at last make an e-bike a real option for the partially disabled, rather than the too limited one it is at present.
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Thanks for the info, flecc.
Just in case I wasn't clear, I was suggesting a speed increase to 32 kph for the Low Powered Moped category and not for EAPCs.
This would give a slightly more logical spread - especially if the 500 Watt amendment is accepted...
Just in case I wasn't clear, I was suggesting a speed increase to 32 kph for the Low Powered Moped category and not for EAPCs.
This would give a slightly more logical spread - especially if the 500 Watt amendment is accepted...
It certainly would seem more logical Miles, a nice even progression of powers and speeds.
But of course there's still the high speed class that's only in Germany at the moment, 40 kph with 250 watts until recently but now with 500 watts permitted since May 2009, first appearing in Riese and Muller's new BionX bike within that class.
If adopted elsewhere in Europe, that would make things rather messy again.
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But of course there's still the high speed class that's only in Germany at the moment, 40 kph with 250 watts until recently but now with 500 watts permitted since May 2009, first appearing in Riese and Muller's new BionX bike within that class.
If adopted elsewhere in Europe, that would make things rather messy again.
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Raising the limit to 30kph
The subject of speed and power pretty well dominated the meeting with the vote actually being taken twice.
The first vote was 8/7 in favour of a higher limit but changed to 6/9 against in the second after the chair added some salient points.
It was felt that raising the limit to 30kph would actually offer very little advantage. At the moment as we all know the limit is 25kph or 15.5mph. What I didn't realise until the meeting was there is a 10% allowance on that figure so, in fact, as long as the bike is limited accurately to 27.5 or just over 17mph it is still within the new EN guidelines. The meeting felt that if we asked for an extra 2.5kph (1.5 mph) the 30kph limit would be the maximum without the 10% leeway and not worth pushing for.
It was also felt that a 500W motor limit was a far more important issue and we didn't want to queer our pitch by asking for more speed as well (at the moment).
The question of throttle or no throttle was raised, Mark from UM and I were obviously pushing for the throttle to be reinstated. We were overwhelmingly out voted. The meeting heard there had been a lobby from motor cycle manufacturers to ensure all electric bikes go through type approval, they argued that EAB's were simply light weight motorbikes. It was felt that by restricting the use of the throttle and ensuring pedals were used for propulsion there was no fear of the motor bike lobby ever winning their argument.
The throttle therefore will also be absent on the high speed category 45kph and 1kW as the meeting did not think it was in the market's interest for light weight EAB's to have to follow the same guidelines as for a motor bike or scooter.
Reluctantly Mark and I agreed with the consensus.
All the best David
The subject of speed and power pretty well dominated the meeting with the vote actually being taken twice.
The first vote was 8/7 in favour of a higher limit but changed to 6/9 against in the second after the chair added some salient points.
It was felt that raising the limit to 30kph would actually offer very little advantage. At the moment as we all know the limit is 25kph or 15.5mph. What I didn't realise until the meeting was there is a 10% allowance on that figure so, in fact, as long as the bike is limited accurately to 27.5 or just over 17mph it is still within the new EN guidelines. The meeting felt that if we asked for an extra 2.5kph (1.5 mph) the 30kph limit would be the maximum without the 10% leeway and not worth pushing for.
It was also felt that a 500W motor limit was a far more important issue and we didn't want to queer our pitch by asking for more speed as well (at the moment).
The question of throttle or no throttle was raised, Mark from UM and I were obviously pushing for the throttle to be reinstated. We were overwhelmingly out voted. The meeting heard there had been a lobby from motor cycle manufacturers to ensure all electric bikes go through type approval, they argued that EAB's were simply light weight motorbikes. It was felt that by restricting the use of the throttle and ensuring pedals were used for propulsion there was no fear of the motor bike lobby ever winning their argument.
The throttle therefore will also be absent on the high speed category 45kph and 1kW as the meeting did not think it was in the market's interest for light weight EAB's to have to follow the same guidelines as for a motor bike or scooter.
Reluctantly Mark and I agreed with the consensus.
All the best David
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